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Higher education

Talk to other parents whose children are preparing for university on our Higher Education forum.

Original poster

No uni return til Aug/Sept

502 replies

Newgirls · 10/02/2021 15:59

So Edin and St A have said no f2f teaching til next academic year (apart from med and some post-grad) and students should not be there unless v specific needs. Very sad that this cohort are going through this. I assume English unis will follow?

OP posts:
GaribaldiGirl · 15/02/2021 19:29

@TheJerkStore I’m saying give lectures once - F2F for those able to attend but but record them. I thought that was normal these days anyway? I think you’re saying that’s what you normally do? So I cannot see any reason why (once lockdown is eased and schools go back) all university courses can’t do this? Saying it makes it unfair for those who can’t attend is not very convincing. It’s better for some to have the chance to attend and interact with fellow students than none. I imagine lecturers must prefer having real faces in front of them too!

Universities are going beyond government guidelines. Edinburgh have said everything is online for the rest of this year even though the Scottish government only stated January and February. Just looks a bit rubbish to me....

Covidcorvid · 15/02/2021 19:30

@Newgirls

I’ve seen high profile uni academics arguing to NOT lift restrictions! They are all over bbc and Twitter! Not all want to be on campus. I’m glad that some do.

And as I’ve said complaints don’t seem to have much impact and as mums need wine says / it’s a lot to ask an 18 year old against unionised and large legal teams.

I would much rather be back face to face teaching. I’d do it tomorrow if I could. So can I just point out it isn’t all academics, I’d say it’s more the very senior levels of the university.

I asked a long time ago why I can’t teach my course (cohorts of approx 40) in one of the massive lecture theatres designed for 200 plus. Was told it wasn’t feasible as there would be too many courses who could argue for this and limited large teaching spaces. Also the need to reduce overall footfall on campus due to the risk of lots of students in corridors, lifts, etc.

Original poster
Newgirls · 15/02/2021 19:31

Continuing to do recorded lectures does make it a crazy market to ‘buy’ lectures from around the world - you get the best modules from Harvard etc rather than regional Brit campus. I’m amazed unions aren’t fighting to protect staff from that asap.

OP posts:
TheJerkStore · 15/02/2021 19:31

@mumsneedwine

Exactly. If no teaching next term surely no fees either.
UG courses don't tend to have teaching in term 3 anyway so I don't understand your point?
TheJerkStore · 15/02/2021 19:32

[quote GaribaldiGirl]@TheJerkStore I’m saying give lectures once - F2F for those able to attend but but record them. I thought that was normal these days anyway? I think you’re saying that’s what you normally do? So I cannot see any reason why (once lockdown is eased and schools go back) all university courses can’t do this? Saying it makes it unfair for those who can’t attend is not very convincing. It’s better for some to have the chance to attend and interact with fellow students than none. I imagine lecturers must prefer having real faces in front of them too!

Universities are going beyond government guidelines. Edinburgh have said everything is online for the rest of this year even though the Scottish government only stated January and February. Just looks a bit rubbish to me....[/quote]
If they tell me I can teach on campus then I'll be there.
It's not my decision.

Changi · 15/02/2021 19:38

I’m saying give lectures once - F2F for those able to attend but but record them. I thought that was normal these days anyway?

Unless the requirement for social distancing is removed, many lectures would have to be done in sports stadiums.

mumsneedwine · 15/02/2021 19:39

@Changi well Unis have them so great.

mumsneedwine · 15/02/2021 19:40

@TheJerkStore my point is use term 3 to make up for the lost time in Terms 1 &3. Nothing about this year is normal so do something for the poor students. At least let them meet each other.

TheJerkStore · 15/02/2021 19:42

[quote mumsneedwine]@Changi well Unis have them so great.[/quote]
No they don't!!!

We have a sports hall - one. We run over 400 courses. How would we timetable that???

mumsneedwine · 15/02/2021 19:42

It seems there is always a reason not to. Not ways to make it work.

TheJerkStore · 15/02/2021 19:44

[quote mumsneedwine]@TheJerkStore my point is use term 3 to make up for the lost time in Terms 1 &3. Nothing about this year is normal so do something for the poor students. At least let them meet each other. [/quote]
Okay , but where are the staff coming from?
My timetable is already looking pretty full for term 3 so I can't add any teaching so we'll need to take on extra staff - all of whom need to be qualified to teach the specific subjects that I teach.

TheJerkStore · 15/02/2021 19:47

@mumsneedwine

It seems there is always a reason not to. Not ways to make it work.
And there are always people who don't work in the sector yet think they're an expert.....
mumsneedwine · 15/02/2021 19:47

Not being rude but what do you do for the 10 weeks if not teaching ? Genuinely interested. And can some of it be rescheduled so students could get some time ? Everyone has had to change things. If students are the priority then their welfare should come first.

mumsneedwine · 15/02/2021 19:49

@TheJerkStore not an expert at all. Just a parent of a child who had been lied to at great expense. You can't see why we are all cross which is a shame. Because you are in a position to make things better. But you don't seem to want to.

GaribaldiGirl · 15/02/2021 19:54

@mumsneedwine Edinburgh unis summer break is 16 weeks. Wouldn’t it be amazing if students could have a few weeks of that clawed back to have a proper university experience

Changi · 15/02/2021 20:02

For first year students, we extended (formative) teaching into the summer vacation last year. The students hated it.

TheJerkStore · 15/02/2021 20:03

@mumsneedwine

Not being rude but what do you do for the 10 weeks if not teaching ? Genuinely interested. And can some of it be rescheduled so students could get some time ? Everyone has had to change things. If students are the priority then their welfare should come first.
I teach!!!!!

I have a January start MA so they are taught through term 3.
I teach on some international 'summer schools'. I mark dissertations
I attend exam boards
I catch up with my research and publications ( a non negotiable at my university)
I speak at conferences ( another non negotiable)
I plan for the new academic year

If I'm lucky I get to use some of my annual leave - I've never managed to take all my days though .

Universities don't just run undergraduate courses.

Covidcorvid · 15/02/2021 20:03

@mumsneedwine

Exactly. If no teaching next term surely no fees either.
No face to face doesn’t mean no teaching.

I’m delivering exactly the same sessions as I did last year, just doing them online not face to face.

I’m also doing extra “drop in” support online sessions for extra support which is additional to my normal work load and an extra thing for the students.

Plus the students have worked out how to call me on ms teams and use this function far more than they ever rang my office phone....including weekends!

As far as teaching and support goes some students are getting their money’s worth. I fully admit not all courses may be this good.....Dd is at uni and is struggling without the face to face support but her lecturers don’t seem to have stepped up as much as they could have done. Or at least that’s what she says....the reality may be different.

TheJerkStore · 15/02/2021 20:07

Because you are in a position to make things better. But you don't seem to want to.

You are over estimating my power and influence.
Besides I have worked so hard to ensure my students on my courses have a positive experience. I've barely had a day off since last Easter and I'm currently working 50 -60 hours a week. Oh and I'm homeschooling a 6 year old 2 days a week.

I genuinely don't think I could do anything else. I'm broken

Covidcorvid · 15/02/2021 20:09

[quote mumsneedwine]@TheJerkStore not an expert at all. Just a parent of a child who had been lied to at great expense. You can't see why we are all cross which is a shame. Because you are in a position to make things better. But you don't seem to want to.[/quote]
Academics such as myself and @TheJerkStore aren’t in a position to change things. It’s way beyond the average lecturers influence.

I’m lucky with my course that I can do some f2f teaching, but it’s limited. I have to apply for permission for each session and demonstrate why it can’t be done online. Can’t be for more than 3 hours a week per cohort.

Funnily enough the students aren’t always keen. One year group kicked off in Jan about a f2f session I had planned and said they didn’t feel safe. Even with masks, split into smaller groups and social distancing. And they refused to come in. 🤷‍♀️

Covidcorvid · 15/02/2021 20:12

@TheJerkStore

Because you are in a position to make things better. But you don't seem to want to.

You are over estimating my power and influence.
Besides I have worked so hard to ensure my students on my courses have a positive experience. I've barely had a day off since last Easter and I'm currently working 50 -60 hours a week. Oh and I'm homeschooling a 6 year old 2 days a week.

I genuinely don't think I could do anything else. I'm broken

I hear you. I feel physically ill and burnt out with the stress of it all.

I’m sure your students appreciate what you’ve done. I know my 2nd and 3rd years have said how they see what me and my colleagues are doing, bending over backwards within the constraints we have to make things as good as they can be. I think the 1st years aren’t sure what’s going on. 😆

mumsneedwine · 15/02/2021 20:14

OK I get it. We are all over worked in education (& v underpaid). I do understand- and now know why you can't do teaching in summer term. Thank you.
Is there any way that Unis could help facilitate students meet each other ? So they have at least had a chance to talk to others on their courses ? Could this be done ?

TheJerkStore · 15/02/2021 20:19

@mumsneedwine

OK I get it. We are all over worked in education (& v underpaid). I do understand- and now know why you can't do teaching in summer term. Thank you. Is there any way that Unis could help facilitate students meet each other ? So they have at least had a chance to talk to others on their courses ? Could this be done ?
We're not allowed to encourage students to meet in person, in groups. However, I facilitated the setting up of an online peer support group. I'm not involved anymore but they meet once a week via Teams. The students rave about how useful it is.
Original poster
Newgirls · 15/02/2021 20:19

@Changi

For first year students, we extended (formative) teaching into the summer vacation last year. The students hated it.
I think they might feel differently this year! Have they been asked? Drama students out there for example?
OP posts:
Covidcorvid · 15/02/2021 20:21

I don’t see how they can meet each other when we’re in a lock down.

Believe me once we can all come out of lock down I’m taking my students to the pub! Grin

In the mean time I do activities in my live sessions and put them into groups in the dreaded breakout rooms. So I’m hoping there is some relationship building going on there.