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Higher education

Talk to other parents whose children are preparing for university on our Higher Education forum.

Oxford and Cambridge current students

988 replies

sandybayley · 09/03/2021 20:41

Nearly filled up the old one...

OP posts:
mutterphore · 05/05/2021 15:25

Hoghgyni, yes, DS1 (C) is on all the usual social media stuff but again there seems less happening in C than in O on that level. DS2's (O) college keep coming up with more and better ways for students to meet and mix with other students but the impression I get of DS1's (C) college is that there's nothing on offer.

It's weird to think that many of our DCs will never actually now get to meet in person people who they've had as a tutor/ supervisor for a whole term. Back in my day, my O tutor invited her entire cohort to annual garden parties at her massive country mansion and would also regularly attend choir performances and chat with me and her students afterwards. I was completely terrified of her but at least we got to know each other very well across those years.

DS2's main tutor is currently on sabbatical after only being there the first term but not meeting in person then. So he's already onto a new one. DS1's DOS won't be the DOS next year but someone else. So there seems to be a big difference in continuity along with the extra detachments caused by Covid and rarely if ever meeting in person.

DS1 will also probably never know most of his first year cohort or recognise them at all as there was no college matriculation photo of any kind. I imagine one day they might be applying for the same job or working at the same company only to find out that they were at the same college at the same time yet never even caught sight of each other!

Hoghgyni · 05/05/2021 15:44

Massive country mansion! Most will be struggling to rent somewhere locally these days.

Tennis is definitely up and running everywhere. There must be college running groups, if not, put he could put out a message that he's looking for running buddies. Set up a book club or music group for the type of music or literature he likes. Someone needs to make the first move.

OhYouBadBadKitten · 05/05/2021 15:56

dd does much of her socialising in cross uni societies or through her sport.

sandybayley · 05/05/2021 16:53

An example of what seems to be planned in Oxford. Some things never change...

Oxford and Cambridge current students
OP posts:
mutterphore · 05/05/2021 17:17

Mmm, I somehow doubt an Abba party/ disco would appeal to my sons! Thanks for that link though, Sandybayley.

Hoghgyni, it was totally daunting each time I went to the country mansion and I was completely out of my depth! My tutor's mother was landed gentry (we're talking 40 years ago now) but my tutor was one of the main advocates of access to all students and considering applicants' contexts - hence how I got a place, despite getting every single answer wrong in my interview with her. Her family estate included the mansion house and a tennis court, a swimming pool, a croquet lawn and 'grounds' rather than a garden. 'Staff' welcomed us and her 5 year old daughter - handing round strawberries and ice-cream - had more confidence and social skills than I did - at 18! I arrived on the local bus from the centre of Oxford and then walked along country lanes, whereas some other students came in cars which felt very posh to me at that point. I didn't dare swim in the pool as I felt frumpy alongside some 'golden goddesses'! How times have changed and I suspect you're right that many tutors now struggle to rent both in O and C.

DS1 does belong to some university wide societies but nothing yet seems to be happening with these. He prefers running alone but has played some tennis and badminton in the first term with his household. Hopefully there'll be more happening as term goes on.

Hoghgyni · 05/05/2021 17:28

Prof BIL lives in a 3 bed semi. Permanent academic BIL rents 2 rooms in a shared house. Definitely no mansions despite his Oxford, Cambridge, Durham & international academic credentials. I doubt if his cat would be much use at handing around strawberries either.

Unescorted · 05/05/2021 18:19

I hope the kids have a fabulous time at their Reverse Freshers. They deserve it.

Abetes · 05/05/2021 19:43

@mutterphore sorry to hear that your ds is still struggling to find his tribe at C. I would second others suggestions and encourage him to instigate some meet ups with others. You mentioned previously that he had an idea who he would like to live with next year if the room ballot allows, perhaps he could get this group to go for picnic/coffee/drinks/pizza? Or similarly get the people who are studying his subject at his college together for the same sort of thing? Now that they can meet outside college it should be feasible to arrange these kind of meet ups. Whilst it might seem a bit daunting, he might find that the others studying his subject might be in the same boat or might at least want to share experiences of this first year.
My dd is at O so don't know if this is possible at C but she has joined the choir at a different college to her own. Her college choir was audition only and she didn't want something so heavy going so joined the choir at another college. Still singing very traditional music and has met some lovely people that way. When she was looking, she found lots of colleges willing to take singers from out of college, so might be worth investigating whether C has a similar system.
Maybe try rowing? Again not sure what is allowed this year but C stressed at the open days that rowing is a sport there where no experience is necessary? And would suit an early riser like your ds?

sandybayley · 05/05/2021 20:33

@mutterphore - I think things have changed massively since you were a student. The kind of experiences you describe most likely just doesn't happen anymore. I suspect safeguarding policies prohibit students going to their tutors houses for socialising for a start. I wonder if you've inadvertently raised the expectations of your DT to expect something which just isn't realistic even in a non-Covid world.

It's been rubbish for all the freshers this year and particularly rubbish for those who were kept at home for long periods. But as many posters have said the students have got on and made the best of it. I was being a bit flippant about the ABBA party to be honest. My DS would probably go to it (he'd liked it on FB) but he's mainly having fun by organising things like Lord of the Rings viewings, cricket, trivial pursuits games and online quizzes.

It's really about making the best of it and putting yourself out there. It's unlikely that anyone will knock on your doors so you have to knock on someone else's doors I'm afraid.

OP posts:
Malbecfan · 05/05/2021 21:31

@Abetes it is most definitely possible at C as DD is in a choir along the road from her college. She sang for the DoM in her own college who said she was of the right standard but DD couldn't commit to all the rehearsals. DoM made a phonecall and told DD to pop down the road to the next college which does fewer services. She now sings Alto 1/Soprano 2 depending on repertoire and availability. One of DD2's friends is at DD1's college and they all sang in the same school choirs. Friend didn't make it into college choir so DD1 suggested the "down the road" one and that worked. It's worth asking around.

@mutterphore I think the idea of sitting and discussing books/history etc. is probably a bit of an illusion. DD is coming to the end of her 4th year so had 2.5 years of "normal" student life. Her closest friends in college were from her course, rowing, living on the same floor or friends of friends. Times are different, but can your DS ask his college parents where others on his course hang out? I remember in her 1st year, DD used to frequent one student cafe; in her 4th, she knows the price of everything in the Materials Science cafe!

DD joined an orchestra in her 1st year. I remember a girl from school 2 years older than DD who was an amazing musician (not studying music) being aghast at DD joining this particular orchestra as the standard wasn't very good. DD's comeback was that she could sightread everything they played at the same standard as the others as she didn't have time to practice. It wasn't a great orchestra, but DD met some nice people from other colleges at the coffee breaks. Her instruments are all at home, but to be honest, I don't mind. In year 1 she did rowing and orchestra, in year 2 rowing and choir. In year 3 choir and acrobatic dance, and this year, a bit of choir, acrobatic dance online and now in person, plus a bit of football.

mutterphore · 05/05/2021 21:33

Abetes, thanks for your thoughts. DS1 would be happy enough to share accommodation with a few from his current household for next year but they're not 'friends' as such - just the only people he's really got to know a bit from his own college, as they're in close proximity. They don't really have much in common but they're very nice people. None of them though would be remotely interested in doing things like picnic/ coffee/ interesting discussions. That's the problem really. He's watched a few late night movies with them, played some card games and computer games - in his first term - but actually has no interest whatsoever in the latter two activities and little in common with their interests at all. He just joined in, in order to 'join in'. He gets on very well with most people but just hasn't met his 'tribe' yet, I suppose.

His subject cohort - some of whom, are on his corridor - are almost all female and tend to do that 'girl thing' females can do - band together in subgroups of loud, girly cliques. His college 'family' is also all female and his college 'parents' only did a couple of things with their freshers in the first term and DS1 felt a bit like they'd be happier without the token male there!

He's looked into joining a choir from a different college but it was all online and I think he sort of gave up for now but could consider this again maybe next year. Rowing has too early starts for him and it's sort of DS2's 'thing' so he hasn't wanted to appear to 'copy'. DS1 thinks 8.30am is early enough to get up whereas DS2 gets up around 6.30am like me. DS1's college seems to go to bed around 4am and get up around 3pm - so if DS1 is to get any sleep at all, he's had to shift his body clock to even later bedtime/ waking. It's a bit quieter this term though I think.

There does seem to be something happening soon with one of the societies he's involved in, although it only met in person once or twice in the first term and no one kept in touch online really - but he's going to meet up with them anyway and hopefully get to know them better. It does seem though that he'll have to go outside of his college to find people who share his interests but that's fine.

Sandybayley, you wrote, I wonder if you've inadvertently raised the expectations of your DT to expect something which just isn't realistic even in a non-Covid world. I had to have a bit of a snigger here as it's been the opposite really! They've heard mostly about my days of 'fear and trembling' at Oxford, dropping all extracurricular activities after the first few weeks as, for me, the work was overwhelming, feeling completely out of my depth from my northern school that had never sent anyone to Oxbridge before and really doing little but work all the time, as a student, to try to get to grips with a subject that was completely alien to my natural abilities and all my A levels (successfully in the end, thankfully!).

By contrast, I've been so pleased that DS1 and DS2 have been undaunted by Oxbridge life and have been able to participate in so much more than I did, take studying in their stride (doing subjects they enjoy and suit them best) and relish whatever's available to them, however limited in these Covid times. They weren't expecting country mansions and they know my tutor was, even then, a rare breed but also how much in awe I was of her.

I am amazed at how relaxed, informal and friendly they are with their supervisors/ tutors and fear doesn't come into it for them. It's very 'healing' for me to see them both getting so much more than I did from student life. Both are doing lots of extracurricular stuff - although lots of that doesn't involve meeting up in person, especially in DS1's case.

Both really are enjoying themselves. It would just be good if DS1 could meet more like-minded people like DS2 has done - so easily - at his college. I'm sure it'll happen eventually however.

mutterphore · 05/05/2021 21:45

Malbecfan, I think our posts crossed. It's DS2 (O) who is happily discussing everything from his subject - History - to the arts, literature, politics, philosophy and in depth conversations about life, the universe and everything with a whole bunch of very like-minded people at his college and has had no trouble at all finding people deeply interested in their subject and wider interests too - from rowing to choir to Heidegger. They also discuss their thoughts about their own lives and are really interesting and interested.

It's DS1 (C) who can't seem to find people that want to chat much at all about anything, as opposed to do gaming, drinking to excess and avoiding showing any interest at all in their studies or beyond. If you put DS1 in DS2's environment, I think he'd be well away making friends and enjoying a great social life.

His college parents seem to have dropped contact now with their 'children' and must be busy with exams etc I presume. Meanwhile, DS2's college family continue to meet up, bond and were incredibly helpful when he was trying to see if he'd be allowed back to college.

I guess a lot of it is down to luck and who you meet and who responds to overtures of friendship, what interests, if any, that you share and who happens to have been put in your household. In non-Covid times, it would have been so much easier for DS1 to meet in person with a much wider group of freshers from his college. I know they must be out there but maybe it'll take till next year to meet some of them.

PantTwizzler · 06/05/2021 14:03

@mutterphore I'm sorry that your C DS is still very isolated -- like mine. (And agreed about the past being a foreign country with regard to social contact with tutors/supervisors. One of my tutors once came to an undergrad fancy dress party as a gay hussar. He wore a genuine hussar's uniform. He had recently come out, having been married to a woman for 20+ years so was pretty tickled by his costume...!)

My son's an engineer who is partial to gaming (though I don't think he talks about it) and he doesn't feel he's met his tribe either. It seems it's very much the luck of the draw in terms of how relaxed or otherwise the college authorities are, and therefore how widely the students can mix.

All C undergrads got sent a telling-off email about Caesarean Sunday which is pretty rubbish given the overall proportion of students who went. My DS wasn't even in Cambridge then!

On another subject -- does anyone have any suggestions for outdoor dining possibilities in Cambridge? It's DS's birthday this weekend so we want to visit. Preferably somewhere so sheltered and warmed that it's practically inside...

TheHomeEdit · 06/05/2021 14:18

@PantTwizzler The Gonville Hotel has what looks like a massive tent green house outside, expect that’s pretty warm. Friends have reported that The Oak Bistro is basically a room - think it’s an internal courtyard with large umbrellas. Dh has been to the Maypole - covered and heated I think and the Punter - more hit and miss with the coverings/warmth. Wherever you go I think you will need to book.

OhYouBadBadKitten · 06/05/2021 14:29

Go Sunday Pant, not Saturday, unless you like soaky wet weather.

PantTwizzler · 06/05/2021 14:32

Yes Sunday is the day! Will investigate those options. Thank you. Last time I was in the Maypole I was painting my nails the night before my wedding!!

hobbema · 07/05/2021 13:14

@PantTwizzler, DD had a very nice lunch at La Mimosa with her boyfriend’s parents last weekend.

Re the old days, went to a pub last year, whose food at least was fondly remembered by DH having been taken their by a pervey old supervisor whose interests were very much not academic aeons ago. It was crap and we got a driving fine for the bus lane trap mentioned upthread ! The past is best left there. I’m glad relationships are appropriately academic now.

goodbyestranger · 07/05/2021 14:12

Sometimes flirtations blossom properly though hobbema. The son of my parents' next door neighbours had a relationship with his tutee at Oxford, married her and they had ten daughters together. I remember in my childhood his mother would complain bitterly to my mother over the hedge that whenever they stayed, they wouldn't get out of bed until nearly lunchtime, and she really couldn't think what they were doing....

HuaShan · 07/05/2021 15:40

DS has very sadly elected not to go back at all this term - in his own words 'its not worth it'. I'm sad that all the hard work, anticipation, securing a place has ended like this. He has not balloted to live with anyone next year either - the one friend he made is off to do his year abroad next year (languages). He seems OK, it just feels like a damp squib. He has exams in the week O are putting on social events and said he can't see the point in going , then breaking up until October. I feel quite sad for him but can't change his mind Sad

Hoghgyni · 07/05/2021 15:44

The DofEd has an awful lot to answer for HuaShan. You've done everything you possibly could.

mutterphore · 07/05/2021 17:06

HuaShan, I am so sorry for your DS. That's really difficult for him and I'm sure he won't be the only one who hasn't really made any friends. Does his tutor know what's been happening for him and has there been any proactive support from his college? Could they help with 'introducing' him to some of his peers in college and also those doing the same subject from other colleges? Can the JCR also take an active role in helping out?

Sometimes it's easier for students if these things are actively arranged in a structured way, rather than left to chance. There must be lots and lots of other students feeling similarly and I think colleges need to be alert to who these are and help out with second year 'events' for those who've missed most of the first year.

DS1 (C) is shortly going to organise who to ballot with for next year - he has two people he'll ask - and they're really lovely but I wouldn't say they were going to be life-long friends and have little in common with him. However, through a couple of university-wide societies, he's now had one social get-together and has another planned too and remains optimistic about meeting more people in due course. I'm very relieved.

But this year has been so much down to luck and has largely depended on who people have met or are in close proximity to in their accommodation. Those doing more demanding courses will have found it even harder to find time to meet anyone socially and informal encounters which would have happened in normal times, eg over meals or at in-person Freshers events - just haven't been available at many colleges.

Has your DS joined any societies at all, HuaShan? Even whilst he remains at home, if he could do so and 'meet' more people online, then perhaps in October, he'd then be able to meet those people face to face?

PantTwizzler, DS1 says that the engineers have infinitely more work to do than he does and is in awe of how studious they all are. I hope your DS enjoys his birthday and is able to take time off studying.

PantTwizzler · 07/05/2021 17:06

Thanks @hobbema.

So sorry to hear @HuaShan. I very much relate.

Ironoaks · 07/05/2021 17:25

@HuaShan hopefully second year will be a much better experience for him.

DS hasn't made any close friends in college yet, so went into the ballot as a single rather than a group. About a quarter of the first year at his college did this, so he isn't the only one. He knows which room he'll be in, and the other rooms in that staircase have been earmarked for second years too. I'm hoping his second year staircase will socialise together a bit more. I don't think he has met up or eaten a meal with his current household since the matriculation dinner.

HuaShan · 07/05/2021 18:47

@mutterphore I'm afraid DS has not talked to his tutor despite me urging him to. Likewise he would be mortified at the thought of any introductions and run a mile from anything he thought was structured. He is very firm in his views (?stubborn) and he just says these things are less important to him.

ofteninaspin · 07/05/2021 19:45

So sorry @HuaShan. This could easily have been any of our DC's experience; so much is down to luck.