Looking for view on DS's uni shortlist for English Lit

[Revengeofthepangolins]

Would love to hear any observations that anyone has picked up from their offspring about DS2's short list for his English Lit application this term. He's looking at Durham, UCL, Oxford (maybe), Edinburgh, Warwick, Kings and Exeter. Keen to hear about the course, (teaching, support, module choice, community etc) life at these unis generally for humanities students, perception of offer rates, (all the usual really!) but also whether anyone has a sense of whether they offer good support for SEN/ autism. I was wondering whether Exeter has a history of being flexible about missed grades (other than this year), as the problem with this line up is that it is nearly all AAA (his predictions are 3Astars, but as this summer has underlined, there's many a slip between etc). Warwick shows an alternative of AstarAB which might be helpful if that is a standard offer, but perhaps it isn't.

Basically, any feedback appreciated!

My DD held an offer of AAA from Warwick for Eng lit, and on attending the offer holder day it was made clear to her that AAB would be acceptable. So there may well be leeway for a good candidate (she had strong Eng at GCSE and a great PS FWIW (possibly not much in terms of the PS)).

She (and I) both loved the HoD tho she may not still be HoD obvs. The course structure appealed as well and she loved the campus.

Sadly she didn;t make the grades so no direct experience. No knowledge on any of the others you mention either, sorry.

I don't know much about English Lit degrees but re life, there is obviously a big difference between campus / small city life at Exeter and living in / commuting into central London. I think most people do have a preference for one or the other, so that would be worth investigating if you haven't already.

Where are you based - does he have a maximum distance from home in mind?

Are finances a consideration? Accommodation in London is much more expensive than Coventry, for example.

I think he'd be very unlucky if Exeter rejected him for a dropped grade or two, they seem to be pretty flexible most years. That's the one I'd bet on, of the unis on your list.

If he does prefer a campus you might also consider York, Lancaster and Birmingham, I think they all have good reputations for English.

From my DD I have picked up that any degree in a literature-related subject at Oxford will involve a seriously long reading list! I know all the universities on your list are good ones, but when DD and her university friends compare workloads with students doing similar degrees at other universities, it does appear that Oxford and Cambridge are in a league of their own for workload as far as degrees in arts subjects are concerned, even after allowing for the fact that terms are shorter.

Agree with a PP - before you start looking at SEN support or grade flexibility, try to encourage DS to get a feel for whether he'd prefer campus, city or collegiate as a university. Those you have listed are all very different. And distance from home is a key consideration as well.

Based on the experiences of my DS and several of his friends (all on the autistic spectrum though not studying English) my advice would be to focus on campus, smaller city or lower key collegiate unis. They just seem to be rather more welcoming and supportive for students who are neurodiverse. So from your list I'd definitely encourage your DS to investigate Exeter and Warwick, and add York, Birmingham, Lancaster, Sheffield, Bath to the list. We know neurodiverse DC who are very happy and settled (and well supported) at all of these.

I would approach Oxbridge, Durham or any London uni with caution - not saying disregard completely but for a DC with autism I would be very wary.

My ds is at Exeter, doing STEM subjects not humanities, and apart from some hiccups setting up DSA mentoring, overall, it's pretty good for disabled/autistic students. We went to an autistic students day which was really good, plus there was an extra induction day for (I assume) all students registered with the disability team. Information provided is very clear, which helps a lot!

I can’t comment on English degree, but Durham is very good for SEN/Autism. It’s collegiate so you get additional pastoral support (college tutor). Students live in college 1st and final year, but disabled students can remain in college for all 3 years (avoids stress of having to find housemates/deal with all those issues). Very small (although a city it’s smaller than a lot of towns). There are college groups and uni groups so easy to find your tribe (and easy to get to events).

Not really any observations but DD will also be applying for English Lit for 2024. Her list is similar and will be applying to Cambridge, Durham and Exeter for certain and then needs to decide 2 more from Warwick, York and Lancaster. She is predicted 2xAstar and 1A with an A or higher in her EPQ. Entry requirements for the above range from Astar AA, AAA and AAB.

Has your DS been to any open days? DD has found them really useful and you definitely get a feel for whether it’s your place or not.

Another thing to think about is that for many universities a prediction of three A stars at A level will pretty much guarantee an offer, but that's not at all the case for Oxford. Will your DS be able to cope if he gets a rejection, bearing in mind that a rejection could come after interview and therefore feel quite personal? I'm no expert on autism, but I understand that it can sometimes be associated with a perfectionist streak which leads people to take any perceived "failure" particularly hard.

Bath doesn't offer English Literature.

I think the biggest issue is the choice of course
humanities grads have a low rate of high earning grads
great if you want to be a teacher of course
I love reading but I decided it was not a worthwhile degree and something I do for pleasure

One of my students just secured his insurance place at Warwick with ABC actual grades.

I think that shortlist is too intense. They could wait around for aaaaages after applying and get flat out rejections form at least 5 of those, even with amazing grades (past MN threads are telling here). I'd be tempted to look at York, which is at least as good (better than a couple) and doesn't play silly buggers with applicants. That sounds like a list of prestige unis, rather than a list of best unis for English, in all honesty...

Then looking a notch down (entry requirements, not quality of degree) you have Lancaster, Birmingham which are both excellent and worth a look.

Why do people always come on to these threads and make these irrelevant and hurtful statements? You can set your clock to it. It's clearly what the child wants to study. Not everyone is motivated by mega earnings. Besides which , plenty of English grads are high earners - the data show averages. Lots of top flight lawyers, and broadsheet journalists have English degrees, or similar.

On a side note, it's no wonder there are huge recruitment issues in teaching in science and maths in particular , since these YPs and their parents seem to think their degrees automatically deserve - and should only ever lead to - huge financial reward.

I don't know specifically about English but Warwick was rubbish for sen support (3 years ago) when 3 separate friends kids dropped out due to issues, 2 pre covid (they don't know each other either, I know them from different places) these were all stem students though.

I would suggest he looks at at a couple of lower tariff universities too just in case

I would recommend really looking at the modules on offer, and assessment methods. They vary enormously for English Literature and might help guide decisions.

DD did this journey recently to study English Lit, predicted three A stars and A star in EPQ, got two A stars and A and we don’t know EPQ result yet but think it is A star. She applied to Cambridge, Durham, UCL, York, Leicester.

Durham had the same offer as her Cambridge one so couldn’t be used as insurance. Also she was concerned at the low contact hours, only 5 hours a week, at Durham. She really liked the course at Leicester with its flexibility even though not RG. She ended up putting York as insurance. She did get offers from all 5 but do think about spread of grades for the insurance and the modules offered, especially the compulsory ones as they do vary a lot.

@Richmondgal that is very much not true in the real world. Humanities grads often have the edge in critical thinking, problem-solving and dealing with ambiguity; all of which are incredibly useful across a wide range of industries.

@Revengeofthepangolins I did English Lit after being convinced by by my English teacher (was going to do Law) and LOVED it - your son will have an amazing time. Oxbridge have more of an idiosyncratic take on English, which is worth considering eg Cambridge looks at different periods, so you’ll be doing eg Renaissance poetry in one term and Middle English in another. Much smaller class sizes there - supervisions 1-2-1 or 1-2-2 at most, plus classes of around 8. It’s (obviously) intense, but if you enjoy the subject (as I did), you can thrive on the intensity, bouncing ideas off people, learning to argue your position etc. equally, if you are a perfectionist, the intensity can work in the opposite way and undermine your confidence; it very much depends on personality.

I seem to remember Edinburgh had an additional linguistics component to their Lit course, which didn’t interest me at all, so I ended up not applying.

OP didn't mention anything about her ds wanting to be high earning. And a lot of graduates schemes take eng lit/ humanities students just as much as say maths students.

I LOVED my lit degree and I am a far higher earner than either of my siblings (STEM subjects from good unis). The world NEEDS humanities graduates and English Lit covers a good section of many disciplines!

I am doing my PhD through the Shakespeare Institute at Birmingham and really rate them as well (though as a distance learner). I echo what others are saying - look carefully at course modules, especially compulsory ones. I spent a LOT of time translating old English in my first year...

Hearing good things about Sussex as well, especially if more.modern texts are your thing...

Why would that be the case? Surely an English lit degree from any of the unis mentioned would be excellent for law, accountancy, consultancy, media, policy, etc

Have you had a look at York? - several of DD's friends are there studying English Lit - lots of small seminars.

Also have had two cousins do Masters in English Lit there after O/C and both rated it very highly.

Exactly. Most grad schemes just ask for any degree (and the kind of university OP's son is looking at will be preferred).

OP I went to Bristol and their support for my autism and BPD was brilliant. It's also a really great city! Also I did a humanities degree and converted to being a lawyer on a very high salary so the previous poster is talking rubbish! Your son sounds like a high achiever so I'm sure he'll do well wherever he goes.

I can't comment on the course at all but can tell you on a recent offer holders day for Exeter, the two undergrads doing the tour said neither of them had met their grades, and one of the guys on the tour with us already had his results and had been let in with one fewer A than predicted. (And I got in to Exeter back in the dark ages of pre A star A levels, having been predicted 3 As, but getting ACC - so I think there is flexibility, yes!!

I love reading but I decided it was not a worthwhile degree and something I do for pleasure

🤦‍♀️

It's a shame you didn't research Eng Lit degrees properly before writing them off as just "reading" and not worthwhile. What a stupid and sneery post, I hate that kind of snobbery towards humanities - and teaching.

Do check the syllabus very carefully to make sure the chosen place has modules he is interested in.

Humanities subjects are about analysis and critical thinking - key Future Skills. I work for one of the firms grads climb over each other to get into and both of those will see you a long way up the career ladder.

Not much to add other than to echo the sensible advice on thinking about settings. My child with ASD has been very happy at Lancaster (although not studying English) as the campus is very manageable and the city a decent size. York I would imagine feeling similar. On the other hand, if you don’t live in London already, I can imagine it feeling way too much. Certainly my child found it like that even though they grew up there.