Experiences of LSE, Kings, UCL

[Waythroughwoods]

DD (L6) interested in applying for a Humanities subject to LSE/Kings/UCL. She is attracted to London for the subject choice, reputation, possible exchange programmes & buzz. It’s at an early stage and she will go to Open Days etc but it’s hard to distinguish between them and to know what the student experience at each will actually be like. She is academically very strong and extremely sociable. Any insights would be appreciated.

All brilliant reasons for being in London. LSE and UCL generally rank above Kings. The other factor is living arrangements for second year onwards. Due to rent prices. many students live quite a way out from uni. DSis and a very good friend went to UCL and living quite some distance away was the norm even then. Therefore students need to make good friends in year 1 to move into a house in the second year and have the same budgets. Obviously travel is quick but your other friends might be on a totally different tube line. Just something to think about. Places like Bristol have umpteen student houses within 15 mins walk of the uni. I would rank Bristol and a few others above Kings.

Son at UCL first year is having more fun than can be readily imagined. How much work is going on, I don’t know ….

I have studied at UCL and KCL and personally found they have quite different cultures. KCL was set up as a Christian alternative to UCL and it still maintains quite a strong religious tradition in some respects, e.g. there are lots of opportunities for worship and religious study outside of your course of study. Now of course you can totally ignore all that but I found it attracted a more conservative/establishment student population overall. Again I'm talking very broadly but I reckon if you were very liberal, lefty, counter culture punk type you'd feel more at home at UCL and if you're a more home counties traditionalist you'd be happier at KCL. Before I get jumped on I know I am using very broad brush strokes and anyone could thrive at either, just offering my experience. Don't know LSE at all.

@Llamapolice
That’s a bit narrow I think. No one I know that’s gone to Kings is remotely religious. Nor “alternative” at UCL. Both have all sorts of DC there. You pick your tribe.

LSE probably has more international students and maybe a more study hard serious vibe?

They are all fine choices. LSE is absolutely tops in quantitative Social Sciences, I don’t know about Humanities. UCL has a strong rep in Humanities. Generally I think of LSE and UCL as stronger overall than Kings, but Kings is a fine university.

You said DD is attracted by the curricula, location and exchange programmes. I totally get the appeal of London! Amongst world class universities that is a valid criterion for choosing.

But I am sort of curious: UG Humanities is very broadly defined - do these three unis really have curricular features not shared elsewhere? (Apparently LSE, a top uni worldwide in Econ, does have a unique features in that curriculum.) Also many unis throughout the U.K. have excellent exchange programmes.

All very helpful, thank you.
@TizerorFizz - you hit on my two main niggles as a mum: 1) how spread out accommodation is & how this impacts on making friends, hanging out etc. 2) whether the significant international student component makes it a more serious study environment/less sociable. DD is a study-hard/play-hard girl but the playing is very important!!
Would be interesting to hear more experiences of these aspects.
Revengeofthepangolins - lovely to hear your DS is having a ball!
Llamapolice - that’s interesting. On that basis DD would definitely be looking for a more UCL crowd 😂
Poetryandwine - yes agreed. DD is attracted to the bright lights big city atm & has found some interesting subject combinations. I don’t think she has started drilling down into courses at other unis yet.

Youngest is a final year student at UCL. In halls for first year then shared house in Camden in 2nd year and now in a flat in Kentish Town for third year. There seems to be plenty of opportunity to socialise and play sport etc and he spends a lot of time in uni as well. Only large lectures are online and he doesn’t have that many on his course.
He wanted to be in London and has remained there through most of the pandemic. London is expensive which ever of the three you choose though.

Ex husband went to Kings. DS is at UCL. Friend's son is at LSE. I mean, you can't go wrong with any of those schools, to be honest. However, in my honest opinion, UCL is just brilliant. DS is having a blast AND working his arse off (you can achieve AND have a great time). UCL's location is amazing! If your DD likes the bright lights, big city, it will not disappoint. There is such a buzz around the uni and it's in such a safe and beautiful part of London. Camden is right up the road as well, which is where everyone wants to be. And you have glorious Regents Park!
From what I can gather the students generally study harder than they play but they do play hard too. Of course there are those who divebomb into the party scene, never to come up for air. But mostly, it seems to be a really good balance of work harder/play well (not too hard but have fun). DS's accommodation is right next to the uni: Schafer House. He loves it. He can totally switch off from socialising and just work hard or chill alone without any pressure. But there's always something to do and people to go out with when he plugs back into playing hard.

@Waythroughwoods

DD (L6) interested in applying for a Humanities subject to LSE/Kings/UCL. She is attracted to London for the subject choice, reputation, possible exchange programmes & buzz. It’s at an early stage and she will go to Open Days etc but it’s hard to distinguish between them and to know what the student experience at each will actually be like. She is academically very strong and extremely sociable. Any insights would be appreciated.

My DS1 went to UCL.

He was a decent student.

Socially, he played football for a UCL team, which he enjoyed with both matches and training. He did pub quizzes which supplemented his income. He also engaged in a UCL union activity of getting to know London, so visited lots of museums and attractions.

@Waythroughwoods
The accommodation for first years is available for all three. So finding friends should not be too difficult. Some halls share with other unis though. Some halls are private and can be very expensive so have a good look at web sites.

As I said, second year needs a bit of planning and sometimes a dose of realism if pockets are not deep enough. There are course members who might be on your wave length. However money really does come into play in London. As you can imagine rents near any of these unis is top $. So what do you do if you cannot afford what your friends can? I would guess that LSE is more international and few of them will be on their uppers, so to speak. Plenty of accommodation is geared towards these students.

My DD1 looked at a UCL course and discovered 75% were international. Due to the nature of the course that didn’t appeal, but others will relish the mix. DD1 was keen on the social side of uni too!

I’m not trying to put you/her off and her reasons for wanting London are valid. Everything you could possibly want is there. Night tube and night buses mean transport is available and Uber is used by students sharing. However other cities are vibrant in their different ways. Nottingham, Bristol, Newcastle are very sought after by social types. So she should perhaps look a bit wider and see what they offer.

So have 2 dc in London (in 2 of the above unis).
Both love it. Yes, it is a bit of a track in 2nd and 3rd year. I can't remember whether it was a 20 or 40 min bike ride. But "whole street" is full of students and lots of socialising going on (DC only came home for 1 week in the summer holidays).
Other DC loves the international student population. Although LSE is supposed to be hard work, it's all stuff she likes doing. Weird clubs with a link to her course she is doing.

I don't know what humanity your dc is interested in but there is a bit of a difference. King's College is famous for War Studies. LSE history only cover recent history. UCL has lots of "weird" combinations" etc etc.

My DS really having a great time in London(LSE) -clubbing,comedy clubs-walking distance to Camden,Soho,Convent garden.Living his best life.!He regular meets his friends from UCL,Imperial and Kings.
He’s enjoying halls and has met some lovely students.Last term he did work hard too but this term has found the right balance.

Tiger, which is your DC at, as I am not sure I recognise your problem. If you don’t have a DC there, I think you need to be careful about repeating old saws as if they were truths. You regularly post quite negatively about London. Fine if it is genuine experience, but otherwise it’s odd. From what I recall your DD2 studied fashion in London at a non RG, about a decade ago and lived way out and was quite unhappy. But that experience does not necessarily predict the experience of someone starting UCL now. I also fail to underwhy your DD1 would see international students on an MFL course as a negative. Does MFL suggest an interest in communicating with non English speaking people. FWIW, both my DC considered the diversity of London universities as one of the strengths, not least a good preparation for an international career.

DS was at LSE but 3 or so years ago. Guaranteed first year in halls, which may be intercollegiate ones, but none too far away. It used to be that UCL also guaranteed places, but Kings did not, so worth checking.

DS then shared an ex council flat near Great Ormond Street. Quite cramped as they used the living room as a bedroom but really central. No more expensive than, say, Bristol. The good thing about London, or at least LSE is that the campus/SU/library is open late so tends to be the social focus point.

I also went to LSE and we were determined to look down on Strand Poly (KCL) However it is fine and has some strong departments. Do look at War Studies. LSE seems to be able to find numbers in anything, so check course content if you don’t like maths. UCL has the advantage of a wider range of subjects, even more if you add the Slade and Rada. It also offers a terrific range of years abroad, and it’s Liberal Arts degrees are worth a look if your DC is undecided.

Not Tiger but Tizer….

I was not negative. I thought I clearly advocated the advantages. There are some negatives and it’s ridiculous to suggest the OP is stupid to be concerned.

Was your degree in rudeness? (or Superiority?) I’m sure alumni of KCL might think it was both.

No, just a question. When DS was applying all those years ago, and had I not known about LSE I would have been put off by your ‘negatives’. It is odd. I am a London landlord and only wish I got the sort of rents you talk about.

You seem to know a lot about London Universities and about all sorts of degree subjects including economics, law, stem, and more, but you never give the source of your experience. It might just be idle chatter at a Surrey golf club. From what I recall your DD1 paid a lot when working as a successful lawyer and living in a swanky riverside apartment, but student London is different, and a lot cheaper.

My DD was at Imperial and though she lived at home her friends seemed to do fine, renting in cheaper areas, but still able to easily accessible to University and social life. London has good public transport and is becoming increasingly cycle friendly. London also has an amazing amount of free or cheap stuff going on. Meals in China Town, last minute theatre tickets, and and and.

Dd is in UCL but not doing humanities. She absolutely loves the university and being in London.
I agree with the pp that so much socialising goes on at UCL, I do wonder when she actually studies. They do seem to work hard and play hard.
Dd stayed at Connaught hall in her first year and is currently sharing a flat with friends doing humanities. They all seem to be enjoying their time at UCL.

A couple of people have mentioned War Studies at KCL. DS did that, having turned down LSE. It’s a world leading department. He thoroughly enjoyed it - made lots of international (and UK) friends and played a lot of sport.

I've got to say I saw @TizerorFizz's posts as being balanced rather than negative – cost and distance of accommodation can be issues in London, there's no doubt about that. They don't have to be, but it's worth bearing them in mind.

@Waythroughwoods my DD sounds just like yours, other than being a scientist – partied hard and represented her university at sport but still got a good degree (not in London). She then did her Masters in London last year, at a specialist university affiliated to UCL, and loved it. The international cohort she studied with was very much part of the appeal, as a generalisation she would say the Chinese students were maybe primarily focused on the work, but the other Europeans and South Africans were very much keen to make English friends and to experience everything London has to offer.

thing47, yes but it is possible to live quite cheaply and still have a good time. Not least these Universities have bursary schemes for those in most need, and are which are well worth asking about. And some international students are especially thrifty. It is not unknown to have "family scholarships" where extended family club together to send a child overseas. I would not underestimate how insecure parts of the Chinese diaspora feel, and how important a foothold in the West becomes. Even more so with a friend of DS' who was born in Dubai to South Asian parents, and has no right of residence anywhere. He ended up going the long way round when heading for the US for his PhD as his UK student visa ended the day before his US one started. DS had a lot of Asian friends. Some were rich, others not so. All worked hard. Just like his UK friends.

Yes social life in London is different. But in our experience more varied. DD has spent time at both Imperial and Bristol and found the former friendlier, more supportive and more inclusive, but then I suspect MN would not define her as a "social type". I also disagree with the idea that KCL is ranked less highly than Bristol. Yes it is marginally lower than Bristol on the Complete University Guide but above Bristol on every metric bar student satisfaction.

I would also support the idea that KCL always had a strong reputation in theology. Not sure about it nowadays, but assume it still has.

I'm not a fan of university league tables, I think they're much too 'broad brush'. Metrics like 'entry standards' tell you what 18-year-olds got in their A levels, they don't tell you very much about the quality of a course or indeed the teaching or supervision on it, much less what a 21 or 22-year-old graduate can or can't do. 'Research quality' was hugely important to my DD when she was looking at Masters courses – for a teenage undergraduate? Not so much, imo.

And they can also hide pockets of excellence (and possibly the opposite!) within universities whose overall ranking might not be that high. Universities which have an excellent reputation for a particular field and which are highly valued by employers in that field, but may not be on people's radar.

Rant over . Yes I agree with you re. being able to have a good time cheaply in London. I can't comment on Bristol, I have no knowledge of the university other than to say DC's friends who went there seemed to enjoy it, and obviously it has a great reputation academically.

Thanks so much everyone for taking the time to post and for your very helpful feedback.
It sounds as if DD is onto something with her interest in these unis! I passed on the experiences shared here and she is planning to take a trip to the area with a friend in half term.
Instinctively UCL is probably the best match for subjects and experience but at this early stage nothing is ruled out.
@needmoresleep DD is strong in Maths with 9s in Maths & Further Maths GCSE and is doing Maths A Level but I wonder whether not having Further Maths A Level will rule her out of the LSE courses that include Economics, eg PPE / Phil & Econ?

My only knowledge is a talk to Alumni given by a previous LSE Director just before they launched the PPE degree. I picked up the impression that part of the logic was to provide something that was easier for UK students to access. Part of the problem with Economics at the time was that they essentially were looking for AS or A level FM as a fourth subject, something available in many international and UK private schools but less available in UK state schools.

There was also a concern that economics was in danger of becoming a branch of maths, and to some extent a vocational degree preparing people for International Banking. (Another innovation was to launch a new stand alone Finance degree which gave more choice to the would be bankers.)

(I paraphrase a lot.)

If I am right, your daughter should be fine, as long as she gets the A* in maths. The PPE degree sounds great for someone who is capable in both maths and humanities. Though entry will be very competitive. Employers like people who can both crunch the numbers and write the report. (DH studied PPE at Oxford whilst DS graduated in Econometrics at LSE, so there is some family debate about the relative merits of literacy and numeracy!)

LSE is 75% postgrad with a very large international student population so different to most other RG unis. It has until recently always scored poorly in the NSS (survey of 3rd year UGs) for student experience. However a degree from there is a brilliant way of getting a job in the City, if that is what they are after. It also has more of a study hard than a play hard culture. I'd go for UCL as an undergrad. I have worked for both!

I think a closer look at various courses is important. The course that DC is doing at LSE isn't available at UCL (at least not the combination of subjects she wanted)