University experience is awful at the moment

[Cupcakke]

DD moved into university on Saturday. The rules are very stringent, both campus bars are closed, the university library has very little capacity and the restaurant is take away only. There are virtually no freshers events in person.

Her flat mates are very shy and not very social and she is in a small flat.

Large gatherings keep occurring but the penalty for this is very severe so DD very cautious not to attend these.

She is essentially watching Netflix in her room. I fear for the loneliness. The online events she has attended are poorly attended and just very boring.

Teaching starts next week and her In person contact hours are just 4 hours a week.

Anyone else’s dc thinking this years university experience is non existent.

@Sostenueto - some people were told a couple of weeks agi that 50% of classes would be f2f, thereby necessitating them moving into HoR. On arrival they find this has been adjusted and that everything is online. This happened to fellow students at DS2's uni. They went home (and were given a refund without question on their accommodation.) But it was a pointless hassle for them to fly from abroad and settle in and start to make friends, only to find their course was fully online. Just because it hasn;t happened with your DC doesn't mean it isn't happening elsewhere. Every uni has handled it differently.

DS2 is incredibly happy and has settled in unbelievably well. His courses are all online but he doesn't care because he adores London and just wandering around London parks and bridges makes him happy. But if he'd been at uni in a place that didn't excite him in itself, he might not want to pay £8k for accommodation he didn't need.

@monkeyonthetable were they not told that f2f learning might be suspended in favour of online learning if corona figures got worse? They should have made this clear- surely it would be irresponsible to claim anything was definitely going ahead in a particular way given the current situation?

I think a lot of people ignored the small print, caveats and contingency plans because they felt overly optimistic about the situation.

@Sostenueto, do you realise your tone comes across as rather holier than thou. You should be grateful your child is happy, but not be so blinkered you assume every other student and parent is naive and ignorant and not trying hard enough.

The law allows for 6 to meet inside and outside from different households. It allows for organised outdoor activities of more than 6 if run by sport body / charity etc. It allows for support groups of more than 6. The law doesn’t allow for students to isolate unless they have a positive test or someone in their household has a positive test. The law doesn’t allow for mass incarceration of students who don’t have anyone in their household who has had a positive test. It seems some unis are going beyond law and imposing new rules after accom contracts have been signed. Student unions are usually charities I think and uni sports centres will have qualified sports staff so there is nothing to stop outdoor walks / hikes / army circuit training / running groups / outdoor yoga or indoor mental health ‘support groups‘ of more than 6 taking place. The key will be that someone does a risk assessment. Student unions should be facilitating this. Judging from twitter some lawyers from the human rights side are already ‘all over this’ in terms of potential false imprisonment claims. So a balance has to be struck especially as risk of suicide / self harm / depression from covid restrictions will be far higher than the risk from getting Covid in this age group. It seems to me the media is hyping it up like they did with exams to fill headlines when in reality rates are going up everywhere in society and an outbreak on campus is not nearly as dangerous as one in a care home. Student illnesses don’t usually leak into the local community and Govt could of course decide this year pay a bursary to any low income student who needs a part time job to minimise contacts between locals and students. If unis don’t put on activities then students will turn to local gyms and other groups which will be more risky than holding events on campus for students only. You could quite easily for eg set up groups under charity umbrellas like Ramblers or MIND and write a risk assessment and run an activity or join a local gym / exercise activity / sports team / rowing group etc but then Covid would spread more than if student unions stepped up

We are not 'loving it' at all wanderings a d that suggestion has made me quite angry.
Everyone on know who is working in HE has never worked so hard or been so stressed.

Most of us have been unable to take any real annual leave this year as we've been planning multiple scenarios for this term and beyond. I'm burnt out already and term has only just started.

My DH is senior manager at a university which currently has a high number of students having to isolate and he has spent all weekend in emergency meetings putting support mechanisms in place for those students. This is on top of working until 9-10pm during the week.

We're all doing this with the very real threat of pay cuts and redundancies hanging over us. I can assure you we are not 'loving it'.

My dd has just come home this morning, she hasn’t slept properly all week as her hall mates are up until 5am drinking smoking weed and playing loud music. They invite other people around To join them and she feels outnumbered. There’s no way of meeting people all her classes are online. Warden not interested. She doesn’t want to snitch, But these are not her type of people. I want her to go back, she wants to go back, but how.....can you even relate to that @Sostenueto?

@Chaotic45 - I don't know what they were told as different courses have different set ups. I don't know what his flatmate was studying, only that he turned up and settled in, so presumably fully intended to stay, then found out the next day that his course was 100% online, so flew home to his country.

@SueEllenMishke - that sounds really tough.
This thread has gone off track, I think. No one should be criticising teaching staff for the incredible work they are doing trying to provide modules during lockdown.

People are nervous that their DC are isolated and paying vast sums for accommodation they don't need, which are wholly legitimate concerns. But we do also need to appreciate how hard it is for uni staff to work under these conditions and support you for continuing and developing material so that unis don't close down.

@Quarks69 can she put in for a swap? I didn't get on with my flatmates, and a week after moving I contacted accomodation and they had others available due to people dropping out etc. Probably a bit tougher at the moment, but might be worth asking, especially at the moment your flatmates make all the difference, and there is such a wide variety of people at uni there will be some who are likeminded.

Quarks69 sorry to hear this, your dd is unlucky, this happens every year, I have a lovely post-grad friends who was put in with a party crowd and she was hysterical by about week 2. What I would do is contact the housing office and/or the Student Guild and get advice on transferring to another flat- ask for a designated quiet one. There might be lots of space capacity at the moment, usually you can get a transfer at the beginning of term because lots don't show/shift themselves and this will be more so this year. If that isn't possible, because they consider them a bubble and aren't prepared to break it (and I would put pressure on them to do so to move her) then at least she knows the choices- and could come home and work online as an alternative- you could ask for a refund on housing if that was the case which you may or may not get.

As for us uni staff enjoying this- oh yes, it's very enjoyable being responsible for the mental health of 100's of students, being told simultaneously that we are bad for making them stay in as their MH will deteriorate, but also blamed if they go out and get corona! Everyone unhappy with online teaching, but also unhappy with campus teaching if we have corona (which we do). Everyone's a winner!

Yorkshire - those are such good points 👍

More outdoor activities, in line with outside uni life would help enormously

It seems some unis are actively blocking this (or gov advice) which seems madness - at my dd uni they can do some sports but not organise the walking group!

Quark - she can def apply to swap.

Dd has been able to read online for weeks that her course would be 60% f2f. It turns out it's not based on the timetable she's received this week. It's two sessions a week f2f and all the rest is online.

I do NOT blame the lecturers and tutors at all. It is not their fault. I imagine they're working incredibly hard to make things work.

I do blame the governments handling of this and I do question the running and management of some universities.

I know the universities need to make money in order to run but they also need to be thinking of their students. Some of these kids are barely 18, away from home for the first time following a lengthy time out of schools and with messed up exams and results. Many lost first choice places and accommodation. Almost all are moving into households of strangers - many are not able to have university halls due to the exam result debacle. Many like Dd are moving into flats with people of different ages, year groups, courses etc so no even just with other freshers.

If many students had been told what Themis term would have been like they may well have chosen to stay home and access it all online from the comfort of their family home, knowing they could see familiar home friends and girl/boyfriends rare than what they're getting.

And I do reiterate/ I do not blame lecturers and tutors for this. It's definitely not their doing.

[quote monkeyonthetable]@SueEllenMishke - that sounds really tough.
This thread has gone off track, I think. No one should be criticising teaching staff for the incredible work they are doing trying to provide modules during lockdown.

People are nervous that their DC are isolated and paying vast sums for accommodation they don't need, which are wholly legitimate concerns. But we do also need to appreciate how hard it is for uni staff to work under these conditions and support you for continuing and developing material so that unis don't close down.[/quote]
Thank you.
I can completely understand why parents are concerned. I would feel the same.

Most of us that work at universities are happy to offer tips, advice and support to people who are worried and concerned but it is frustrating to be told we're lazy, incompetent or 'Loving' the drama!!

Most of the issues are not due to things universities have done or not done - these are government issues and we've been left to deal with the fallout!

Chaotic - of course they knew there were risks but they were also strongly encouraged to go to accom and my dd was told f2f would start in week 3 with all by w7. Its tricky all round but don’t blame students.

@tarantula according to their website they aren’t doing room swaps during Covid. Which makes no real sense when students are coming and going anyway. I do wonder at the unis interpretation of the Covid guidelines. It’s like when health and safety go mad and don’t realise they are only guidelines.

Whoever said they've been impressed by the students so far this year- so have I! More than usual. They are reading the readings, engaged. It might just be desperation to get away, have a purpose, get a bit of a life even in Covid times. They are also creatively socializing (and I don't mean parties). You have to remember that MH issues have doubled in the general adult population, so if we are all feeling tired, depressed, and fed up, so are they. Some are more vulnerable. Equally, this group have got through the A level debacle and many seem pretty ok so far. I wouldn't hesitate to take my child home though if they were not coping.

[quote Chaotic45]@monkeyonthetable were they not told that f2f learning might be suspended in favour of online learning if corona figures got worse? They should have made this clear- surely it would be irresponsible to claim anything was definitely going ahead in a particular way given the current situation?

I think a lot of people ignored the small print, caveats and contingency plans because they felt overly optimistic about the situation. [/quote]
👏🏻

Seems a bit crap that a 6th form can be a bubble of 250, but they can’t do similar in a Catered hall of residence and at least sit them for dinner in bubbles ? Surely no need to sit separately as PP mentioned.

That same bubble can then do cinema night, rotate it through the bubbles depending on size of hall ?

At our uni we were still going ahead with nearly 90% of our programmes with some online content, this has been cut back this week by the Level change and the government guidance, we can't take more than 50% onto campus at any time.

Remember that in early August Boris the Dim was telling everyone to go back to offices. Face to face was what it was all about. Now that's considered too risky and their advice, a month later, is the exact opposite- back to home. I agree the universities should have been clearer that face to face might just go off the table.

Exactly still - why one rule for sixth form - who then mix with families etc - and stricter for students?

Make no mistake, the majority of staff at my institution are furious. I’m professional services but the feeling is the same among friends who are lecturers, janitors, librarians. Students were told to come despite zero f2f teaching and now they’re locked up and being pilloried all over the media and social media. We want resignations from senior management over this. It is an abject failure in duty of care.

@Aragog

Dd has been able to read online for weeks that her course would be 60% f2f. It turns out it's not based on the timetable she's received this week. It's two sessions a week f2f and all the rest is online.

I do NOT blame the lecturers and tutors at all. It is not their fault. I imagine they're working incredibly hard to make things work.

I do blame the governments handling of this and I do question the running and management of some universities.

I know the universities need to make money in order to run but they also need to be thinking of their students. Some of these kids are barely 18, away from home for the first time following a lengthy time out of schools and with messed up exams and results. Many lost first choice places and accommodation. Almost all are moving into households of strangers - many are not able to have university halls due to the exam result debacle. Many like Dd are moving into flats with people of different ages, year groups, courses etc so no even just with other freshers.

If many students had been told what Themis term would have been like they may well have chosen to stay home and access it all online from the comfort of their family home, knowing they could see familiar home friends and girl/boyfriends rare than what they're getting.

And I do reiterate/ I do not blame lecturers and tutors for this. It's definitely not their doing.

It's not just the academic staff who care and who are working hard. I can assure you that at all levels within my university the key concerns are student and staff safety and well-being (and that includes mental health). Yes there are financial concerns too - of course there are. The university's senior management is also desperately trying to avoid compulsory redundancies. My VC, like a number of others, has said he will take a pay cut if it comes to it.

I can imagine agent! When the stupid gov said students stay on campus for Xmas I did wonder how halls staff etc would take that. No discussion with them I guess.