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Higher education

Talk to other parents whose children are preparing for university on our Higher Education forum.

Original poster

Dd halls of residence party- disciplinary hearing today!

97 replies

Currysauceandchips · 06/05/2021 09:06

My dd returned to halls last Sat and a flatmate had a birthday party. Flatmate invited people from other flats and word got out and approx 30-40 people turned up.
The party had started when dd arrived back. She says she spent most of the evening in her room as she didn't really know anyone there, but went into the kitchen a few times for drinks/food etc.
Yesterday, she received a mail from the uni calling her to an urgent Zoom meeting about disciplinary action being taken against her! She has been advised to have someone with her, so we are joining the meeting too.
What does this mean? Someone has obviously named her as the organiser, which she swears she wasn't.
I have told her to speak to the birthday girl and tell her she needs to say it was her party.
My dd is terrified about getting a huge fine or being thrown off the course!
Any words of wisdom?

OP posts:
Newgirls · 06/05/2021 15:26

I’ve heard of a few of these cases now - one resulted in fines of £800 for each flat member

I feel sorry for the students to be honest. I wish they could get jabs and fast.

AllThatisSolid · 06/05/2021 15:28

a small gathering of a few mates

which would still break the regulations (and law?) in England ...

Xenia · 06/05/2021 15:30

My son ( a student) by the way says it is nothing to worry about apparently (being hauled up before the university although I would have thought it would be......)

Comefromaway · 06/05/2021 15:31

If the small gathering consisted of only those in the halls bubble (could be 6-8 ish people depending on how the halls are organised then that was perfectly legal.

I0NA · 06/05/2021 15:38

@Xenia

My son ( a student) by the way says it is nothing to worry about apparently (being hauled up before the university although I would have thought it would be......)
It depends on the course. On some they could get professionalism points ( demerits) as well as a fine.
I0NA · 06/05/2021 15:39

I should add that I agree with everything @Xenia said in her first post about collecting evidence.

Calmdown14 · 06/05/2021 15:41

She needs to consider her reason for being back. Does she have any lectures in person or has she returned to access the library etc.
Disciplinary action isn't usually for a first offence. If her flat has become known for this type of breach, she should have a list of the dates she was or wasn't there so she can distance herself.
I suspect there is a history here with other flatmates at least

DonLewis · 06/05/2021 15:41

Has she forwarded the email to you?

IJustLikeBiscuitsOK · 06/05/2021 17:16

Has she spoken to the Student Union? They can offer support, legal guidance etc.

RockingMyFiftiesNot · 06/05/2021 18:22

@Xenia

My son ( a student) by the way says it is nothing to worry about apparently (being hauled up before the university although I would have thought it would be......)
One of our local universities made it very clear that students breaking lockdown rules will be disciplined, including possibly being removed from the university. But it falls on deaf ears.

Barring a small minority who were allowed on campus , the university asked them not to come back to their university accommodation (including halls and private accommodation) after Christmas, which was largely ignored.

Feel sorry for your daughter OP as she seems to have been caught up in it but as PPs have said, she will have lots of evidence to prove she was travelling.

Soontobe60 · 06/05/2021 18:24

[quote babbaloushka]@Soontobe60 She traveled back in time for a small gathering her friend's birthday.[/quote]
Of students from other flats. Which isn’t allowed under Covid rules. I’m pretty certain you understand that?

EduCated · 06/05/2021 19:30

Surely train tickets etc. are just going to make it look like she travelled back for the party?

Regardless of personal opinions on the matter, the party was illegal if other flats were invited (regardless of numbers). Your DD was present and presumably didn’t call Security or raise concerns that an illegal gathering was taking place in her flat?

I agree it is very likely that they’ve pulled the whole flat in, rather than anyone having named her as the organiser.

Are you sure you are able to attend? If it is a university disciplinary there may be a restriction on who can attend as a ‘friend’ - often limited to other students at the university. May not be the case, but double check. You don’t want her to be flustered if you’re asked to leave.

JunoTurner · 06/05/2021 19:31

The DD may have been travelling for some of the time the party was going on, but going by the OP, she was in the flat where it was happening for at least half of it.

What it boils down to is that regardless of intention, she travelled back in time to attend (some of) the party.

I don’t really agree with the sentiment of some posters that it’s all the fault of the girl whose birthday it was. Anyone who attended broke the rules, even if it was purely by being in their own flat. The DD attended some of it. She presumably knew the rules. Yes it was her flat but she could have not gone back on that day or gone for a walk to ensure she wasn’t in a flat that was breaching social-distancing rules.

I feel very sorry for all young people at university that they’re having a compromised experience but they’re adults in a pandemic with adult responsibilities. If it was my DC, I’d get them to understand that and accept that they’re culpable for their part in it, rather than focusing all their energy on why “it ain’t me guv” and pinning it on the birthday girl.

JunoTurner · 06/05/2021 19:33

X posts with EduCated.

PresentingPercy · 06/05/2021 20:39

If a train is booked well in advance, the party might have been more spontaneous. Of course flat bubbles can mix. Even celebrate. The problem is the randoms who turned up. It is pertinent to say DD didn’t invite anyone.

I dislike this jointly liable situation regarding damage. DD got done for someone else’s damage and she had left the flat by then as she didn’t like her flatmates attitudes. So jointly liable will probably happen here. Do let us know what happens op.

JunoTurner · 06/05/2021 20:57

The problem is not just “the randoms who turned up”.

The OP said that the birthday girl in the flat invited people from other flats. Then others - the randoms, as you put it - turned up. Inviting those other people was a breach of rules made by the birthday girl and everyone else who invited people/brought them along.

Being at the party in a flat with people who don’t live in the flat and are in different bubbles was a breach of rules made by everyone there. Including the OP’s DD.

Hoghgyni · 06/05/2021 21:23

So what happened?

BlibBlabBlob · 06/05/2021 21:32

Nothing to add here except:
(1) Assuming you've seen the email inviting your daughter to bring 'someone' to the hearing with her, do check it carefully. At most universities this needs to be another member of the university, so a friend / coursemate / member of student support services.

(2) Consider strongly whether you should be there, even if it is allowed. She's an adult. She needs to speak for herself. If you do attend, it's supposed to be for moral support only. Don't expect to put your daughter's case for her or even to speak. Again, she is an ADULT - would you expect to attend her disciplinary hearing if she was in employment?

Abetes · 07/05/2021 10:52

@Currysauceandchips any update?

poppycat10 · 07/05/2021 12:14

How awful for your dd.

be prepared to fight, use language the pushes the onus on the University to prove her involvement rather than just being stuck in a defensive position. In my experience, universities tend to be a bit shit and usually take the path of least resistance. So be polite, but unmovable

This. Every bit of evidence you can think of.

Then turn the tables and say (politely) what evidence do you have that I was involved, other than I live there (which is nowhere near enough, even on the balance of probabilities).

To be honest, if it is about the party you should require them to provide the evidence that she was involved at the outset of the meeting. They wont' have that evidence but if they simply try to use "well she lives there" as evidence, firmly say that does not wash and that she came home half-way through proceedings and isn't responsible for what goes on in her absence.

You have your MN team of lawyers behind you! Good luck.

If they are really unreasonable, tell them you've sought legal advice, but don't say that at the outset.

poppycat10 · 07/05/2021 12:17

At most universities this needs to be another member of the university, so a friend / coursemate / member of student support services

I'd insist on being there. She's a young adult - not having an older adult there very obviously changes the balance of power in favour of the university and I would argue that the hearing would not be fair. She's not had time to get someone from a support service to attend, and a friend/coursemate is no good.

I would also make the point that it's too early for this to be a disciplinary, if that is what they are calling it, and it should be an investigatory meeting to see what your dd says happened. Discipline comes later if there is a case to be answered.

poppycat10 · 07/05/2021 12:19

she is an ADULT - would you expect to attend her disciplinary hearing if she was in employment

No, but students are very young adults, and employees have older adults available to them as colleagues in most cases, with experience.

The one time I attended an investigatory hearing I absolutely took a colleague with me, as a note-taker and witness if nothing else.

OP don't let the MN groupthink of 18 year olds are adults and you're being a helicopter parent if you still do anything for them get in the way here.

BlibBlabBlob · 07/05/2021 13:04

There WILL be an adult available to attend with her, even at short notice, via the student union advice service or similar. They'll know the score, have been to loads of these meetings before, and be the best person to support your daughter.

It really doesn't need to be a parent, and I would argue that it SHOULDN'T be a parent. Working at a university I am well aware that our undergraduate students are not what most of us on here would call 'adults'. But legally they ARE, and if you wouldn't turn up at a work meeting with your daughter then don't turn up to a university meeting with her.

Anyway the point stands: if the rules say that the accompanying person must be a member of the university, you will basically get kicked out of the meeting. Which will leave your daughter feeling more vulnerable. Better to have the benefit of somebody who is definitely entitled to be there, and who can give accurate advice on the specific situation instead of a parent who is too emotionally involved and has a bunch of randoms on Mumsnet advising them instead of a professional. ;-)

user1497207191 · 07/05/2021 15:21

@JunoTurner

I also agree with others that by being at the party, being one of the flat’s residents and knowing about it, she’s culpable to a lesser or greater degree. Harsh, but not entirely unfair.
Not if she thought the party was for the flat mates only - there's nothing wrong nor against the rules for that.
TaraR2020 · 07/05/2021 15:48

Make sure you have thoroughly reviewed the universities disciplinary and appeals policies, should be able to access them online.

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