Quantitive Methods BA/BSc

[Ryesmile]

My DD is considering a joint honours e.g. QM + Politics or International Relations - does anyone have experience of these degrees and how employable you would be afterwards? She doesn't have a clear idea of what she might want to do.

She has very good GSCE grades and predicated A/A for A Level Maths, FM, Economics, History. Hopefully likely to get offers from good universities. Any thoughts/recommendations about courses would be really useful. She's good at maths but not a 'natural' and unfortunately has been put off economics due to not enjoying A level. Enjoys History, which is the most likely A.

Please excuse the bold -
predicted As and A star
Most likely A star is for History

Most people I know with those types of degrees work for the public sector or charities. One young man I know with a masters in Public Policy constructs questionnaires. Somewhat dead end and it took him a year to get the job after countless rejections. He’s RG educated and masters was from a European university. He really struggled to get any job at all after having high hopes. Not all grads have issues like this of course and the Maths element might well help but it might be a bit niche?

If it’s of any interest, I would look closely at the Management degrees at the University of Bath. These seem to be excellent for securing a very good job afterwards. I’m not sure what university she was looking at but with her likely grades I would definitely look at Bath.

She could also consider Law. Or History. Both can lead to very good employment prospects from a top university. However if she wants a maths element then Bath and their courses is a good place to start looking.

DD just finishing 2nd year of social policy and quants at Edinburgh. Loving it.

Adding quants has been shown improve employment options.

www.nuffieldfoundation.org/publications/q-step-evaluation.

DD accepts that jobs will be civil service, charity or academia and thus not well paid. She is ambitious in wanting to do something worthwhile but not money motivated (did investment banking work experience between school and hated it).

Her course encourages a placement. Her plan A is to try for civil service fast track.

DD also not a natural at maths but Edinburgh has given a lot of support (they run a preliminary maths for social science course). She's not afraid of maths and has actually really improved her maths.

Getting placements can be very difficult. Lots of places encourage them but actually getting one can be hard.

I have attached the recruitment data for civil service fast stream. It’s pretty grim reading regarding success rate. Sorry it didn’t all fit on my phone camera regarding departments. Obviously some crack it but the overwhelming majority don’t. Interestingly the two we know who did, both offer additional languages.

DD is a planner so has countless backup plans and is not fixated on fast stream. She will apply for all the government year long paid placements next year. If not successful will apply for the 8 week paid summer placements and will widen to charities/think tanks. Her uni guarantee a summer project so she will have something with real world data which should help her at job interviews (and keep her away from talking about the political protests she has been part of).

She's doing well on her course so academia might be an option as well. If I had to bet on where she will end up it would be academia.

Thanks SandyIrvine and Tizerorfizz! Your really useful positive/negative comments exactly mirror the debate that I've been having about this subject, but so interesting to hear actual experiences. I have looked at the Q-step information and know the civil service fast track is highly competitive. I don't think my DD has got as far as thinking about post-graduate and that's part of the problem. I'd still be interested to hear of more under-graduate or post-graduate experiences if there are any out there!

My DD did a BSc in Sociology (inc quantitative methods) and then an MSc in Public Policy (also inc quantitative methods) - would she consider that? @Ryesmile

Civil Service Fast Stream is extremely competitive, and the recruitment process is gruelling, like many Grad Training Scheme application/assessment processes.

There is also a National Graduate Development Programme for local authorities - similar to the CS, but working with real problems and real people and strategies that get implemented! Also worth looking into @SandyIrvine

@bigTillyMint Thank you. The Local Authority programme looks right up DDs Street. I will forward to her.

@SandyIrvine, feel free to ask more about it if she is interested. Work experience in a charity or shadowing someone in a LA, plus voluntary work whilst at uni would also good for her CV.

@Ryesmile
I didn’t mean to be quite so negative. The DS I mentioned upthread did an internship with his local LA. Both parents work there.

Being very honest: where does she want to do the degree? Even the charities jobs are competitive. They don’t pay a lot and sadly a masters won’t open as many doors as you think it might. She has a great set of A level predictions. I really would aim high for a degree. Some are far more valuable than others.

However it’s folly to think that work after a degree doesn’t matter when choosing the degree. In my view. Isn’t that why you do it? To enable you to get a better job with better prospects? I’ve just been posting about graduate salaries on another thread and been told off by another poster because I thought £20k was a low starting salary for a grad. Apparently, so I’m told, it’s quite normal for RG grads. I must live in another world but my LA doesn’t pay that low for grad intake. I’m not saying don’t go for civil service or lecturing but choose a degree with her eyes open.

My DS applied for Quants degrees.

Aim for a uni which is a Q Step centre - Bristol, Sheffield, Glasgow, Edinburgh, plus some others. They specialise in this.

As said above, adding the quants adds definite strengths to the skillset. They really do train you in the methods.

Despite what you said about economics the other course that might appeal is Policy, Politics and economics at Birmingham. This adds in the highly employable economics without being a whole degree in it.

Just saw the news, civil service faststream is paused for the moment. Does anyone know whether the paid Social Reseaech placements for sandwich students are also paused.
Asking for DD who was planning to apply in September.

Where did you see that sandy?

BBC News - Civil service pauses fast-track graduate scheme to cut staff numbers
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-61641930

Yes, just found it on Twitter : tis is not good news. Is plan of DS1 , about to embark on a public policy MA - and eventual plan of DS2.

DD is saying there are some non fast track schemes but not clear whether they are paused as well. Wish they had cut back on the spad budget not the graduate recruitment.

Who pays for the SPADs? Are they civil service? I think their numbers are tiny compared to the general civil service numbers.

I don’t think not recruiting is anything new. I think they have done it before. They will need to absorb all those covid employees first and I suspect make redundancies. Most employers would pause recruitment in the circumstances but it’s hugely disappointing.

Yes, recruitment freezes come and go all the time in CS. Generally followed by mad bursts of hiring. DH joined on an EO scheme and got to G7 in two years, so other routes can lead to success.

I think SPADs are paid from government funds rather than political party funds. Agree not many of them but their wage bill approx £12m would fund a decent number of graduate jobs.

Quants with a humanities/social science is also highly desirable for management consultancy. It demonstrates an an ability to use both quant and qual methodologies so that could be another route.

Management consultancy is Plan C on DDs list. She did a McKinsey internship last year and enjoyed it. However she would prefer to work in public service (Plan A) or academia (Plan B). Plan D is to sell her sole to US big tech like DS2.

What about commercial market research like opinion polling or similar? Like for YouGov or Ipsos? https://www.ipsos.com/en-uk/graduates or something like this ? https://hassonassociates.com/jobs/research-audience-measurement-analyst/?back=%2Fsearchresults%2F%3Fsearchquery%3DAnalyst%2520%26taxxindustries%26metajobbtype%26metajobbdayrateefrom%26metajobbsalaryfrom%26wpassid%3Dmy-search-form%26wpas_submit%3D1

DS has no plans beyond civil service. Capitalism and corporate life is not his thing but we'll see! Sports data possibly!