Worst Offenders for Unconditional Offers

[BubblesBuddy]

Looking at The Times today, they quote the newly released UCAS data regarding which universites give the most unconditonal offers. Suffolk is a staggering 83.8%. Even the much lauded Lincoln is 53.7%. RG universities are topped by Birmingham 18.9% and Nottingham 11.4%. Other RG universities are fairly negligible by comparison. Nottingham says it is now ending this practice.

On Radio 4, the Vice Chancellor or Sheffield Hallam defended offering unconditionals to the brightest applicants. He seemed relunctant to take on board that this was, in effect, marketing in a buyers market place. He did also state that they take GCSE results as an indicator of likely A level grades and they read every Personal Statement to make their unconditional offers. This appears to be contrary to the widely held belief on MN that it is only predicted grades that count.

Is there now pressure on RG and other universities to end this practice? Should they?

• [Please note: title edited by MNHQ - originally said 'Conditional Offers']

I think you might want to edit your thread title ☺️

Breaking news: For profit institutions offer incentives to potential customers to encourage them to buy 😉

Birmingham had previously made a statement that they were giving unconditionals to high achievers in an attampt to compete for those that might otherwise go to the Durhams, UCLs, Warwicks etc in order to bring their status up. (Not sure why Nottingham was but they have said they are not going forward).

The others are all (waits to be screamed at) lower level unis who presumably want bums on seats!

Particularly in this current application year where there are fewer 18 year olds to fill those seats.

Can anyone share this article with a token thing please.

Dd has 4 unconditional offers so interested to see where the highest levels are. And yes, one is from Lincoln. . Not sure why they hand out so many when they do have a good reputation.

Birmingham has been giving out unconditional offers for a while now - my niece is currently doing her Masters and she was given an unconditional offer over 3 years ago. It served its purpose because she did firm on the offer - but she also achieved all A* A levels so it didn't detract her from working hard but the offer did reduce the stress when sitting the exams.

I know some people are inclined to think that unconditional offers mean that "some" students don't work so hard, but for some students, an unconditional offer lifts the pressure off the final exams and can reduce anxiety.

University of Sheffield have already said they are not giving out unconditionals. They have said they want their students to be able to thrive under the conditions of the university and to be able to deal with assessments and exams. Taking an unconditional lets them sit back and coast it if they choose to. Lincoln like other more middling universities give then out to guarantee they get their places filled, it guarantees as Somethingsmellsnice says bums on seats and their £9250 tuition fees. A friend of DS's got accepted on his place at UEA with D's and E's, so it may well have been an unconditional.

The course at Lincoln which dd has an unconditional for is something like 7th in the league tables I think for that subject. I know league tables are very subjective, etc but my point is it's not a totally shit course which they'd be struggling to fill. Or shouldn't be anyway.

Her predicted grades are higher than what's required and they liked her portfolio. So I'd like to think they're trying to attract high calibre students in some cases
!

Sorry!!! Unconditional Offers - obviously.

I think Bham was certainly trying to attract the cream when my niece applied and was given an unconditional offer - she was a straight A* GCSE /A Level student - she also has a scholarship for her Masters - the Uni was certainly instrumental in helping her to secure a part-time job in her given field...

I guess there are varying reasons for making the offers - bums on seats and securing high calibre students who have no real preference out of a choice of very good Uni's.

We were at the English Lit offers day at Birmingham yesterday. DD chatted with a group of 10 or so others. She said she was the only one with an UiF but lots had reduced offers at BBB or BBC. The group swapped details and now have a Snapchat group so hopefully they'll be some friendly faces come September!

I had an unconditional offer from UCL 20+ years ago. It was a huge lifeline for me.

my point is it's not a totally shit course which they'd be struggling to fill. Or shouldn't be anyway.

Well, quite. But it's not Russell Group. Or Russel, as those who most get their knickers in a twist over the such things often seem to prefer.

You'd really think making sure the thread title makes sense would be a priority for a thread like this.

My child has an unconditional offer for a hugely popular over-subscribed course. What am I supposed to make of that?

Lincoln secured a great candidate who imho could have done better last year so I can see why they do it - it ‘works’ for them. I’m not sure it does always work for the student however.

Although.... I have a relative who is not shall we say aiming at the Russel group or even red bricks. He has secured an unconditional from an institution that he quite likes the look of and the removal of pressure for him will probably help enormously come the summer.

The institution is very much getting someone they could quite easily have got any day of the week with any offer though.

So mixed bag and odd things unconditional offers. On balance I don’t think I like them.

Ok. I’ve apologised for the error in the title. I have taken it on the chin so can posters get over it? Apologies again.

@BubblesBuddy

Sorry!!! Unconditional Offers - obviously.

We've edited the title for you now, OP.

My child has an unconditional offer for a hugely popular over-subscribed course. What am I supposed to make of that?
That the university really, really want them. May be due to excellent GCSEs, great interview, fantastic work experience/extra curriculars, amazing reference and personal statement or any combination thereof.
The course my son wants to study is also hugely popular and over-subscribed but says that it does make Unconditional offers to the very best applicants. So guess who is now working his socks off in the hope of being one of the chosen few?

I got an unconditional and 5 conditionals.
I rejected the unconditional, first choice was a mid range conditional to release some pre exam nerves, but after getting better grades than I thought I would (no self confidence, but got exactly what my teachers predicted), I conquered clearing (previously had been petrified of clearing!) and got a place at a better uni and better course than I ever imagined would want me!

The unconditional offer seemed a bit desperate on the uni’s part, so it put me off completely!

The unconditional offer seemed a bit desperate on the uni’s part, so it put me off completely!
In the olden days (ie when I applied via UCCA - pre UCAS) Unconditionals were only given to the very best applicants. It was purely to lure those star performers as they would have the pick of any uni they wanted because they were so brilliant.
Nowadays this still happens (see examples above) but the waters have now been muddied by some many uni's doing it purely to get bums on seats, not to cherry pick the superstars.

At a talk today the speaker from Uni of Nottingham said as well as the reasons already discussed above eg buns on seats, decline in number of 18 year olds, increase status of course with high calibre candidates another reason that an applicant for a highly competitive course may get a UIF is if they live/school is in a postcode where there is a low uptake of HE.

Birmingham had previously made a statement that they were giving unconditionals to high achievers in an attampt to compete for those that might otherwise go to the Durhams, UCLs, Warwicks etc in order to bring their status up. (Not sure why Nottingham was but they have said they are not going forward).

The others are all (waits to be screamed at) lower level unis who presumably want bums on seats!

Birmingham makes unconditional offers for exactly the same reason as anywhere else: to encourage students to make them their firm choice instead of somewhere else. Members of the mysterious holy brotherhood that is the thrice-worshipped Russell Group have just the same need to fill places as any other institution because, despite what most MNers believe, they are not uniquely blessed by God with a secret essence of "excellence" that will ensure their survival without mean consideration of such profane matters as making money.

One of the reasons why some other universities have struggled to fill places over the past couple of years is that Russell-Group institutions are - ssshhh, whisper it - taking lots of students who haven't met the conditions of their offers and would previously have gone to less in-demand institutions through clearing. Making unconditional offers means you don't have to admit this: you took the "brightest" (whatever that means) students on the basis of what you saw in them before they were let down by the - frankly crap - English/Welsh/Northern Irish exams system. Yes, most of those students will achieve the grades that would have been required to meet a typical Russell-Group-level offer. But the ones who don't will not force an acknowledgement of having had to lower the entry standard (because there isn't one). And they'll feel better about themselves because they're at a "proper university" while some of their mates with higher A-level/IB grades are only at "former polys" (because it's another law of the MN/Daily Mail world that these are the only two types of "so-called" university that exist). Meanwhile, students at places like Loughborough, Surrey, Leicester, Bath, etc. get on with learning stuff and acquiring marketable skills despite the apparently terminal disadvantage of not bearing the sacred mark of Russell.

I do think most people look at the course as well as the university and are not sieves to RG. However there is also a pecking order of non RG because some are 1960s universities that have never been polys, ex polys and the 1992 Group. Plus a few others I’ve probably forgotten. Most people would rate Bath and Loughborough, for example, for some courses, way above some RG universities. It really depends what you are studying. You are no more employable doing Sociology at an ex poly than you would be at Durham! Possibly less so.

There is a general move to try and remove unconditional offers (yay!!! Correct spelling). Just because a university has a few highly regarded courses, they fill up with unconditional offers elsewhere. If this is high numbers of mature students, that’s different, but others are clearly lured in to stay local. How can Lincoln justify nearly 54% unconditional when everyone says they are on the up and are clearly mid table, not bottom 25%. We seem to have too many universities so should some become colleges of higher education again? At least that would be honest!