How can I help my dd - on the point of quitting Uni (additional needs - acute anxiety)

[LimitIsUp]

I have posted this on Higher Education because dd is at a University for her Art Foundation Diploma (a precursor to a degree in creative arts) and has a place in halls, so although it is a one year course and not a BA / BSC equivalent, its still at a Uni and the 'experience' is analogous

DD's course started on 14 September so we are coming up to end of the second week. I am putting a lot of time and effort into supporting her at the moment and trying to stop her from quitting.

She has anxiety - particularly social anxiety and I suspect she may also be on the spectrum (planning on getting an assessment) and easily gets overloaded.

Her course is typically two days per week with zoom tutorials, two days of week with 'nothing' (private study) and one studio day.

She is struggling with the lack of direction from tutors - having been much more closely guided on course requirements with regular feedback on her progress at Sixth form college. This isn't really happening on this course. The transition to a more self directed learning approach is not coming easily - its not that she can't do it, its because she believes that she can't do it (lack of confidence)

She finds it very hard in her apartment. The other four girls in there are polite and personable (say hi when they see each other) but are not very outgoing. DD isn't outgoing either - she would like friends but is crippled by social anxiety (think off the scale shyness). She has made friends in the past when people have made an effort with her and patiently given her time to come out of her shell (she's actually good company and fun when she gets to know people). I don't think this is going to happen in her apartment - note - I am not criticising the other girls in her apartment. It isn't their responsibility to look after my dd - just saying that I don't see friendships emerging from her flatmates - and tbh there are no other opportunities to be friendly with anyone else due to Covid.

She has only spent 3 nights in her accommodation last week and so far has spent 1 night in her accommodation this week. We live 40 minutes away so she comes home - its hard to persuade her to stay when most of the course is online. I can't do 'tough love' when she is on the phone begging to come home and having panic attacks (nor do I think that's appropriate). I do encourage her to stay as much as she can bear and point out that coming home is self sabotaging

I don't know what to do - she's not coping

Surely she can do her degree closer to home or through open university if she doesn’t want to leave home? I would let her come home in a heartbeat. Especially because if we lock down she may end up forced to stay there full time with no support.

If you’re worried see if you can defer her place to next year then come home and have time to think? Or study from home and just travel to her studio day??

Then focus on getting her assessment and support in place for next year if she wants to go to uni.

DD has texted me a few times today from her studio day. She plucked up courage to talk to the tutor and ask for guidance on her media project and got some good ideas from her tutor. Its like a roller coaster - she will have moments of positivity like this when I think she's getting there, but then suddenly there is a big crash when she's despairing again

Hi there. I was in a similar position to your daughter many years ago - I ended up having to defer a year and go back to my degree the next September. I also happen to be on the spectrum too. Here's what I learnt from that experience:

• The usual student "socializing" lark never worked for me. When you're on the spectrum, it's far more helpful to engage with people over something specific, like an activity or an interest. The day I found my "tribe" was the day I stopped needing to come home every weekend! Are there any student societies she can join?

• Self directed learning is hard to get the hang of, but once you've cracked it, it's like riding a bike. The main thing here is research. Not just around your subject, but around how to study it. I don't know whether her course is more practical or more theoretical, but if there's a strong practical component, encourage your daughter to get into the habit of trying a new technique every day and then writing down what she's learnt about her own practice. This is just one example - I'd be more than happy to provide some more.

• Routine is key, especially if you're on the spectrum. Maybe you could sit down and work out a day-to-day schedule with her - although it's important to let her lead here. You could even set a specific night or two nights for her to come home each week. As time goes on, you may find she no longer needs them.

• Finally, this tip is for you, not her. Be careful not to contribute to her anxiety by saying things like "this won't bode well for your future if you quit". She may be worried about disappointing you by leaving; she may feel like you're exerting pressure, even if you don't think you are. You sound like a really supportive mum, and I know that whatever happens in the end, you will be there for her. If you can make sure your daughter knows that too, so much the better

If you think she has ASD, then why not push for an assessment before now? Not wait until she's left home for uni?

If she is on the spectrum, a diagnosis would open the door to help, and she'd also understand why she reacts as she does.

But now? I'd bring her home. her MH is more important. She can work from home with you to help and support her and give her confidence.

I missed the part about it being a 40 minute commute. That’s a piece of cake. Save yourself a ton of misery and money by letting her live at home. She’ll probably have more resilience when it comes to course-related stresses if she isn’t totally burnt out with general stress.

"Finally, this tip is for you, not her. Be careful not to contribute to her anxiety by saying things like "this won't bode well for your future if you quit". "

Thank you for this Spiderbride, you are right of course

tenlittlecygnets - I have started looking into assessment and diagnosis.

Would it be an option to come home, but continue the course?

My DS is autistic and started university last year. He decided to stay at home, because he didn’t want to have too many changes all at once. He’s dealing with the social side by signing up for a few student societies, which are still meeting virtually. He’s found it much easier to make friends with people he shares a common interest with than some random strangers who happen to be on the same course.

Also, we found there to be a lot of help available from the university’s disability advisor. I know your DD doesn’t have an official autism diagnosis, but long term severe anxiety can also be classified as a disability, so there should be some support available. And to be honest, when we talked to the disability advisor, she never asked what his official diagnosis was, just what kind of help he might benefit from. They made his lecturers aware of his disability and he has regular meetings with one of them just to “keep an eye on him” and offer extra help if needed. The disability advisor also provided advice on the social side and put him in tough with fellow autistic students. All of this has helped him no end, so definitely worth having a chat with the disability advisor.

If you can afford to keep the accommodation ( or if you won't get a refund), just let her do two nights there, then if she feels up to it, she may move up to three etc.

Anxiety doesn't really respond to tough love. Building a massive safety net underneath them in case they fall works better, which being able to come home with no comment or judgement is.

Have you/her been in touch with disability student support at her university? It's perfectly reasonable to slowly work on building a structure around her week and including structure for her nights and days at University.
Would your daughter identify herself as having autism? There will probably be an autistic student soc she could join. Lots of autistic young adults and Chris Packham have youtube videos that might help. National autistic society have a helpline too
Joining other societies would allow her to build remote social interactions. She might like that
Try not to catastrophise about future years . Take it one step at a time. So it's building some structure around the nights she's there. Could she build a relationship with flatmates via WhatsApp during the week and maybe suggest a flat pizza night or movie night on one of her nights there? Have a schedule including shower and bedtime etc. What are her main worries and strategies she can use. She doesn't have to be socially engaged all evening so how will she decompress?
At home, similar. Could you perhaps help her create a timetable for her study days at home, building in proactive sensory breaks?

Next year is next year. The last thing you want to do is worry.about what happens THen. You sound very anxious yourself that everything is going to go wrong for your daughter if you both arent steeling yourself to cope.

I do sympathise, I have two on the spectrum, although dd is the most cautious of the three, ironically, about moving out. However, you have to model not being anxious for your dd sake.
This year is about a bridge, it not about throwing yourself into uni life necessarily.
Some people continue to do a degree from home, many people go to art school later in life.
I also recommend counselling to your daughter, someone to listen but not neccasruly give advice or feel personally respnsible for hwr choices might be invaluable. It is a big pressure on a parent, and I think we are so invested that it is difficult to always make the right responses to their sometimes involuntary stumblings/cries along the way.

"If she can't cope this year with student accommodation what will she do next year when she starts a Fine Arts Degree - possibly two or three hours away from home?"

I went to Glasgow art school for one semester found it too much dropped out at Christmas. The next year I went to Manchester. I lived in catered halls, so I was sitting with people and making friends each mealtime. I absolutely loved it and thrived. Best years of my life.

The year I went back home I got a job as a chambermaid, went to stay with school friends at uni for weekends, passed my driving test - and generally grew up. I was ready to live away the next year.

If she drops out of the accommodation this year and successfully completes the course, she has mastered the skill of less directed learning. She may also have made some new friends. Next year she will be in a better position to start her fine art course and enjoy living away from home, full of confidence.

Can I just say, I appreciate everyone one of these posts. They are really helping

My older son ended up commuting (about 50 mins to Reading from home - he drove) after first year. He had just about the weirdest university experience ever ie got nothing out of it other than his degree but that is what he wanted and he still is glad he got his degree. His 4 siblings also all graduates, older and younger than he is, all had a very good experience living fully there in the usual way.

One of my DDs did her foundation course from home, travelling 40 mins to get there. We just thought it was a good idea because it was cheaper than paying for accomodation and I wasn’t sure she was fully ready to be independent. She had a brilliant time and made friends for life. She then went to university after a year and has loved it, now in her second year.
My daughter does not have anxiety but I think it gave her a lovely year to mature a bit.
There is no hurry to leave home really is there? Perhaps in a year she’ll feel ready?
They all develop at a different pace.
That said she may just be one of those young people who doesn’t like change and needs time to adjust.

I think there is a culture in England of feeling obligated to encourage DC to move away from home so they don't 'miss out on the university experience', but some do need longer before spreading their wings and there is no shame in that.

Having said that, I do wonder if the reserved flatmates might be more promising as future friends than you think?

While more extrovert types might be more likely to approach your DD in the first instance and propel a conversation forward in the period before she warms up and relaxes, such people might also prove overstimulating and draining in the longer term.

Could it be that the other girls in the flat would actually like to make friends with your DD but none of them have the skills or confidence to make it happen easily?

They all need some sort of pretext to begin talking a little more.

Given your DD is creative, could she do some baking and leave it out in the kitchen/communal space with a note for the others saying ‘homemade please take one/ a piece’ signed by her?

It would show that she is friendly even if she doesn’t know how to put it across to others by approaching them and saying something.

(And if they don’t respond to that, stuff ‘em, and take that traybake home to enjoy with you!

Your DD might think this is cringe - but it's just an idea!

The National Autistic Society used to have a transitions service to support students at university. I can't find a link to it but it is referred to here:

network.autism.org.uk/knowledge/insight-opinion/supporting-autistic-people-university

As much as you want your DD to have a great social experience at university, the purpose of going to university is to get an education. As long as your DD is happy, I would focus on supporting her in her studies rather than pushing her to live in halls. If that means living at home is best for her, encourage her to do that.

If she has a diagnosis of anxiety, Disabled Student Support at the university should be able to offer her help and support with studying and emotional support. If your DD wants to pursue a diagnosis of autism, that may make it easier for her to access the right support. If she is planning on studying away from home in the future, it is definitely worth invstigating which universities offer the best support for students on the spectrum.

Has our DD applied for the Student Disability Allowance? That should cover the cost of educational support tutorials to help her find coping strategies to manage her time/studies. It can also cover the cost of a carer/family member to live with your DD, if she needs support living away from home.

I would focus on supporting her and building her confidence that she can manage her coursework first. If she is happier at home, that is the best place for her. If she wants to move further away to study next year, help her find transition support to facilitate that in the future. Don't let her feel that she has failed because she isn't happy in halls.

On the social side, one of things that helped my DC was "rehearsing" - practising in their head what they wanted to ask a tutor or say to a flatmate e.g. invite them in for a coffee etc or making small talk with a classmate.

Loads of people have said let her come home and continue with the course. It sounds like the best solution. I see you said she was kind of doing that to an extent anyway, but you could say come home until say the end of October, see how things go both for her, and with covid, and then she can go back to her accommodation? If it's easier for her to stay there one day a week then she can do that too.

I agree with you op and I’m aghast at the folks saying yup, two weeks, let her jack it and come home.

Give her the flexibility, tell her she can come and go as she pleases. Take the pressure off her, see how she goes. Right now it’s new, everyone is a stranger, she’s missing her family, it’s tough,

So take the pressure off, see how she does. Give her flexibility and to know she has that flexibility without asking. No begging to come home should ever happen again.

If she can gently manage it this year then her confidence will be much better for next year.

OP, A friend had a daughter in very similar circumstances (same sort of course, same lack of true connection with flatmates, same social anxiety.) She quit and came home. It was the right decision. Instead of allowing the MH issues to get worse and worse (and during Covid they are heightened), she came home, sorted herself out, got a job and some self confidence and started again a couple of years later when she felt more emotionally stable and ready. Then she loved it.

Are you or she in touch with student support? They can offer mentors, flag with her tutor that she’s struggling and loads more.
Have you applied tor DSA? It might get her access to various schemes which can help like additional time with tutors.
Does she feel able to tell her tutor what her issue is? They can likely signpost to great resources which would help. But also a lack of direction, it’s only two weeks in so I wouldn’t expect too much direction at this point.
I’d try and get her to agree to manage until Christmas, doing two nights a week in accommodation and have a review then, but you’re right when you say if she can’t manage now what will she do next year. If she is struggling this year is a blessing because it acts as training wheels - if she doesn’t pass or it goes badly there are still courses she can apply to.
Has she accessed any student societies? They’ll be online but might offer some company.
Has she set up a WhatsApp group for her flat? Lots of people are quiet face to face but chattier online, she could just leave a note in the kitchen with her phone number and ask them to text her and create it from there.
And last of all it is only two weeks in, in a very strange, fast changing set of circumstances. I think it’s important to acknowledge that with her and say it’s alright if it’s hard, but with baby steps it’s important to keep trying - hopefully by March it’ll be totally different!

It might be worth checking out exactly what the financial situation would be. If she quits right now it might be that she won’t have to pay any of her course fees. I’m Not sure but it would be worth knowing just in case there is a cut off point that makes a difference.

Could she continue with the course if she was at home???may just remove 1 stress source...which could free up some mental resources for that..

Possibly just tooo much all at one time...

I commuted about an hour for Uni in my first year. 10 minutes drive to the train station, 30 minutes train, 20 minutes walk. Then I got my driving license and my commute was cut to 35 minutes, but it was never a problem. I used to leave early in the morning, miss rush hour, and have a cuppa in the canteen before everyone else arrived. I still stayed at the library until 10pm at times, did social stuff, etc.

My ds went to uni at 18 and stayed in halls. By Christmas he decided to drop out - more because he didn’t like his course, but he did come home every weekend while he was there. He got a part time job and applied for other courses, but all ones that he could do from home .
He has done very well since then , and now has a great job. He says himself that he wasn’t ready at 18 , and that the difference he felt in being a year older when he started meant that he did much better in the long run.
When he initially dropped out I was devastated . But it all worked out well.He also really appreciated the support he got at a difficult time.
I suppose I am trying to say that it’s ok if your daughter Isn’t ready for this , and that things are recoverable. . Don’t worry about the future - concentrate on her mental health

I’d just tell her to come home and commute . Not everybody is cut out for going away to uni at 18/19 . Our ds has HFA and OCD and we positively encouraged him to go to a local uni where he could commute as we knew that he would never cope with having to share a kitchen or bathroom due to his OCD / cleanliness issues - until he hit 24/25 he couldn’t even share a bathroom with family ! Our daughter has extreme anxiety so I appreciate what a nightmare it can be .