Medicine 2021

[Millylovespuddles]

Hi all
It looks like there’s no medicine 2021 entry thread yet, so it might be an idea to get the ball rolling.
My DD is getting stuck into her A level course, doing well so far, but I’m guessing we parents could do with some mutual support and advice from parents who’ve been here before.

@goodbyestranger to be honest the game has become secondary here.The pub has invented a new game of rugby loo roll. 100+ people playing - game been temporarily forgotten.

Cross post again GANFYD. I'm currently on at least one ryp per post.

Gosh, you must all be clones because the responses all show a strong similarity.....

What a cracking social event. I can't begin to imagine reading out MN posts to friends........ Presumably while dozens of acolytes are messaging you feverishly in support!

Onwards with my own evening (I'll try harder this time, given the level of posts has gone through the floor!).

I'd suggest moving onto at least wine though GANFYD - go wild!

Irony: ryp = typo

@goodbyestranger I can assure that no responses being read out here. I am only here as my phone pinged to notify of stuff going on.
Not sure I'd call this a 'social event' - we are at the pub. Loo roll rugby suspended as the cardboard bits got too much beer on them and now too soggy.

Our cottage is next door to a very lively pub mumsneedwine and people would go nuts if you obscured the game. Middle aged teachers chucking loo roll around the pub sounds nearly as weird in terms of fun as forcing your friends to read posts on MN. Bet they can't wait to come back for a rip roaring evening Chez GANFYD, complete with sulky husband! Probably get as many declines next time round as Prince Andrew did to his 60th! Good evening!

Cross post, obviously. I think I'd prefer our pub to your pub anytime. it's famous actually, and a thirty second commute, so very handy in all circumstances.

GANFYD appears to be having the crazy evening on MN, not you. Hope the police don't have to break it up.

Now, I really must go!

@goodbyestranger well I very much doubt your idea of fun sounds like mine. However I have not chucked any loo roll - you really do need to read and understand. I am sitting at a table watching the 20-30 year olds have a great time. Nice craft beer in front of me and game was paused so we are once again watching it as live. You need to not make so many assumptions my dear. Then you look like less of a loon.
@GANFYD whisky chaser 🥃?

@goodbyestranger & why am I not surprised that you live in a cottage next to a famous pub. Nothing you do is ever just ordinary 😂😂. I live in a house & pub is a pub. Lovely owners though.

@mumsneedwine
Married to a Scot! Always whisky

For the record, GANFYD had no influence over DS's poor performance in interviews first time round, I have seen no evidence of anything but good coming from listening to her on TSR.

PLEASE can we get this thread back on track.

@LaLaFlottes - I would thoroughly recommend going to the St Andrews open day. It is a very traditional, science-based course with limited patient contact in the first three years which may or may not appeal to your DD, another bonus is that St Andrews has one of the best offer to interview rates for medicine (84%). It is also a beautiful place to visit for an open day!

If your DD does well in UCAT (which she hopefully will do as she is approaching it very well) and likes the approach it could be a good choice for her.

DS did not consider it first time round because he did not like the idea of moving halfway through, but a year on he sees that as an advantage as he could have 3 years of "normal" university life with normal terms in a university the size they were when we were students followed by 3 years in a big city with a busy teaching hospital for the hectic clinical years. A current St Andrews/Manchester student said it was like a 3 year degree followed by a 3 year unpaid job and loved that about it.

I can't even influence my own children's performance at interview (or much else, most days!).

@GANFYD

Thank you for your reply and all the info:

I 100% understand what you mean about UCAT - there's a limit due to natural ability in this type of test I'm sure. DD does feel that she's improved a lot in the time she's been spending on this so hopefully she's found a way forward that works for her. She's definitely not finding it easy though and I do wonder how much it actually suits her.

I think the video tutorials have helped a lot - some of what you mention below sounds familiar to me from bits and bobs she's told me such as knowing when to flag and move on, or looking at the options and being able to know the answer without working the question through right to the end

I think the method works for her as she's managing to "get" more of the questions and she's getting faster. Plus - and perhaps even more importantly, shes gaining confidence and her mindset towards it has changed.

Thank you for sharing the methods used by your DC too. It's very interesting - I'm not so sure DD would be so successful without getting stuck in now - she seemed quite flumoxed by it initially. Luckily she's really structured her time and religiously spends a couple of hours on it a week. Let's hope this continues!

Again, totally understand she may have to manage her expectations regarding how she might perform in this vs how she performs in more traditional exams where she can just put the work in.

It does make me wonder though - would BMAT suit her better?? I don't know as much about it, but from the bit I do know it sounds like that more traditional type of exam that you can revise for in a more traditional sense? Any thoughts on this would be appreciated?

Thank you!

@Monkey2001
Thank you for your input. Yes, we're kind of treating the trip to the open day in St Andrews as a nice little break! We've not been there for around 9 years but have fond memories!

That's a really good way of looking at the fact you have to move after 3 years and makes sense - change can be good!

I think DD likes the thought of early patient contact, but equally sees the benefit of this coming later - so she's really open minded.

Can I just say too, that I read through the 2020 thread, and your DS is a real inspiration - I told my DD about his path to getting his place and I think it's such an amazing example of sticking to your guns and it all coming good.

Also, the way you came across on the thread, so supportive even when you were not sure of the outcome for you DS, was really admirable and I for one was delighed when it all worked out.

GANFYD and some true Scots (me) drink . Anyhow, very good that you're having something medicinal to relax. To be recommended!

mumsneedwine I think the general hyperbole on this thread led me slightly astray. Perhaps 'well known' for our very old very pretty village pub is more the ticket. Very popular and busy anyhow, and mercifully doesn't host rugby loo roll games during matches. Glad to hear that you left the young people too it though; good to learn you have boundaries! No apologies for living in a cottage though . Is there something wrong with cottages? They sort of happen in rural areas and probably don't know that they're giving offence.

I think St Andrews is one of the loveliest places to do a degree, challenged only by Durham - very subjective of course. I completely see the merit of three uni years then moving on.

@Needmoresleep

Thank you - yes opting fo the English pathway for the clinical years does seem to mean more chance. I think you can also select "don't mind" which might even mean a better chance again. We will have lots of questions at the open day I'm sure!

I've just taken a look at SGUL and it does look fantastic. We are not too far from London - too far for DD to live at home, but close enough to feel like she's not too far away! DH and I both work in London too.

At the moment DD is really open to where she goes and to be honest, just wants a place somewhere....anywhere! I'm sure once she's sat UCAT it will become clearer what her best options might be - hopefully she will have some!

Not a BMAT expert, I'm afraid. My DCs are too lazy and when they achieved a good score in UKCAT, they chose not to sit BMAT as there were no BMAT schools they were particularly interested in.
My understanding is part 1 of it is along the lines of the UCAT and Section 2 is a more traditional science exam. Then there is the essay, which often results in lower scores for a surprising number of people!
They are changing it a little this year, I understand, though do not think the specs have been released yet (next month). Most people seem to use Practice Papers for part 1 and the spec for part 2, but I understand BMAT Ninja has been useful to some.

There is some good advice and links on here
www.thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?t=6282050
and here
www.thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?t=6037464
and I am sure Monkey can offer more specific advice

So it is easier to "revise" for, and has sections that are more like the exams most children are familiar with, so those with good academics seem to more predictably do well in BMAT than UCAT.

I would second the advice that she should sit the UCAT and then do the BMAT if she wants to apply to a med school that needs it or her UCAT is unexpectedly lower than she would like

@GANFYD

Again thank you for this links - very useful. I had seen the intake targets before and got such a shock about how few places there were - this was after being at a Medic Mentor conference with DD, when they told everyone there that it was a great idea to apply to Scottish universities as "a third of places were ring fenced for RUK students"!

As a RUK applicant, do you think St Andrews, with the English clinical pathway is the one with the best chance if DD is determined to include one Scottish university? I noticed on the other link that if you choose "don't mind" for the clinical years, then the UCAT cut off is higher in previous years!

To be honest, we didn't actually realise how important GCSE results could be at the time - so I'm really glad she put the work in.

That's interesting re Cardiff - I did notice they don't have a great deal of information on their website about their application process. We will definitely look into this more to make sure we have the full picture.

Could I pleased ask, in relation to earlier thoughts about UCAT, would she be best to really put a lot of work into BMAT too, seeing as it's a more traditional test?

Sorry for all the long posts but just catching up now!

@GANFYD

Sorry cross posts - I see your post about BMAT above - many thanks!

LaLaFlottes
If she gets a good UKCAT she should be fine. If not, as well as SGUL she might also look at Peninsula and Belfast. The latter is relatively difficult for those from NI, but they seem to look relatively benignly at the relatively small numbers from RUK. We know one girl who had put it as her fall back but who is having a super time.

A friends son had a low UKCAT last year but picked up interviews at SGUL, Liverpool and Peninsula. One point is Peninsula's favour is that Plymouth hospital is a regional centre.

@LaLaFlottes
St Andrews say there are roughly 70 English route and 62 Scottish route places
Scottish - 30 Glasgow, 20 Edinburgh, 10 Aberdeen/Dundee
English - 50 Manchester, 20 Barts

So it would seem there are more places on the English route and this is less likely to be popular with the Scottish applicants, too, due to funding and possibly distance. Although an either route (allowing for historically higher UCAT cut offs) may give the most chance of all, if your DD really does not mind as she will then be allocated, presumably, to wherever they have most space.

St Andrews also has one of the highest interview to offer ratios (up to 80%) with Glasgow, Aberdeen and Dundee all under 50% and Edinburgh yet to declare, as it is their first year interviewing (although were suggesting it would be around 60-65% before they actually got down to it)

It is often the case that people do not realise that GCSEs play a significant role in selection at some med schools until it is too late. However, there are plenty of places that do not use GCSEs to select, nor need stunning minimum requirements, so good GCSEs just keeps all doors open as you move on to the next hurdle (admissions tests!)

With excellent GCSEs, there are many places that are an option even with a lower UCAT score.
@LaLaFlottes daughter has full marks for GCSEs, so would need nothing at QUB; around 2400 at Leicester; could score less than 2400 at Nottingham and Lincoln with a B1; Liverpool cut off was 605 last year; ARU 610; Plymouth is usually just under 600; HYMS with a B1 would not need a high UCAT; UEA has not needed high scores in recent years (though do use it a s 50% of post interview scoring for an offer); SGUL looks around 620 this year; Aston uses two thirds GCSEs and one third UCAT, and does not usually need high scores and Leeds would need lowish BMAT.

There are options for pretty much anybody predicted AAA (or lower if contextual) but it is about applying to somewhere you are likely to get an interview and good stats just lengthen the list of med schools you would get to chose from!

It looks like things are back on the rails here but we must ask everyone to keep things civil (not looking at anyone in particular...much!) so we can keep this thread.

@FlissMumsnet apologies. But glad I reported thread and nice to see you. I'm afraid my phone was 'borrowed' by a few friends who thought it would be funny to be rude. So sorry @goodbyestranger as that was rude. I don't do rude. Sarky, but manners are paramount. Just home from the pub - bet yours has less sticky floors @goodbyestranger

@GANFYD whisky it is. Have a nice malt in my hand. Thank you for all the advice you give - it is very valued.

mumsneedwine as GANFYD wanted to make a point of earlier in the thread for some reason I can't fathom, I wasn't born yesterday. Nor I suspect were most people on the thread. Anyhow, the other one has bells on and all that, just to reinforce.

I don't report but let personal attacks and rudeness stand, as the posts reflect on the poster for others to see. My choice, different from yours, which is fine.

LaLaFlottes your DDs GCSE grades have opened masses of doors. They put her up at the top of her cohort. She doesn't need to restrict her choices unless she has a poor UCAT score and to be honest if she does she's in the happy position of being able to afford to stick it in the bin and apply to BMAT schools such as Cambridge, UCL (since she clearly doesn't mind London), Leeds and one other. It's wide open for your DD. DD4 was momentarily miffed when she got wind of the 8/9 thing for uni applications in the current session but the thing which gave these students their straight row of 9s very probably also enables them to think quickly and sharply at interview. The thinking is that the grades will be distinguished relatively soon, just not this year, for the purposes of filtering for interview. And of course once interviews are done, a row of 9s we'll play into any decision in any play off between otherwise equal applicants, but that's an unknown.

GANFYD is not correct that the reformed GCSEs are not harder. All educationalists across the country recognise the significantly more challenging specifications. GANFYD's point that a 9 is the top of the A* range is completely beside the point; and the challenge comes in the form of the content not merely in the fact of being linear.