Manchester University - permanent move to ‘blended learning’??

[BramStoker]

The article below implies that lectures will no longer be face to face unless there is an interactive element

www.theguardian.com/education/2021/jul/05/manchester-university-sparks-backlash-with-plan-to-keep-lectures-online

Very worrying for current students at Manchester and those hoping to go there in September (my DD)

There is no official statement on the University website or social media

I wouldn't say so. Traditional lectures to some extent became redundant with the advent of cheap photocopying! And delivering them online seems entirely sensible, regardless of pandemics. In fact they might as well be recorded and watched when convenient (if they are truly non-interactive).

For a student studying a subject with low contact hours anyway this could be quite impactful on their university experience perhaps less of an issue for sciences, engineering, medicine etc. Have Manchester Uni not noted the OU charge £3000 less per year in fees.

Not worrying at all. As long as there in person seminars, tutorials and practicals online lectures are fine, especially as they get recorded and re can be re-accessed at a later date. This way they can listen to the actual lecture and concentrate on it and then take notes later when relistening. It is a much more efficient way of working.

Have Manchester Uni not noted the OU charge £3000 less per year in fees.

I'm sure they're aware. I'm sure they're not planning on a delivery model like the OU.

@notnowbernadette

For a student studying a subject with low contact hours anyway this could be quite impactful on their university experience perhaps less of an issue for sciences, engineering, medicine etc. Have Manchester Uni not noted the OU charge £3000 less per year in fees.

But it takes more years to complete an OU degree so actually the cost is higher than £6,000 per year in real terms. In any event if seminars and tutorials (ie. the truly interactive sections of the course) are in person it should be a better way of learning.

@notnowbernadette That it DD’s worry because she has been offered a place on a humanities degree with low contact hours

It could have a massive impact on her experience as a student and she is now rethinking whether she actually wants to go 😦

[quote BramStoker]@notnowbernadette That it DD’s worry because she has been offered a place on a humanities degree with low contact hours

It could have a massive impact on her experience as a student and she is now rethinking whether she actually wants to go 😦[/quote]
My sense is that Manchester is in no way out on a limb on this one. Unless there is a sector-wide U turn then she might struggle to find anywhere doing it much differently.

I've no idea whether the change will save much money but the sector is on it's arse financially.

The £6,000 a year is full time equivalent, so a degree with the OU will cost £18,000 regardless of how many years it takes to complete. I'm unsure how I feel about online lectures, I've completed a degree with the OU so clearly comfortable with the distance learning model, but now going to study nursing at a brick uni and a big part of the appeal is physically 'going to' uni as obviously missed this aspect first time round.

Isn't nursing done via a lot of interactive small-group teaching?

@BramStoker has your dd had an email from Manchester uni detailing how the course will be delivered in September. My Dd did a few weeks ago, it appears to be a fair mix of race to face and online for her course.

This is happening sector-wide. Manchester is just the first to officially announce it.

There are advantages to keeping non-interactive teaching online - it makes learning more accessible, eg to dyslexic students, for one.

@SeasonFinale it doesn’t take longer to to a degree at the OU. Unless you do it part time, they’re three years.

Posters on Mumsnet seem very disproportionately keen on online learning. I know my dcs absolutely hate the lack of in-person lectures. They shock horror like being with and among people. I think it's a really depressing move.

The OU is most definitely cheaper and becoming more popular particularly with students who live at home in cities and have a good social life away from uni

Lectures have effectively been 'online' for years in most places. Prior to the pandemic, all our main-hall keynote lectures were recorded and uploaded onto a Blackboard system so that students could watch (and re-watch) them online in their own time.

It also meant that lots of students simply didn't turn up to the in-person, timetabled lecture - why would they when they could watch it at a time that suited them? It's also hugely helpful to those who struggle with the kind of fast, focused note-taking that is required in a lecture - they can watch, pause, rewind and rewatch anytime.

Seminars, tutorials, lab work, practical skills teaching, pastoral meetings - all of that will stay in-person. That's where the real interaction happens.

Any university worth its salt wouldn't need a pandemic to understand the benefits of blended learning.

When the OU costs £19k for a degree and other universities cost £28k, it's pretty reasonable to pay close attention to what you're getting for your money.

Online lectures can make sense yes, but if they're not offering a lot of in-person interaction in tutorials, seminars and so on then I can't see how they warrant the extra money.

There are advantages to keeping non-interactive teaching online - it makes learning more accessible, eg to dyslexic students, for one.

DD said some of her cohort with physical issues also benefitted from not having to sit in uncomfortable lecture theatres.

Hers was a very high contact course either a lot of high-content lectures and problem classes. She said they both worked well online - lectures could be run at double speed if in waffly bits, repeated on hard bits. Problem classes perhaps surprisingly worked better on screen with everyone 'facing each other' than in a seminar room.

As with everything, no doubt it depends in how much effort is put in, both in the preparation and delivery but also by the students. Her department was already making the first and second year lectures available online pre pandemic because it was helpful to many students so I suppose they started from a good base and were able to rise to the challenge better than some.

This is the university statement:

studentnews.manchester.ac.uk/2021/07/05/blended-flexible-learning-what-it-means-for-you/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

There will still be in-person teaching. It is the larger lectures being delivered online presumably.

I think universities need to be clearer in their messaging. If you say lectures will be online a lot of people will assume that means everything will be online, which is not the case.

We are trying to be clearer by saying lectures of more than 40 people will be online and literally everything else will be f2f. Those bigger lectures are a small portion of our teaching time and attendance is already low since we started posting recorded versions.

Also that's just for Term 1. We're hoping Term 2 will be back to normal.

It's definitely secter wide. There seems to be a misunderstanding/misreporting that "university lectures" means that totality of university teaching which is not the case. Even taking covid out of the equation, having large numbers of students crammed into a lecture hall for a tradition lecture which is non-interactive session where they just sit and take notes whilst the lecturer talks is not a good use of anyone's time, when they could just access the material online in their own time and at their own pace which is far beneficial.

What absolutely is not planned for online and what generally works far better face to face is all the rest of university teaching: seminars, practicals, small group learning, problem based learning, oral classes, lab sessions, tutorials etc. In most cases these were not able to be held in person this academic year (unless it was for a practical course) and they are very definitely being planned to be held face to face next academic year.

Any university worth its salt wouldn't need a pandemic to understand the benefits of blended learning.

No. Mine has moving that way before covid was a twinkle in a Wuhan biochemist’s eye.

My lectures were interactive so I had planned to run more seminar sessions to compensate. That way the students get the online lectures they want and opportunities for social interaction that they also want.

As that is considerably more work for me, we should, perhaps, be charging more for blended. Certainly not less.

Mine has been moving…

@dreamingbohemian

Do you have links to Manchester?

Do you know if it is possible to obtain the proposed timetable for a specific undergraduate course?

My DD is hoping to read History at Manchester which has low contact hours anyway. It is not a course which involves lab work or practicals so DD is worried she won't get much opportunity to meet and make friends with other people on her course

I appreciate that the option of watching lectures online is a good thing but I can't see why the option to go to the live lecture needs to be removed to facilitate this?

Dd says she really feels she’s missed meeting other people on her course - the casual bumping into people on campus & seeing people at lectures. She’s very much a people person and hasn’t enjoyed all the online stuff at all, she’s sick of screens.

I was talking to an academic at the weekend who said her (well regarded) University was going the same way. Lectures would be recorded, so sort-of become required reading. She would then spend her time on follow up seminars.

I can't see what is wrong with that. First quite a lot of students skip lectures, but also in more technical subjects students struggle to absorb all the lecture content first time round. DS used to spend at least a couple of hours preparing for a maths lecture and then a few hours after going through the content again. DD similarly uses catch up to ensure she understood everything.

Using staff time more effectively sounds like a good idea. Cutting down on staff would not. I assume Manchester are aiming for the former.