Thoughts and experiences on Music degrees at Universities

[Aktea]

DD, awaiting GCSE results, is strongly considering a Music degree. There are a lot of choices and having looked at modules offered it would appear Uni's vary greatly in the kind of degree and experience you get. She is a better academic than performer and so we assume Uni a better choice than Conservatoire? She particularly enjoys composition. She doesn't really know what she wants to do afterwards.

Oh I'm interested in any responses to this as well. DS wanting to do music. He's a smart kid but has had his head turned by the local college offering music A level then 2 further A level equivalent qualifications in music production and performance. I'm so worried it will reduce his choice of uni. The other 6th form college option would be 3 straight A levels - music tech and music a level plus another.
He also likes composition as well. The courses all look so different and so many different unis too.

She sounds like people I know who took Music as a first degree at university and then moved on to postgraduate Composition at a conservatoire.

I very much agree that university would be better for finding her feet if she’s less keen on performing herself. The important thing would be to choose a place with a really strong commitment to / tradition of musical performance amongst students - good orchestras, choirs, organists, and tutors whose current work she really admires. She should ignore any music course happening in a musical desert.

NB - she might be wise to seek out places with strong female representation amongst the tutors / lecturers. (That is, practising composers, instrumentalists, singers.) It is still the case that female musicians and composers can be sidelined by the male academic hierarchy - which means less encouragement to develop as professionals, and fewer, less prestigious opportunities to have work performed. Thoughtful mentorship at this stage can make the difference between continuing into a successful music career and giving up music completely - so it could be more important than choice of topics and modules.

My son did a degree in music. It just became clearer as time went on that was where his passion was, and he went on to do a masters in composition. He got it out of his system, so to speak, but still composes as a hobby and did a short course in film composition recently so the interest is still there, but his view now is the reality is making a living as a composer takes a lot of time and luck and many years of perseverance - only a very few make it.

That said, I think initially the university open days gave him a really good feel for what was on offer at different universities and how his interests might be developed and he never once regretted his choice.

He moved away from playing and performing as time went on as he loved composition.

He didn't have a clue about what he might do after but has been working in music publishing since he graduated. He also did quite a lot of private teaching as a student and while he was job hunting which helped him out financially.

the reality is making a living as a composer takes a lot of time and luck and many years of perseverance

This is true - but there’s such a wide variety of work that composers can engage in - particularly in this digital age. Every single second of entertainment needs music - from video games to the Commonwealth Games to Netflix, not to speak of every start-up wanting to advertise. As far as I can see there’s currently an insatiable hunger for new compositions, and new composers, in and out of concert halls. (And they all teach - all through their lives into old age.)

It is really interesting to hear what people actually end up doing...we assume that most people won't be performers or composers or sound recordists or academics or music therapists etc etc etc (amazing range of things and I know there are lots more). But yes, had also taken on board the need for lots of commercial and non-commercial music to be composed by.....someone!

Literally, the points about female academics are not something I had thought about, useful, if depressing. We had had some idea about looking at the course in context of what might be available around it, I guess that is another thing to throw into the mix. DD pretty set on a reasonable sized city for personal reasons, which might hopefully help rather than hinder, although it's obviously not that simple.

@Aktea Have PM’d you. (After several false starts, for which I apologise. Lord knows what MNHQ are doing with PMs atm. They used to work …)

DS1 has just graduated from Royal Welsh (conservatoire). He has turned down places at RAM and RCM for postgrad and is instead doing a year at National Opera Studio (which is funded). His career intention is to become a repetiteur.
DS2 starts at Oxford reading music (with an organ scholarship) in October. He'd like to end up in composition, but obviously he's at a much earlier stage than DS1.
You are absolutely correct that the conservatoire degree is focused massively on performance, so the academic degree sounds a better bet for your DD.
One hint - if she hasn't already, I'd strongly recommend your daughter does the ABRSM theory grades to grade 8 before going to Uni.

Impressed they’ve taken him straight from a first degree, Grumpyoldperson. People tend to arrive there after a conservatoire postgrad. He must be amazingly talented!

Thank you. He was aware that the more normal route for NOS is after postgrad & he knows how fortunate he's been.

I know a couple of people who took music degrees. The first one then went on to study medicine and is now a doctor. The second one has ended up with RSI in her wrist (she plays violin) and achieved a first for composition and a 2.1 for her recital because of all the painkillers she was on. She has also had to forego a European tour with a local orchestra because she isn't allowed to play for a month.

Sorry, this wasn't what you wanted to hear.

But I’m guessing the other members of the orchestra (who presumably would also be in possession of Music degrees) did manage to go on tour? Along with the thousands of other instrumentalists playing across countless festivals this Summer.

And Music to Medicine doesn’t seem a bad outcome?

What was the point you intended to make, RampantIvy?

We know two people who read music at Bristol where my sons were. One is a lawyer. I am not sure about the other- on a gap year I think. My children's father did the PGCE after his BMus and his FRCO (organist) and has done a mixture of those over the years - head of department music, organist etc

This might be entirely unsuitable for your DD, but there are also specialised, more vocational, degrees in music for video games, etc. Just adding to the options!

I did a music degree at Oxford about 10 years ago (doubt it's changed much). It was a completely academic course (lots of options for performance/composition, but none compulsory). Instead we wrote two essays a week, which was the same as English/History/other humanities students, just obviously on different topics.

Since leaving, the people on my course seem to have split fairly evenly into two camps: those who pursued music further at conservatoires, as composers, or as academics, and those who didn't and went on to get "normal" jobs (several did law conversion). I have a bog-standard corporate job, and on the whole I've found employers to be absolutely fine with my degree, especially as it's clear from my CV that it was an academic rather than practical course. Plenty of people have been surprised that a music degree can be more than just playing an instrument, but this has almost always been in social settings rather than professional.

My degree is in Music. It was entirely academic - due to tendonitis I couldn't have done any instrumental performing in my final year anyway. I started off in accountancy then saw the light and have been teaching Music for the last nearly 30 years.

I echo @Grumpyoldpersonwithcats suggestion of Theory grade 8. We put all our A level musicians through it and I have been told by admissions officers that it is a more reliable guide to a student's ability in traditional skills than A level (this was before the reformed qualifications). Lots of institutions will lower offers based on success at grade 8 Theory.

University courses tend to be more broad based than conservatoires and there's more scope to change your mind or take joint honours with a university.

@Aktea take a look at these courses:
courses.hud.ac.uk/2020-21/full-time/undergraduate/00008241
www.trinitylaban.ac.uk/music-department/composition/
www.bristol.ac.uk/study/undergraduate/2022/innovation/marts-music-with-innovation/
royalholloway.ac.uk/studying-here/undergraduate/music/music-and-sound-design-for-film-television-and-interactive-media/
www.rcs.ac.uk/courses/bmus-composition/
www.leedsconservatoire.ac.uk/courses/undergraduate-study/undergraduate-courses/ba-hons-music-film-music/
www.qub.ac.uk/courses/undergraduate/music-sound-design-ba-w371/
www.york.ac.uk/study/undergraduate/courses/ba-music-sound-recording/#entry
www.bathspa.ac.uk/courses/ug-cmt-games-and-interactive-media/

All very different courses and institutions.

I was surprised to see even RAM and RCM had composition courses in clearing this year.

I wouldn’t honestly advise a more specialist music related degree for someone who isn’t sure what they’ll eventually want to do. As MarisPiper92 has indicated, a good general academic music degree leaves one with a broad range of options in and out of music.

(And from observation I’d definitely say composition is a practice best pursued once one has gained a tiny bit of maturity and at least first degree level academic knowledge of music / theory.)

Definitely university,then on to a conservatoire later on if desired.

I went to the RAM (I’m a performer and didn’t consider Uni though lots of my colleagues did).

I think I’d struggle with grade 5 theory these days let alone grade 8 ( I am 45 if that makes it excusable 🤣)

Thank you, this is all helpful.
She would benefit from doing some wide-ranging modules to start with to try out new areas and have suspicions of what she might like best confirmed or overturned. Part of the appeal of Music as a discipline is what a range of subjects and approaches it covers.
Regarding Theory - she's done no exams at all. Where would one even start? She has G8 on her instrument, and obviously the GCSE content.

@Aktea maybe she could try a summer school next year:

www.gsmd.ac.uk/study-with-guildhall/short-courses-summer-schools/find-short-course-or-summer-school/composition
soundandmusic.org/opportunity/sound-and-music-summer-school-2022/

She clearly loves music and is very skilled so it sounds like a good option. If she’s not quite sure, I would advise just trying to get into the best university possible. That way, she’ll have more options in the future if she does change her mind. I know people who are studying music at Durham and York who are really enjoying it.

Also she might want to look into the extra curricular activities like orchestras, quartets, choirs and whether they go on tours/ do interesting performances. Music degrees vary so much in their content, but again, since she’s undecided I’d go with courses that have lots of flexibility and choice when it comes to modules.

Re theory, I thought you had to do G5 theory in order to do Gs 6/7/8 on a instrument? Either way I'd certainly recommend she do Grade 5; she shouldn't find it too challenging but from memory the content is a bit more technical than the GCSE. It will also look good if she decides to apply for Music at university. I think you can buy materials on the ABRSM site:
gb.abrsm.org/en/our-exams/music-theory-exams/music-theory-grade-5/

I think that the G5 Theory requirement only applies to some of the music exam boards! When my DS (who plays two instruments) moved on to G6 with LCM his teacher didn't mention theory, but he had to do it for his G6 with ABRSM. It was a pretty technical exam, certainly not easy, but worthwhile for musicians.

Composition seems very important, a thriving music community and resources will help foster this if required. Dd wanted an academic degree with a good community and opportunities for internships etc. It was a minefield starting out but she is a vocalist and really into her musicology /sociology, so was easier to narrow down from there.

Considered, Newcastle, Durham, Manchester, York, Sheffield,Nottingham, Birmingham (then decided didn't want to be far from home 🙄)
Bristol, Cardiff, Southampton (her firm) Surrey, Sussex, Royal Holloway.

Most of those seemed to have very supportive music communities and wide ranging modules. I was disappointed she wouldn't consider Bristol as I was told it has such a nice, tight knit community. Cardiff seemed great, she loved Sussex too although I wasn't sure on the community aspect there . Royal Holloway has specialism in Ethnomusicology. She wasn't impressed by Surrey at all it seemed facilities were lacking for students not doing Tonmeister course apparently..or she got that impression.

Can't say much about Oxbridge, apart from the reading list from Cambridge really helpful (Nicholas Cook's book is great) Reading and writing about Music will be required. Lots of good podcasts about too. I tried to get her to do the theory at grade 8 but wasn't having any of it.

I'm not musically inclined so was a bit clueless in helping her. Luckily she has excellent Music Teachers for A level and a mentor through her singing teacher who helped her prepare for auditions etc (Cardiff and Southampton both has auditions, great opportunityto visit).

Ah yes Dd did ABRSM G5 theory but the Trinity route for performance exams so it wasn't required to get to higher levels. Recommend at least Grade 5 level keyboard skils (poss higher for composers?). Extracurriculars included usual music activities plus short courses (we did look at one Guildhall one then Covid). Some local authorities do production sessions on stuff like Digital native worth looking out for. If into /exploring Jazz can also recommend National Youth Jazz Collective. Have heard Jazz helps with theory and composition but as I say I'm a bit clueless really.