Oxbridge Aspirants 2022...Part 2...applications submitted now the tense wait!

[TangoWhiskyAlphaTango]

Thought I would start a new thread as part one is nearly full and found thread one to be of great support.

So its deadline week this week for our applicants then the nervous wait begins to find out of they have made it to interview. DD applying for HSPS at Cambridge. We know it is a long shot but got to be in it to win it and she is very keen to try. Looking at the admissions info it does not look as though she will need to sit a test prior but all the best to those who will have to.

But how would you know all those things ??

I think the people least likely to be able to 'play the system' (speech marks used because not the right term and not meant to be offensive) are, ironically, those state school students.

Pooled applicants will always be “squeezed out” of certain colleges because they are not usually fishers from the pool. Hoping to bag, say, Kings College, from the pool is not very realistic. You will be looking at Murray Edwards et al. And actually as they are usually more state-schooly they won’t be thinking they have to up their state-school quota.

Independent applicants being 'squeezed' out is a total misnomer, in my view. 6% of pupils attend private school UK wide, yet Oxbridge colleges have between 75- 15% of their cohort drawn from these schools. Even if each college made their 85% state school target, that's still 9% more than total equity.

I personally don't like to hear the 'My DC is disadvantaged because they're from an independent'. After all, the applicants all need to be equally well qualified. In fact, my pupil applying this year from my inner-city comprehensive with 65% of pupils receiving free school meals (her included in this) has had to work far, far harder than any independent applicant. In fact, she's also had to work far harder than my own son,who's state school educated but has had the advantages of having a parent as a teacher. It's all relative.

Let’s keep this thread friendly.

Perhaps some colleges don't trust written submissions - which may not be all the student's own work? They probably put a lot of weight on the written exam (if any).

According to this, approx 20% of 6th formers go to private school:
guidetoindependentschools.com/key-independent-school-statistics/

It's really unhelpful to look at the number of children who are in private school, because far far fewer younger children are. It's best to focus on 6th form.

And speaking of Murray Edwards:
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9982333/Cambridge-University-93-students-state-schools-says-new-college-president.html

I don't think anyone is being unfriendly stockpot? Seems a fairly amiable discussion to me?

[quote Fogormist]According to this, approx 20% of 6th formers go to private school:
guidetoindependentschools.com/key-independent-school-statistics/[/quote]
There are quite big differences per area of the UK, just as an addendum.

Oooh, and just because I am a sociology pedant, the figure is out of date. It was affected by the SLA being 16 so obviously more people leave state schools than private. It's not really about movement into the private sector. However, more post 16s now stay on at school and so that proportion is going up. I think those figures also don't include SFC sixth formers.

The state vs private school threads that pop up from time to time tend to be quite heated.

It would be nice not to fall into that on this thread.

I have seen those threads. I was just discussing stats. Not an anyone v anyone, honest!

@Piggywaspushed

I don't think anyone is being unfriendly stockpot? Seems a fairly amiable discussion to me?

Thanks Piggy I think, perhaps, it was aimed at me for daring to make a comment about private education. I believe each to their own, but we need to address the inequity which is often swept under the carpet.

Fogormist we don't have 6th form in Scotland and far, far fewer privately educated pupils per head of population. There are many ways to look at statistics.

An interesting stat (and one which has been growing in recent years) is the increasing % of international students amongst undergraduates.

At Oxford 23% of undergraduates are international. So discussion about UK independent/ state split needs to consider that only 77% of offers are made to UK students.

Stockpot I'm not starting a state v private debate at all. I'm not sure where you picked that up from? I was answering some PP who suggested private school pupils were disadvantaged. I wished to counter that.

Each to their own how they choose to educate their children: peace and love and all that.

@SandyBayley

An interesting stat (and one which has been growing in recent years) is the increasing % of international students amongst undergraduates.

At Oxford 23% of undergraduates are international. So discussion about UK independent/ state split needs to consider that only 77% of offers are made to UK students.

You don't have notice that on University Challenge!

On Scotland - apparently about 25% of children in Edinburgh are at private school.
But 4% in Scotland overall.
www.scis.org.uk/facts-and-figures/
Again, worth bearing in mind that it tends to be older children who go to private school. There must be a lot of wealthy families in Edinburgh - I wonder what % of the secondary school population in Edinburgh goes private.
There are no grammar schools in Scotland, and a lot of frustration with the Curriculum for Excellence. This may go some way to explaining the 25% figure.

Uch but that's Edinburgh. House prices are so high they won't even notice school fees! A lot of the prestigious private schools come under the Edinburgh boundary but they will draw commuters too.

The lack of grammar schools is a GOOD thing, but we won't get into that debate here. CfE has it's positives and negatives, like every system (I won't admit I call it Curriculum for Excrement ). It certainly doesn't stop Scotland from producing very well-rounded pupils.

No, it doesn't. It's always been the way. I don't think Scots hanker after grammar school tbh. Edinburgh is very monied in places and just traditionally has a lot of private schools. In most other areas of Scotland, they simply do not exist. People also don't shop around as much : the catchment school is totally the norm. Glasgow also has a somewhat higher proportion of children at private school, but nowhere near Edinburgh figures. It's just an outlier, culturally!

Good points Piggy

Yup, Piggy my DC go to their catchment school like every, single one of my friend's children. The only exception is one friend whose husband was sent from overseas to private here, thus he wanted his kids to go there too. In the main, it's just not a big draw/deal.

Whispers

It is obviously only right that if only 20% of students attend independent schools, then proportions if applicants / offers should reflect this. My point was that while this is already the case at some colleges, it is not true for all at Cambridge (no idea about Oxford as I haven’t looked at those stats).

It’s interesting to see, for different colleges, the proportions of applicants v offer ratios as these apply to the two sectors. It does seem that there are variations between colleges. Compare St John’s to say, Homerton over the last 5 years, for instance. It’s easy to see graphically and at a glance on the Cambridge admissions stats.

@Piggywaspushed

Whispers

Most excellent to know this.