What is the No1 economics course in the UK? (In terms of academic rigour and graduate prospects)

[eggsbenedict23]

DS is in year 12 and last month attended the LSE open day. He liked the place and the department seemed nice. He told me (and showed me the talk recordings) that one of the professors giving the talk was saying they are a "top tier research university" etc. DS told me the professor briefly mentioned something along the lines of "we write the textbooks the second tier universities use". Apparently the professor mentioned Oxford and Cambridge as being 2nd tier.

To me it seemed as if the professor is arrogant.

As said upthread, there will be some areas where the LSE has particular strengths. Finance, where LSE has a dedicated degree, is almost certainly one. Econometrics is probably another. It could also be true of whatever field the Professor specialises in.

Given the size of the department and the number of options available to third years, some of which will also be available to Masters students, this adds up to a strong department. However there will be areas where other Universities are strong, and in terms of overall UG experience other Universities that will suit a particular DC better.

Cambridge is the most fantastic city to be a young undergraduate. Far nicer than London IMO, although obviously London better when you are working.

LSE for undergraduate economics has similar type of undergraduate degree to many of the Imperial STEM degrees. Rigorous with challenging, fast paced delivered content without the added support (but also work) that the Oxbridge tutorial system delivers. It appears that some LSE students pay for extra tutoring to help get them through the course.
IMO many if not most LSE undergraduates only care about the research conducted there in relation to the strength of the LSE brand for their financial career. They might not admit that though.

I certaninly agree with spirit in terms of undergraduate experience - Oxbridge nicer than London but obviously both are great for economics and future careers so do what the 18 year old wants to do. I think the university experience is completely different (and better for a teenager) outside London.

Searched the professor up. He does macroeconomics and monetary policy.

eggsbenedict23 - she went to Cambridge which had always been 'the dream' really since visiting and going punting on a beautiful sunny day at the age of 16. We live in London so she wanted a change. She also had the sense that Cambridge and the college experience would be more social. It's just very easy to find people. Every college has its own bar, library, rowing team, choir, history etc and it's just a unique experience. She feels very lucky because all these unis are something of a lottery in terms of admissions. Anything can happen really.

What LSE do also, is some subjects keep students hanging until April / May so a lot of the accommodation is gone by then. Having said this, if Cambridge hadn't have come through, she would have gone to LSE probably and been very happy there.

Really it depends what kind of experience they want. Also, if they have gone through the whole rigmarole of Oxbridge admissions, it's going to a lot harder to turn down because of the extra effort required and they inevitably become more invested at every stage. It's very different to unis where there is no interview / admissions tests because then it's just ping off the PS and be done with it until they hear back.

DS plans to prep for the entrance test for Cambridge economics in the summer. I believe it's the TMUA now. He has no idea about college choice.

@spir1t what subject did your DD study? Was it also economics?

One of DS' LSE referees when applying to the US post Masters was a professor in macroeconomics and monetary. DS was interviewed for research assistant posts at a couple of very top departments, and indeed landed one, though preferring to take up the offer of a fully funded PhD place. (Quite a hard decision as the academic who offered him the job is very well regarded and is doing some interesting work.)

During both interviews, his referee was mentioned using his first name and was clearly known and well thought of. If it were the same person that gave the presentation when your son visited, there is some justification to the confidence.

An earlier post of yours may give some clue to the LSE attitude. People in the UK can be very Oxbridge obsessed. When I would say that DS was going to the LSE other English parents came close to commiserating. A place at LSE implied a rejection from Cambridge. European and American parents, in contrast, appeared to see the LSE as at least the equivalent to Oxbridge. It is quite possible the Professor is over-egging it a bit to cause potential students to be aware that an LSE degree is "just as good" and perhaps warn them that entry is just as tricky.

The LSE has a particular problem with admissions. They are on a small site in central London and have less ability to go over numbers than perhaps some campus Universities. Many of their economics applicants will also be applying to Cambridge, so will get their UCAS applications in in October. However non Oxbridge applicants do not need to apply until the January UCAS deadline. The LSE is required to treat all applicants equally, so they cant really start their selection process until January, and things only become clear around March when those with Cambridge offers start firming those and letting any LSE place or pending application go. Even then there will be a few who do not intend to firm LSE (and with the grade requirements LSE does not make for a good insurance choice) who still hang on to find out if they were in fact offered a place. As a result it can be May before people hear. Hopefully now the Brexit/Covid chaos is over, high demand Universities like the LSE will be able to forecast acceptance rates more accurately and so be able to make quicker decisions.

At LSE, the accommodation was Bankside (?) - behind the Tate Modern in Southbank. That one gets booked quickly though. Then, there were other smaller halls which seemed nearer to UCL. Some are also intercollegiate, so obviously you could be with people from UCL or any other London uni. In the second year, I got the impression that quite a few who live in London move home?

No not Economics OP. I doubt she would have got in for that! But her then boyfriend applied for Economics with perfect GCSEs and A-levels and was rejected from Cambridge and LSE. The LSE rejection was past their so-called 'deadline' in May. So they took 8 months to reject him. He took a gap year and reapplied - got Cambridge offer in the Jan and didn't bother waiting for LSE after that because the offer was unconditional (post A-level). The friends who had been made LSE offers went elsewhere (but this was for History and Geography and maybe Anthropology - I think they went to Durham or St Andrews in the end because they wanted a non-London experience). One friend who had an LSE Economics offer missed the grades in the end, but did retakes for that A-level. Not sure what happened. The other one went to the US (but they were American).

@spir1t what did your DD's then boyfriend do in his gap year? (Outside of UCAS)

Yep, LSE most respected in the country.

Why over Cambridge would you say? I should have prefaced by saying I meant the undergraduate degree

@eggsbenedict23 does it really matter which is "better" - LSE or Cambridge? They're both internationally recognised as leading universities.

We are extraordinarily lucky in the UK that our best universities (best and "2nd tier" ) are excellent, and recognised internationally as such. Whichever your DC applies to & whichever actually offer a place, your child will have the opportunity of learning from some of the world's best.

I think you (or is it your DC?) need to get over the perception of one academic's "arrogance". It's far too emotive a response on which to base an important decision. That professor is only one member of staff among several thousands, from cleaners, to porters, to department administrators, to tutors, and even professors.

@DollyParkin thanks for your comment. Will stop worrying.

Strongly agree with @DollyParkin ’s last comment

@eggsbenedict23 it sounds as though you have a clever, hard-working DC who is likely to have excellent opportunities to do well. University is an opportunity to learn from the best. Your DC will just have to rise to that opportunity!

I think we underestimate how lucky we are in the UK. - despite chronic underfunding and low-level abuse of academics (“Who listens to experts?”) places in the UK HE system is in high demand and one of our best international exports. UK citizens are lucky to have easy access to it.

Coming back to this thread as DS is over and has given me more background. OP gave me the name of the academic, and DS confirms that in that particular area of economics the guy really is one of the top two or three academics working in the UK, with a very impressive CV. Any apparent arrogance can be excused.

DS also confirms that there is probably frustration on LSE's part that the strength of the department, with a viable claim to being the strongest in the UK, is not translating in terms of UK undergraduate applications, perhaps leading them to sound their own trumpet at an open day. Cambridge will still get the pick of the precocious high flyers, though things change for post grad. His statement has presumably led OP and her son to reconsider their views on the relative strengths of both institutions. He also suggests that from observation, a student aiming for prestigious consultancy firms like McKinsey might do better going to Cambridge. The name carries weight in some sectors.

@Needmoresleep thanks for the reply

I am certainly not an economics expert as my children that did it didn't continue it beyond A level, but I always say work back at least in part from thej obs you want to have so do a Google search for the compan concerned and newly hired graduates and look at their linked in profiles. I woulod imagine LSE and Cambridge are pretty neck and neck so I would then go for which is the nicer student experience - pretty awful hot messy noisy London where I live or gorgeous Cambridge colleges with boating on the river, chapel choirs and all the rest.

Then do as was suggested up the thread - apply for all the good places and be glad to get even just one offer as economics is very competitive.

@Xenia DS enjoyed the lse open day and found the lse new curriculum more intellectually stimulating.

Interesting what you say re LSE v Cambridge

went to LSE and most of my peers are really the crème de la creme of city jobs 15 years on - MDs in banks, partners in consultancies/other firms, entrepreneurs making millions and making it on the front pages of magazines/newspapers

I can’t see LSE being detrimental to anyone wanting to work in economics/finance/law/city

LSE is anyone’s equal. Then again, so is Cambridge Economics. Good students from both programmes and others will have ample opportunities to thrive.

The actual content of OP’s original question was interesting. But it isn’t a good strategy for any applicant to believe that their success in life hinges on admission to a certain university. It really does not. As we recall all the stories of applicants with four A star predictions getting offers from zero or one of the top Economics programmes in the UK, this is just as well.

An Cam Econ degree will have no material advantage over an LSE Econ. Worldwide, Cam has more recognition but any major (and competitive) employer will be very much used to the LSE brand name. LSE Econ grads snap up top jobs in finance/consulting etc a lot.