How many GCSEs needed for Oxbridge/ Russell Group Universities?

[2020again]

Current debate at my son's academic school about the ideal number of GCSEs students should take –some students are taking 8 GCSEs and others taking 11, and a couple 12!

Another parent has said to me that all universities, even Oxbridge, only look at the first 7 GCSE results and so even doing say 9 and getting slightly lower grades in some is a false move and better to concentrate on getting top grades in 7. Is that true? Even for the Russell group? Please can someone shed some light on what is actually looked at? Thanks very much.

It is totally pointless to take more than 10 GCSEs.
DD took hers in 2016 when it was usual to take 10. I think many schools now do 9.

Dds school is quite academic and they do max 10. She's doing 9 and wants to drop one. She's not Oxbridge though!

Do what do they advocate dropping to get down to just 7 GCSEs? Presumably, Medicone will be one of the target university courses; triple science, Maths, English Language, English Literature only leaves room for one 'extra', probably Further Maths? Swapping in History for

...(!) hit wrong bit of screen there.. the 'triple' science for those with PPE in their sights?

14 is far too early to be cutting breadth in the way that restricting the number of GCSE subjects to 7 would do, unless the school is thinking of doing some subjects as 'non-exam' courses?

I think 7 is too few for a broad education and to give wide options for A level choices. I would say taking either 9 or 10 would be advisable.

While I don't see the point of going over 10 GCSE's (because the workload at exam time will be enough to give many students a proverbial nervous breakdown!), only doing 7 because it's an easy shortcut into Oxbridge surely misses the point about an education - the best educations are broad and sweeping - at age 14-16 their job is to inspire and pique interest in topics you've not yet come across.

Plus, if you go down to 7, you limit your choice of A-level courses quite heavily.

I wonder if an Oxbridge applicant would be viewed unfavourably if they had only 7 GCSEs, unless it was due to extenuating circumstances?
Might they think that if the applicant was unable to deal with that kind of workload that they wouldn't be able to handle being a student at either university?

Plus, if you go down to 7, you limit your choice of A-level courses quite heavily

I don't think you do? There aren't many subjects you have to have the gcse for to do A level. At our school
Maths, english, physics, chem,biology, art, history, geography, languages all require the gcse. You could almost cover those in 8 gcses and the rest of the A levels don't require a gcse in the subject.

Having to choose history or geog at gcse always seems silly. They are two completely different subjects!

I encouraged muine not to pile them on although I remember a dinner with 2 (male_) lawyers showing off that they each had a son who that year had got 11 A stars (that was one at Westminster and one at St Paul's).

I was more concerned that mine did a lot of core subjects
English lit
English lang
Maths
Geography
History
2 or 3 sciences
1 or 2 languages eg French
Then 1 more fun one such as music

My twins for example did 9 as above including music and French (and in their case 2 sciences - double award) and both went to Bristol.
Do them all in one sitting

Their cousin, comprehensive, got something like 16 over a year or two and went to Durham and probably was one of the best in his school in an area of the North where most people do not do as well. He certainly didn't need 16!!!! but he did very well indeed and got to Durham.

At my DD School everyone does 11, 10, or 9. Depending on their Maths and science sets.

Every one does...
English
English Lit
Double or triple science
Single or double maths
1 Modern foreign language
And 3 options.

Everyone has the same number of timetabled lessons, no one has frees at GCSE.

Some universities require a second language GCSE.

Just to flag up, for current university applications at places where GCSEs are important, my sense is that for a lot of them you must have eight, so DO NOT go down to 7. For example, DS is applying to Liverpool and Nottingham for medicine, and they both this year are scoring the best 8. You will definitely rule out options if you go as low as seven. Note that in the case of both of these courses, while certain subjects have to be scored (such as maths, English and sciences), the remaining subjects are your best two or three. So if you only had eight, you could only count eight, and if you messed up one, then that is the one that would go down. Having at least nine allows you to discount one where you might not have done so well (in DS's case, English Literature, which was lower than the others)

That is, while English language is often scored, for a subject like medicine, some universities do not specifically score English literature.

But if you had only done seven or eight GCSEs, then a weakness in a subject like English Literature might jeopardise you chance of getting into medicine.

Also please note that whoever told you about Oxbridge and them only looking at how you did in GCSEs is feeding you complete misinformation about Oxford medicine. Oxford medicine states very clearly on the website that they rate as follows:
"The GCSE measure used was a combination of proportion of A grades at GCSE and number of A grades at GCSE (with equal weighting). For shortlisting purposes a grade 8 or 9 is considered equivalent to an A*. " If you then go to their website you can see a picture of typical interview and offer mapped against the number of GCSEs - see www.medsci.ox.ac.uk/study/medicine/pre-clinical/statistics
Now your DC may not want to study medicine, and since DS does, I am afraid that is all I know about, but as you can see from this, both number and results play a part, and nobody at all was interviewed for medicine at Oxford with less than 8 A equivalent. The numbers with 8 As interviewed and offered was very low, and most common had 10 A*, which you cannot get by only taking seven or eight subjects. This may change after the new GCSEs filter through, but it is still worth bearing in mind. Cambridge on the other hand, has traditionally not looked at GCSEs at all, so in theory it becomes irrelevant for them.

DT’s school did 10 - 7 of which were compulsory and three of their choice. This ensured a good range of subjects and all the core exams covered -

English Lang
English Lit
Triple science
Maths
Foreign language
And 3 options, one of which had to be history or geography

Don’t understand why this “some universities need a language “ canard keeps cropping up (I assume by second language you meant needing a single MFL”

As binkom said, Oxford put a lot of store in GCSEs using them as part of the shortlisting process, also looking at them in the context of the school in which they were sat (so someone at a highly selective school who achieves 10 A where that is normal would get a lower contextual score weighting than someone at a school where the average was much lower). When I looked at the 'average GCSE score of successful applicants to the course my ds applied for it was 9x A.

I have heard Cambridge cares less about GCSE (but have no idea if this is true - all my research was for Oxford!)

For other Russel Group I believe sitting 9 is usual. If your dc is aiming for Russel Group/Oxbridge, they should manage 9 fairly comfortably.

I know old thread but I am worried that it looks likely that eldest who in the past has appeared interested in Oxbridge is potentially likely to get 7 A* equivalent at GCSE. Is that likely to hinder chances of acceptance (no interest in medicine ) maybe science based.

@HuaShan
Do you mind me asking course?

@yoyo1234 DS is studying Maths.

@HuaShan, thank you for telling me that. If the average was 9A can you recall what was the lowest number of A needed for interview. Hope your Son is enjoying studying maths .

The score in the MAT is more important for getting an interview @yoyo1234. I don't know if they publish figures for GCSE since there isn't an absolute figure. It is a weighting that forms part if the overall decision. I think aptitude tests sre the key to securing an interview

Cambridge don’t really bother about GCSEs. They use their own entrance exam now plus A levels results.

My DS is doing engineering at Cambridge and got 5 As and 5 As for GCSEs. He did also get 4 As at A level. One of his Cambridge friends got C grades for his English GCSEs.
(These were all pre the COVID exam mess though).

If in doubt, go straight to the Cambridge website:

There are no GCSE (or equivalent) requirements for entry to Cambridge. GCSE results are looked at as a performance indicator, but within the context of the performance of the school/collegewhere they were achieved.

Applicants have generally achieved high grades in subjects relevant to their chosen course, and most students who apply have at least four or five 7/8/9s at GCSE (an Aisconsidered equivalent to7 and an A* is considered equivalent to8/9). However, there are always exceptions and we don’t require a minimum number of 7/8/9s at GCSE. One of the strengths of the Cambridge admissions system is its ability to assess all applicants individually.

Our research shows that post-16 examination performance is a much better predictor of degree success at Cambridge. While GCSE results are looked at as a performance indicator, this is within the context of the performance of the school/college where they were attained, and strong performance in Years 12 and 13 can make up for a less stellar performance at GCSE.

& Oxford.
GCSEs will be taken in to account when we consider your application but they are just one aspect that we look at. GCSE results will be considered alongside your personal statement, academic reference, predicted grades and performance in any written work or written test required for your course. If you are shortlisted, your performance in interviews will also be taken into account.

Higher grades at GCSE can help to make your application more competitive, and successful applicants typically have a high proportion of A and A* grades or 7,8 and 9 grades. However, we do look at GCSE grades in context. Where possible, tutors will be made aware of the overall GCSE performance of the school or college where you studied. They will also have information on how you have performed compared with other Oxford applicants at similar schools. (See further information onhow we use contextual data.) Tutors will also consider your achieved or predicted grades at A-level (or other equivalent qualifications), your personal statement, academic reference, and any written work or written tests required for your course. If your application is shortlisted, your performance at interview will also be taken in to account.