Medicine 2020

[EightToSixer]

Ok, so I know it's super early, but I've been hovering at the medicine 18 and 19 threads. DD is keen to apply for medicine in 2020. Is anyone else in the same boat?
I thought it would be useful to share info and stories, it's all a very steep learning curve because despite me now having a PhD and working in a RG university I was late to learning and not a patch on my DD who is very driven and organised.
Hopefully people will find this group and we can share the rollercoaster of the next two years.

Hope it went well for your DD today @EightToSixer.
DD has just tried on her outfit for tomorrow and hung it on the wardrobe door ready to go. DH is taking her and I'm doing Keele next month.
Great to hear all the positive news on the thread - everyone's DC seem to be doing really well.
Please keep us in your thoughts - she looks really grown up in her suit but I think she is probably quaking on the inside. And breathe......

DD's interview at Plymouth went well today thank you for those asking. Standard MMI questions she had practiced so she was happy. Everyone was in a suit so I'm glad she wanted to wear one too. They try to release offer decisions before Christmas so that's good to hear.
Good luck to all your DCs with impending decisions, interviews, driving tests etc

Oooh, fingers crossed EightToSixer. Great that her first interview has felt good as that will help the nerves for the next ones.

Piggy - where is your DD going tomorrow?

We have Sheffield Weds and St Andrews Thurs. He is going with his GF and making it a mini-break with a couple of stops!

She is at UEA. She has refused to practice the questions out loud (to us anyway) but she has read most of the book and thought about ideas on various topics.
Great that the first interview went well and that there were no curveball questions in there. Hope UEA goes as well for DD - fingers crossed for all of our DC as they navigate their way through the next few months.

Great that it went well sixer and good luck today to piggy's dd. Monkey what a difference a year makes! Dd will have one of her parents with her for every interview but then she's only just turned 17. I smiled at your ds having himself a mini break with his gf. Good for him and good luck to him for Wednesday and Thursday. First for us on Thursday.

Can I join please?

I am a lurker on this thread but a veteran of medical school applications! With interviews coming in, I wanted to give some (hopefully) useful pointers from the other side of the interview table. By way of background - my DD is currently a GEM student having originally missed her grades at A level. She has been asked to interview for the 2020 undergraduate intake and as part of her training for this she undertook some mock interviews. Her comments were as follows:

1. Despite being mock interviews, those candidates that took the trouble to dress the part were instantly more impressive.

1. Body language is SO important. DD was astonished at the number of candidates that are unable to shake hands - particularly with a(nother) woman. Not maintaining eye contact is another turn off.

1. Know about the course at that particular medical school, research the local area and whether there are any possible health areas of interest or differences (maybe giving location away here...!)

1. Structure arguments, don't flit around trying to fit everything into your answer. Try and link your answers to your own experience. Interviewers are looking to see how you organise your thinking. Despite this being the first time that DD has ever interviewed, she could immediately spot those candidates that were over rehearsed - they often answered the question that they WANTED to answer rather than what was actually being asked.

1. With ethical questions candidates should always use the 4 pillars of ethics as the basis of their answer. Whilst it's fine to have an opinion one way or another, candidates must be prepared to justify this opinion and it is essential to recognise that there are two sides of the argument.

At the end of the day, medical schools want to see that candidates can communicate, be thoughtful and reflective, are empathetic and can work as a team - they don't need to be wowed by outstanding scientific knowledge - they'll teach you the science you need to know.

I am quite sure that none of this is news to all your DCs with interviews but hopefully it is of some use.

Best wishes to all.

Sorry also meant to add under point 2 - don't forget to smile when you introduce yourself to the interviewer.

1. With ethical questions candidates should always use the 4 pillars of ethics as the basis of their answer.*

I disagree with this completely. Many candidates play buzzword bingo, dropping beneficence, non-malfeasance, autonomy and justice into every answer, regardless of whether they're relevant. An ethical scenario might only present issues that relate to one of two of these, and crowbarring the others in just looks like answering the question you wanted to be asked rather than the one you were asked.

In any case, we should not be giving preference to applicants whose schools have taught them this list of terms over those who can actually work out the issues themselves without knowing the terms.

it is essential to recognise that there are two sides of the argument

Sorry, this is going off topic a bit, but I hate this "two sides to every story" business. Most stories/arguments have far more than two sides. Issues of medical ethics are likely to be much more nuanced than one opinion versus a diametrically opposite one.

Thanks both of you for those. It is very interesting to see the perspectives of interviewers.

SirTobyBelch - apologies, I perhaps did not explain myself very well (I am not a medic!). When I say that candidates should always ue the 4 pillars of ethics I meant that they should bear them in mind when constructing the answer - I agree that candidates should not drop buzzwords into every answer - you will see that I did also mention that candidates should answer the question they are being asked rather than the question they want to be asked.

I also agree that there are often more than two sides to every argument - again perhaps I didn't explain myself properly but what I was trying to say is that candidates should not simply present a for OR against argument.

I was simply trying to be helpful giving the opinion of my DD who is a medical student interviewing for the current intake. You are obviously much more experienced than I so I am happy to stand corrected.

Lurking here, may I join? Not applying this year but been through 2 Oxbridge cycles so I feel your pain ( and am glad of the respite!)

Not had a would- be medic in the family before but DS v keen. Only in GCSE year so obvs all depends on how they go but was wanting some advice on A level choices. He knows he needs Chemistry and Biology but really isn’t wild about either Physics or Maths - it’s the human biology that he likes. He’s thinking about History, Geography, Spanish or Theology and Philosophy. Anyone have any advice? He’ll interview very well I think but he’s not a science geek 🤓 Predicted 8s ( crosses self ) but is working v hard to get some 9s (I actually don’t recognise him! ). Would really appreciate some advice from those in the know - thank you and good luck to all.

@Oscytel GCSEs do not have to be fantastic, if they are you have more options, but as long as you have a 6 in English and Maths, and ideally at least 5 at 7+, there are plenty of options but you need to be strategic. This year Cardiff needed 9 A/8/9, Leeds is tricky without 8 A/8/9 and Oxford always needs at least 7.

You don't have to do Chemistry and Biology, but around half the med schools require both, so it keeps your options open. Newcastle don't have any A level requirements - you could do English, Art and Music!

The only one where it makes a difference to have maths or physics as well as those two is Cambridge, for ALL other medical schools Bio, Chemistry and anything else is ranked equally with Bio, Chemistry, Maths (apart from F Maths, General Studies and sometimes an A level in a native tongue other than English). My son did Chemistry, Physics and Maths because the Biology teaching was weak at his school (no A*s in his year from over 90 entries) and that got 4 interviews last year and 4 this year at the ones he likes - that is clearly not a subject combination your DS would want, I am just saying that subjects are not as rigid as people seem to think. The most important thing is that they can get AAA in the subjects they take.

@Monkey2001that’s all so helpful, thank you! I don’t think Cambridge would be on his radar in any event, so that’s not an issue. He’d like to go somewhere in London atm, def a city boy, but the A* requirement that most of the London med schools have feels like an added and avoidable risk. Didn’t know about Newcastle, who knew? Lots to think about here and clearly he will need to be strategic about his application, but we’ll see where we are post gcse. Sorry for being a bit ridiculous and premature but the whole Oxbridge thing has taught me to tread very carefully indeed; forewarned is most definitely forearmed! Thanks again.

Thanks for the interview tips, avenuekleber and sirtoby. DS1 received interview invites for Cambridge and Leicester today so will show him your pointers. Very relieved to get 2 today after a dry spell of anxious waiting!

Good news 242Mummy. My DS has Leicester 11/12 and Cambridge 12/12 - they seem to have similar taste, what were your DS's other choices?

Yay 242mummy. He must be over the moon!
Agreed thank you for the interview tips SirToby and Avenue.
Hope it went well today for dd piggy

Monkey2001 They do have similar tastes, I'd noticed that! DS1 also applied for Leeds and Norwich. We visited 5 uni open days and he went for subject masterclasses at 2 other unis and luckily he found 4 he really liked. He would be happy to spend 5-6 years at any of his choices.

HugoSpritz DS1 is just waiting for Leeds now; they've said they'll only be sending out invites from mid-Dec so we get a breather from the constant email refreshing!

The interview dates offered by Cambridge and Norwich clash so he'll have to sort it out today. AIBU to ask Cambridge to reschedule? 😅

Great news 242Mummy! And anyone else's DC receiving invitations. DS got an invitation from Leicester yesterday too. Two down, two to go. The wait is killing me! Luckily DS is more chilled than I am.

Good news Hatti. Lots of Leicester this year, last year it was lots of Sheffield.

@242Mummy, DS applied to Leeds last year and had his best interview there, but they only make offers to the top 45% or so (more like 70% at Sheffield and Newcastle). I think it would be easier to re-schedule UEA than Cambridge as they interview over a much longer period. I would suggest he contacts both asking whether they can change. When is the clash date? I guess the further away the better. Would the timings allow both? My DS has his Cambridge interviews at 8:30 and 9:30 so would be able to get to Norwich by 12:30 for a top-stress day!

Monkey2001 Ack! Your DS' Cambridge-Norwich interview day sounds extremely stressful, indeed.

DS1's clash date was 11th Dec with Cambridge at 10am and 12pm then Norwich at 2.10pm. He sorted it out today with Norwich - phoned to change date but they asked him to email request in writing. New date came within minutes - 17th Dec. Pleased that it is still this side of Christmas as he has mocks in January.

Cambridge and Leeds are DS1's aspirational choices. Offer:interview ratio is 1:4-ish. Leicester and Norwich are approx 1:2 from past years' reports. Fingers crossed he'll get a couple of offers. He's not a great talker!

The Cambridge-Norwich day was theoretical(!), he did not apply to Norwich. UEA seems to be really well run, was popular on here in past years.

Talking is a problem for lots of the boys, including mine.

Well done hatti's ds and hope it went well for your ds today monkey. Sent dd down to london this afternoon ahead of her first interview tomorrow. Eeekk.

Oscytel theology and philosophy might possibly be some help in thinking about ethics issues, have a look at the syllabus for the course. Spanish is not relevant now but gives them more choice of places to go for their elective if they keep it up. History is a good strong analytical subject, geography I dont know anything about.

Newcastle may say they dont have A level requirements (They used to require Chemistry, when did that change?) but ask them when they last took someone who didnt have Chemistry and Biology. I suspect the answer is they never have, although they may have interviewed a few.

There is always a gap between the minimum requirements stated on their websites and what medical schools end up taking. The Student Room website is a good guide to the gaps that have existed in the past. One or two medical schools may be more honest (Sheffield?) but for most you need to either attend an open day or talk to those who have to get an idea of what is likely to be a competitive application.

Newcastle may say they dont have A level requirements (They used to require Chemistry, when did that change?) but ask them when they last took someone who didnt have Chemistry and Biology. I suspect the answer is they never have, although they may have interviewed a few.

They don't have science A-level requirements. Selection for interview is based on UCAT score (although I think they also require A-level/IB predictions of AAA/38). If you get an offer after interview, it's conditional on achieving those A-level/IB grades, regardless of subjects. Obviously, most applicants will have biology or chemistry, or both, as they need them to apply to other medical schools. That doesn't mean anyone without them is at a disadvantage in Newcastle's selection process.