Return to university

[SouthCoastShell]

I've just watched all of Boris's announcement and he doesn't mention when students can return to university. Does anyone know when students are allowed to return?

Obviously things are very different for students in private accomm, who can do what they like under the 'moving house' guidance and those first years who are in university accomm - and may also be less confident in challenging university directions.

@BigSandyBalls2015 was her Feb return a unilateral decision for your DD, or did she actually get notice from uni that students were now welcomed/tolerated back?

The situation is likely to be different for students attending universities in different nations and regions (e.g. England, Scotland, Wales, NI). The PM cannot make policy on this for all areas of the UK, so regs are likely to differ for that reason.

@incywincyspiders

"Arts and Social Science students have not been allowed to have F2F teaching. There was supposed to be a decision today about whether they could do so after Easter."

Just because they aren't allowed doesn't mean they aren't havent come back. We had 95% of first year students back on campus.

This really isn't true everywhere. I have 2DC at different unis, both collegiate and one college has refused return. The other allows it but at least 50% of students are still at home, DS included, as halls regs are so strict, libraries, gym, cafes and bars on site are all closed and the city itself is closed. They do have mates who have returned (notably Warwick which is an out of town campus) but their friends there have been or know of people who have been fined £1000s for having parties. Which makes me glad DC aren't there.

Neither of my DC (a finalist and a fresher) have been allowed back to their respective university owned accommodation. They are both working in their bedrooms at home, isolated from their friends and without access to libraries.

Depends on the course and the university.

It does. I was in last week. Offices are open, though not all occupied. Research labs and workshops working as normal. The library is open but you need to get there early if you want a desk. F2F teaching planned to restart in the summer term.

The situation is likely to be different for students attending universities in different nations and regions (e.g. England, Scotland, Wales, NI). The PM cannot make policy on this for all areas of the UK, so regs are likely to differ for that reason.

Wales and Scotland have already clarified their positions (students allowed back from 12 April, I believe).

Is OP referring to back on campus accommodation or back to in person teaching in the university buildings?

I have DC who has been back in campus accommodation since Jan (just gave a "permitted" reason) but the university buildings are all closed to students and they've already announced there will be no return to in person tuition this academic year.

For some courses, not all.

@KingscoteStaff her uni sent an email saying f2f would resume twice a week from late Feb, and the library would be opening so she headed back. She's year 2 so could have gone back earlier as private house rather than uni halls. She's not on a practical course but there aren't many on it, hence being able to socially distance etc more easily.

St Andrews have been very firm on this. My science student is watching labs on a laptop in our home and is not allowed back. Lots of students have gone back anyway citing ‘special reasons’. Students have now been told if you go home for Easter, do not come back.

I agree with other posters that unis have taken the gov guidance and interpreted it in their own ways. The government is dire as per usual and def more concerned about daily mail readers and holidays.

@OhYouBadBadKitten

JellyBabies - When I read that, I hadn't appreciated " or any earlier vacation during which the student returned home as permitted under the Health Protection (Coronavirus, Restrictions) (All Tiers) (England) Regulations 2020"

It looked at the time I read it as though it applied to students who had returned to their universities and were now being granted a short leave of absence to go home for a break before returning.

I'm going to ponder this for a little bit and do some more reading.

I know that international students are getting increasingly agitated - if they are going to be admitted from non red zone countries - they need to book tickets and sort out quarantine.

I read it the same as you - only applicable to students who were expressly allowed back to uni in the first place.

I must say, I only know of one student (Durham) who has not gone back. DS is year 2 & all his housemates (different uni) & everyone he knows has been back since Christmas & has gone home for Easter. Most of them had Covid in the autumn term and did tests before going home. I do know anecdotally of first years who haven't gone back, but also know of plenty who did (certainly Sussex, Bristol & Nottingham that I know of first hand).

@Newgirls mine is also at a Scottish university.

The Scottish Gov announced return to in person learning in colleges and universities from 12th April. Meanwhile many universities have already informed the students there will be no return this year🤷🏼‍♀️
The permitted courses (medical) have been in anyway so really they were referring to some practical college courses!

As ever, the devil is in the detail!

According to THE, the announcement about university teaching has had to be delayed due to disagreements within government. There are concerns about mass movement of students around the country leading to the spread of new variants.

There should be an announcement by 'the end of the Easter holidays', although whose Easter holidays they are referring to is unclear, since different universities have different Easter holidays.

The announcement is only about whether face-to-face teaching is allowed to resume for courses not previously designated as essential practical courses. Universities can still make their own decisions, based on their own circumstances, about whether they want to resume face-to-face teaching and whether they want to allow their students to return to university-owned accommodation.

Thank you @Phphion for this update. Good to have some idea of what to expect.

A simple fact check by the government would reveal that a “mass movement” of students is highly unlikely given that two thirds of students are back already. This is so frustrating for our students who are desperate to get back.

Mass movement won’t happen as different unis restart on different dates and as pp says, many are already back in absence of any instructions! My DD restarts next Mon so no time to change travel plans anyway. Students continue to be ignored by Boris et al.

I agree with others. In England the only students explicitly allowed back before the end of April are those on the courses that have already resumed face to face teaching.

This is what the guidance (published in Feb and updated a month ago) says.

Return of remaining students^
All remaining courses should continue to be offered online as they have been from the beginning of term. The government will review, by the end of the Easter holidays, the options for timing of the return of remaining students. This review will take account of the latest data and will be a key part of the wider roadmap steps. Students and providers will be given a week’s notice ahead of any further return. Providers should not offer in-person teaching before then, or later if further guidance to this effect is issued, and should encourage students to remain at their current accommodation until the resumption of their in-person teaching, wherever possible.^

So we should hear in a week or two. Mine has been at home since the beginning of December and she has decided to go back at the end of April whatever the guidance says.

She's her final year and she is in private rented accommodation so we've already paid for 4 months of wasted rent. The university has already said that everything will be on line, but she will at least be able to enjoy her final term with her friends and boyfriend rather than stuck at home.

Given that so many students have returned to their privately rented accommodation against the official advice (ie not on practical courses) it must be hard now for the government to have any idea what impact it would have to let them all back officially, as they won’t know what % of the overall total have returned. It seems to me that those that have followed the official guidelines and not fabricated an excuse to return are being unfairly penalised.

[quote wooliewoo]@Newgirls mine is also at a Scottish university.

The Scottish Gov announced return to in person learning in colleges and universities from 12th April. Meanwhile many universities have already informed the students there will be no return this year🤷🏼‍♀️
The permitted courses (medical) have been in anyway so really they were referring to some practical college courses!

As ever, the devil is in the detail![/quote]
It would have been nice to have some f2f and labs but with the short term they made their own decision 😡 prob due to staff not wanting to get back to campus and the work involved in timetabling etc

@Phphion

According to THE, the announcement about university teaching has had to be delayed due to disagreements within government. There are concerns about mass movement of students around the country leading to the spread of new variants.

There should be an announcement by 'the end of the Easter holidays', although whose Easter holidays they are referring to is unclear, since different universities have different Easter holidays.

The announcement is only about whether face-to-face teaching is allowed to resume for courses not previously designated as essential practical courses. Universities can still make their own decisions, based on their own circumstances, about whether they want to resume face-to-face teaching and whether they want to allow their students to return to university-owned accommodation.

Yes it’s all down to ‘want’ isn’t it.

As with all these conversations it’s important to define what you are talking about

Are you talking about first years going back to university Halls - understandably difficult given elements of communal living, impacts mitigated by rent refunds

Or

Are you talking about those on courses that require face to face teaching in order to get a professional qualification - these are back legally already, either living on or off campus

Or

Are you talking about second and third years in private rented accommodation doing online only courses - the vast majority of these are back in their rented houses and have been throughout, deciding it’s more fun than being at home even with lockdown restrictions. No university or government can prevent any tenant living in their paid for accommodation and the rules provided sufficient wriggle room (“circumstances which make study in the family home difficult”) to allow this.

Very few courses have teaching in the summer term - there may be revision sessions and of course library facilities to use for revision etc in normal times. But given most exams this year will be open book there’s not the same focus on revision. If students aren’t already back it’s probably not worth it now - maybe better to steal a March on their contemporaries by snapping up summer jobs before the others come back home!

My DS would strongly disagree that it isn’t worth going back now. He would jump at the chance of a term back in his university room with the friends he made in his first term, access to libraries rather than studying in his bedroom and, of course, independence. Similarly for DD who would much rather sit her finals online in college rather than in her bedroom.

@Biscuitburglar

Given that so many students have returned to their privately rented accommodation against the official advice (ie not on practical courses) it must be hard now for the government to have any idea what impact it would have to let them all back officially, as they won’t know what % of the overall total have returned. It seems to me that those that have followed the official guidelines and not fabricated an excuse to return are being unfairly penalised.

I don't quite understand this.

Who needs the excuse and who is it given to? The students I know just went back, no excuse necessary.

My son and all his friends aren't in private accommodation, they are in university managed halls, they went back and many flats are full. In houses with younger siblings being home schooled/adults wfh there isn't always the space or WiFi capacity for study.

Very few courses have teaching in the summer term

Normally, yes. However, it is, or was, possible to change that.

We did.