Daughter accused of collusion

[Iamsodonewith2020]

Daughter received end of year results and got a first in everything except one grade which was 0. She queried it and was told she was being investigated as the marking software had detected plagiarism. Fast forward a month and she has been called to a official hearing and is being accused of collusion. The evidence they have given is that another student on the course handed in identical project inc spelling mistakes! She is a first level student and hasn’t a clue what to do next as she definitely did the work but how does she prove it’s hers and she didn’t give it to someone else ( this is what is being implied)

@caughtinanet - Does that mean that then that the issue of spelling is in fact a non issue? Why would it be mentioned as an indicator of cheating?

The reason spelling mistakes are an indication of cheating is that the likelihood of two people randomly making the same spelling mistakes is highly unlikely. Using identical variable names is also an indicator of cheating as again, highly unlikely two people would randomly decide to use exactly the same names in the same order.

As pp's have mentioned, code also includes comments to explain the code. The likelihood of comments being the same is so vanishingly small as to be pretty much zero. Additionally, the more complex the code, the lower the likelihood that the code itself will be the same.

So a comment might say:

This loop finds the minimum value of the varable distil.

The chance of two people saying roughly the same thing is high, if they are writing code for the same problem, especially if it is a fairly simple program. The chance of them both calling the variable the same name is a bit lower. The chances of them both misspelling “variable” in the same way is lower still. The chance of them phrasing it identically, having the same variable name and misspelling the same word is very low indeed.

Isn't running the spell checker something every student knows to do

You'd be surprised. IME, a surprising number of students don't do it, because a) they don't care b) they're running out of time c) they don't realise they need to.

Does that mean that then that the issue of spelling is in fact a non issue? Why would it be mentioned as an indicator of cheating?

Oh come on - think about it. Spelling errors are pretty individual to a specific person - you know, someone who persistently writes 'definately' (ooo, had to scrub my keyboard after typing that).

So if there are two identical pieces of work, right down to the spelling errors, it's pretty good evidence (although not entirely definitive proof on its own without other corroborating information) that there's been copying.

The starting point is that this is collusion ie one student has allowed another to copy her work. If that is the case, both are guilty of academic misconduct.

@ShortBacknSides

Does that mean that then that the issue of spelling is in fact a non issue? Why would it be mentioned as an indicator of cheating?

Oh come on - think about it. Spelling errors are pretty individual to a specific person - you know, someone who persistently writes 'definately' (ooo, had to scrub my keyboard after typing that).

So if there are two identical pieces of work, right down to the spelling errors, it's pretty good evidence (although not entirely definitive proof on its own without other corroborating information) that there's been copying.

The starting point is that this is collusion ie one student has allowed another to copy her work. If that is the case, both are guilty of academic misconduct.

I think you've missed some posts.

@Chemenger explained that spell checking isn't possible in computer code so the obvious follow on question is why did the uni raise it as an indicator in this case but thanks for the rather patronising explanation

Chemenger says pretty much what I say ...

I'm speaking from 30 years of teaching undergrads - if you see expertise as patronising, that's your projection.

@ShortBacknSides

Chemenger says pretty much what I say ...

I'm speaking from 30 years of teaching undergrads - if you see expertise as patronising, that's your projection.

Or a commentary on the level of understanding the undergraduates.

You must see that your explanation was a statement of the bleeding obvious, if you have to over-explain like that to today's undergraduates I despair a little for academic standards.

I hadn't previously registered your post that said

You'd be surprised. IME, a surprising number of students don't do it, because a) they don't care b) they're running out of time c) they don't realise they need to

If those are serious reasons for an undergraduate not doing a spell check it backs up my view. How is that acceptable at university level?

Chemenger explained that spell checking isn't possible in computer code so the obvious follow on question is why did the uni raise it as an indicator in this case but thanks for the rather patronising explanation

Just because you can't run a spell checker on computer code doesn't mean that identical spelling mistakes aren't an indicator of cheating

Think about it... if both students reversed the t and h in the word "the" and wrote "hte" in completely different sentences, that would most likely be a coincidence. If they make the same spelling mistake in an identical sentence, that is suspicious eg they both wrote "this loop finds hte minimum value of the variable distil". If there are multiple identical spelling mistakes, it's very likely there has been copying eg they both wrote "this loop finds hte minnimum value of the varable distil".

Surely if you went to all the effort of hacking someone you'd make sure you at least spellchecked? Why would you steal someone's work and then submit it as is? Its a lot of effort to actively steal someone's work to pretty much be garunteed of being accused of collusion

Id have said its more likely that they've both copied from the same source. I have a friend who writes essays for university students and that sort of practice is rife. She alleges she once wrote an entire classes essays!

Surely if you went to all the effort of hacking someone you'd make sure you at least spellchecked?

I think the question is more if you have the technical ability to hack someone, surely you have the technical ability to write your own code...

I am 99% confident the op's dd was not hacked. That's not to say the material wasn't stolen but that usually happens because the author leaves their machine logged in or they are careless with login credentials.

You would be amazed at how stupid students seem to think we are and how lazy they are in their cheating.

I have a friend who writes essays for university students and that sort of practice is rife

You and your friend don’t exactly have the moral high ground on this matter.

Call me old-fashioned, but I couldn’t be friends with someone who made money out of cheating, and by enabling others to cheat.

It’s depressing isn’t it @OchonAgusOchonOh ?

Hi OP, sorry but I have not time to read all of the posts but I heard a story somewhere last year where a student was accused of copying/plagiarism. In that case (and I’m sorry, I can not remember details) the university lecturer had submitted a candidate’s work to a plagiarism checker online which had been corrupted in some way. The student’s work was copied / stolen. Another student bought the work online with no idea who had written the original which had been stolen in order to sell. Student A was accused of selling her work but it was traced back to the marker’s computer after some fairly intense research.

I’m useless with details and I’m sorry if my post is waffly. I do hope that the matter can be resolved.

@ShortBacknSides

It’s depressing isn’t it *@OchonAgusOchonOh* ?

Yes. And insulting.

I recently had a case where I reported a student for plagiarism as he hadn't paraphrased the material he was referencing. He was quite insistent that it was our fault as we hadn't told him he needed to use quotation marks if using the exact words. I pointed him to the two documents I provided that explicitly stated that, the link to resources on how to cite and reference I had provided, the email he got for the the compulsory plagiarism advisory session at the beginning of the year and the link to the recording of that session he was provided with.

But it was our fault...

I know of someone who left their laptop open whilst they went to the loo in the uni library and a 'friend' hopped on to their laptop, copied their dissertation and submitted it as their own.

Original author had to prove it was theirs by showing all the earlier drafts they had saved and emailed themselves over the months to prove innocence.

Thief obviously booted off the course but failed to tell parents this and turned up on graduation day in a cap and gown and told parents their name must of got left off the list for the graduation handshake and certificate when parents queried why his name hadn't been called out

@ShortBacknSides I'm not taking the moral high ground, I'm saying its a fairly likely option either one student buying the work or both using the same person to write it. Its a lot more common than I would ever have realised.

What my friends do isn't really any of my business. Lots of people have jobs I consider less than moral, and I would consider the person doing the cheating to be the one who was immoral in that case

I think the question is more if you have the technical ability to hack someone, surely you have the technical ability to write your own code...

Not necessarily. There are teenage hackers who wouldn't have a clue about some sorts of serious coding (eg if it required advance maths)

@ErrolTheDragon

I think the question is more if you have the technical ability to hack someone, surely you have the technical ability to write your own code...

Not necessarily. There are teenage hackers who wouldn't have a clue about some sorts of serious coding (eg if it required advance maths)

That is true but it is unlikely to be a teenage hacker stealing the code. It would be a classmate who, unless they have paid absolutely no attention to anything on the curriculum, will have learned some coding. Generally, someone capable of hacking will have reasonable technical ability. If they are studying computer science, I would expect them to be capable of developing decent coding skills.

Students steal other people’s work because they are desperate. Because they are not coping with the work and have fallen behind, because they realise they have underestimated how long something will take, or because they have reached their level of competence and can’t accept it. There is so much pressure nowadays to get the holy grail of first and 2.1 marks that they buckle and resort to cheating. Back in the day students quite happier bobbed along having a good time, scraping a pass or a 2.2 mark but now that’s seen as abject failure.

@Chemenger

Students steal other people’s work because they are desperate. Because they are not coping with the work and have fallen behind, because they realise they have underestimated how long something will take, or because they have reached their level of competence and can’t accept it. There is so much pressure nowadays to get the holy grail of first and 2.1 marks that they buckle and resort to cheating. Back in the day students quite happier bobbed along having a good time, scraping a pass or a 2.2 mark but now that’s seen as abject failure.

You also have students who are lazy, which, when coupled with arrogance and a sense of entitlement, means they just see it as no big deal to use someone else's work. Then there are also those who have no moral compass and see nothing wrong with cheating.

We've had issues this year with students sharing exam questions/answers in WhatsApp groups etc. Students getting caught claiming they didn't think it was a problem as "everyone is doing it".

when coupled with arrogance and a sense of entitlement, means they just see it as no big deal to use someone else's work

This was mostly what I saw when I sat on my institution's highest level committee for academic misconduct over several years.

I agree that a a number of students won't think they have done very much wrong. They will see it like employing a cleaner to clean your house Why not pay somebody to do your uni work. Or buy an essay or similar on line.

Call me old-fashioned, but I couldn’t be friends with someone who made money out of cheating, and by enabling others to cheat

I suspect all your friends have dark pasts you don't know about. Nobody is perfect and all of them will have views and have done things you don't approve of.

Anyway to get back to the thread, I don't use spell check because it picks up the wrong things.

I also think it's quite possible for people to have the same errors as there are clearly combinations of letters that people routinely type that are picked up by predictive text etc but not the same ones all the time.

Anyway I hope the OP's dd is able to make her case and continue with her studies.

OP this happened to me - I studied computer science too.

I had been in one of the computer labs doing my project. I had printed out my code and worked on it again, when I left I put the old stuff in the bin as I no longer wanted it. Someone took it out the bin and copied it. Took ages to resolve. Make sure she takes screen shots of all her progress with file updates times so she can proved she worked on it.

@thesplashing

I know of someone who left their laptop open whilst they went to the loo in the uni library and a 'friend' hopped on to their laptop, copied their dissertation and submitted it as their own.

Original author had to prove it was theirs by showing all the earlier drafts they had saved and emailed themselves over the months to prove innocence.

Thief obviously booted off the course but failed to tell parents this and turned up on graduation day in a cap and gown and told parents their name must of got left off the list for the graduation handshake and certificate when parents queried why his name hadn't been called out

In our library the entire laptop wouldn't be left there when you get back! Numerous laptop thefts over the course of the year I was actually last on-campus from people going to the loo and leaving it unattended.