Imperial College, what's it really like?

[amirrorimage]

Ideally I would prefer my DCs to make evidence-based decisions for their university choices rather than from whims and possibly unfounded rumours (most arising from classmates with no direct knowledge of places). I realise that I may be fighting a losing battle though.
Imperial College is a bit of a dilemma. My DC applied there for physics without going for an open day. Recently had interview (which did not go badly) liked the interviewer but put off for several reasons. The first is that the tutorial groups are of 20 facilitated by one senior academic and one PhD student. DC is from a state school with very large sixth form classes for the maths and science so would really like smaller tutorial groups at university (as well as good quality academic teaching of course)
The second reason ars the rumours about the lack of social life at Imperial backed by the interview group being almost all international students (with international sounding American accents).
Has anybody got anything positive or reassuring to say about IC?

[amirrorimage]

I thought that I would provide an update in case it helps future decisions. DC accepted offer for theoretical physics at IC, achieved it with 4A* and has had a really good although intense term there. From conversations between students during that first week quite a large proportion doing physics or maths have four top A level grades.
DC luckily loves the buzz of London and has great accommodation at an enviable South Kensington location. However nobody seems unhappy with their accommodation despite the long commute for some from North Acton.
Basically rumours have more than an element of truth. There are quite a few first year students (particularly Asians) who stay in their hall rooms despite cajoling and some hall corridors and kitchens are less sociable than others because of this. However there are lots of very lively sociable students (including of course Asians) and plenty of opportunity to go drinking and clubbing particularly during Freshers.
The physics course has a pretty full timetable not finishing until 6 many days. Material is challenging enough with a lot of maths of course.
As at all universities there are some excellent lecturers but also some very weak ones. Tutorials are subdivided into tables of students working together through preset problems. Again tutors are variable but are there mainly to help those having problems.
The horizon course opportunities are not always taken very seriously (or at all) by the students (often because the session comes at the end of a long day) but sound well run and an added bonus.
DC plays university first team sports which does mean commutes to training locations but that commuting sounds rather sociable.

So in summary a definite thumbs-up from my DC who would not want to be anywhere else. However for those DCs worried about sociability it is true that it is easier if DC is outgoing and lives in one of the central halls. There are mixed messages from DC's friends at other London universities. Some are certainly not having the good time they were hoping for because it has been harder to make friends in halls particularly when there are quite a few older international postgraduates. Others have landed on their feet. They are also fairly budget conscious particularly if paying for commuting.

[BubblesBuddy]

I am so pleased your DC made the right decision and is happy.

I was somewhat dismayed that my comments under a different name were dismissed as being worthless by another poster but in fact are borne out by your post, amirtorimage. It is always the case that there are positives and negatives at any university and when the positives outweigh any small negatives it is the right place to be. So good luck to your DC and I feel my comments were worthwhile and accurate!

[Holly102]

Thank you OP this has been a really helpful thread.
My DD is super interested in Imperial and has applied.
However she seems to be doing more and more reading and is increasingly concerned about the social side of the uni so it’s good to hear a positive version of IC!!!

[amirrorimage]

Thanks both. There were a lot of helpful experiences and views posted on this thread and I agree Bubbles that there are of course shades of grey at any university. My sense is that London and its universities have some unique advantages and disadvantages; at best there is a sense of palpable excitement and an environment that won't be grown out of (as well as high level academics) but at worst an isolated working life rather than student experience.
DC's friends have also commented on that students from certain London schools who have remained in London for their degree tend to focus their social life around their previous network of friends and not really engage in making new friends. I had n't really thought of that before.
However to counteract that being in London means also lots of opportunity to socialise with friends at other London universities.

Imperial definitely has the overall best quality of accommodation from what I hear. I was very impressed by DC's hall.

[Needmoresleep]

"students from certain London schools who have remained in London for their degree tend to focus their social life around their previous network of friends and not really engage in making new friends."

This will fizzle out as courses become more intense and new friends get made. Some may not move on, but they will be a minority. My impression is that you don't find the same sort of private school cliques at places like Imperial or LSE that you can elsewhere, despite a relatively high proportion of UK students there being from private schools. Perhaps the restricted subject diversity and the greater diversity within the student population means students end up being more open to making friends with similar subject interests, from different backgrounds.

[amirrorimage]

Needmoresleep this comment was from
UCL students, mixture of non London private and state schools. The students who remained in a social clique (perfectly pleasant but not seeking to make friends or join in social activities beyond their exschool circle) were from Westminster school (and spanning several years and degree courses).
I am sure that it does not apply to all from that school but I can see that it could be an easy social trap for students at large London schools well represented at these universities especially if the hall is not particularly social and there are few contact hours.

[BubblesBuddy]

I think there is a fairly large degree of sticking with people you already know at a number of universities, if there re enough of your friends there of course. At small, select, universities this is perfectly possible. To some extents, these students have chosen this route with their friends. They know what they want and it’s not an accident they are keeping to their social circle. It’s not much different to some students staying in their rooms. This applies to anywhere!

[amirrorimage]

You are right BubblesBudy except that in London these social comfort zones are not restricted within a single university. Students may prefer to go out with an old school friend at a different university. That also applies to students who are not from London.

[2rebecca]

Glad it's going well. I think uni is where having strong extracurricular interests can make a big difference to students making friends and sticking with the course. lectures esp in 1st year are often large so the small social groups of sports and hobbies can make a big difference to feeling you fit in and someone cares about you and likes you.

[Needmoresleep]

"At small, select, universities this is perfectly possible. To some extents, these students have chosen this route with their friends."

Bubbles I don't think you are right, and not sure where your information comes from. Able pupils from super-selectives, and don't forget that top London day schools will send close to 50% of any cohort to Oxbridge, tend to opt for London colleges like Imperial. LSE and UCL as a second choice. Not because of friends but because the courses are seen as rigorous.

The first term is then different. DS saw a lot of school friends, and spent some time hanging out in Imperial. DD, in contrast, felt excluded slightly from her school friendship group because almost all ended up at Imperial and she was not around. But it changes, certainly from our experience, as DC became involved in their courses. Not dissimilar from the way many will use their second year to move on from the friends made in their first.

That said I don't know if this also applies to humanities students who (stereotypically) tended to have broader social circles at school, and who then don't have as many contact hours at University. Social life is very different if you don't have 9.00am labs.

DD's University experience is different. There is only one other person from her school year there and most of her friends, both from course and sport, have state backgrounds. There is apparently a big group of ex-boarders who tend to live in certain halls and perhaps take certain courses, and have a reputation for sticking together, but she has not really come across them. Perhaps the science thing again. Her course is so heavily loaded and the schedule so different, that she has had to make an effort to meet non medics, by playing for a University team rather than a medic team. Even then they thought she was antisocial as she dipped out of the post match socials early, till she explained she had to be up at 7.30 the following day to get to a remote placement. I suspect that one advantage of Imperial is that everyone is on the same sort of timetable.

[amirrorimage]

2rebecca at the least the extracurricular widens the group of friends which is in fact more the case for DC who has also made plenty of friends from hall and course including during activities organised for Imperial Fresher's week.
As Needmoresleep implies I think intensive courses tend to have more bonding with fellow course students, tutorial groups help for that.

[LoveVelo]

amirrorimage, I suspect our DC's know each other!
I read this thread with interest once my DS decided on Imperial.
He is at the North Acton accommodation and it's not been a problem. He has been safely cycling in to South Ken via canal path and shopping and gym facilities are good. It's great if your able to get accommodation nearer to the SK campus but not a disaster if you don't. Acton wasn't on his list of preferences, but was allocated in any case. Apparently lots of floor parties going on so it's as sociable as you want it to be.
Study wise, yes, it's intensive. Four days of 9 to 6 and lots of lab papers to be written up.

[BubblesBuddy]

Needmoresleep. You seem to know about science courses and super selective schools only. I can assure you that other schools do have students who choose to go to university together. State Grammars near me certainly have young people who have done that and some boarding school pupils like that idea too. They bonded at school and continue the bond at university. I don’t really see how your view is more valid than mine because you are very selective on courses and schools. Very many students live at Home precisely to continue with existing friendships. It’s the norm now at very many universities.

I can see that some courses are more intense but we know several science degree students who went with friends to the same university. They also made new friends so early starts and longer days didn’t mean they didn’t mix or dropped their original friends. DD had early starts some days on an MFL course. DH did Engineering and had lots of time for extra activities. Some people have a lot of energy and place a lot of importance on their social life! Work hard and play hard surviving on little sleep!

I think students make friends with anyone who is like them. They may be from the course or in the hall of residence or at a club/society. It doesn’t really matter as long as the friendships are fun, beneficial and supportive.

[amirrorimage]

LoveVelo and if they don't yet there is a good chance that they will meet.
How long does it take your DS to cycle in? He must be saving a lot by avoiding paying for transport and having cheaper accommodation than compared to the more central halls' rents.

[amirrorimage]

LoveVelo and if they don't yet there is a good chance that they will meet.
How long does it take your DS to cycle in? He must be saving a lot by avoiding paying for transport and having cheaper accommodation than the central halls' rents.

[amirrorimage]

LoveVelo and if they don't yet there is a good chance that they will meet.
How long does it take your DS to cycle in? He must be saving a lot by avoiding paying for transport and having cheaper accommodation than the central halls' rents.

[amirrorimage]

Apologies for triple posting

[LoveVelo]

amirrorimage you mentioned upthread which specific physics course your DC is on - same as my DS!
It takes him about 25 mins and there's locked cycle stores at both North Acton and South Ken, apparently last leg of the ride over Hyde Park is lovely. Saving £20 to £25 a week on tube. (Apparently Wednesdays can be a short day with only one lecture so he sometimes stays at halls and watches live online.) He does have an Oyster for occasions such as bad weather though.

Re the social life comments - there's a fair few students from University of Arts London housed at the Costume Store (same site as North Acton) so apparently the hall/ floor parties have a decent mix.

[amirrorimage]

Ah I see re course. I am not sure how many there are in a year.
Sounds as though there are definite pluses to the North Acton halls.

[sothatdidntwork]

"I think there is a fairly large degree of sticking with people you already know at a number of universities, if there re enough of your friends there of course."

I have read this on mn before - are there any universities particularly known for attracting such groups? Only one factor amongst many when choosing where to apply, of course, but may be worth knowing about for those who won't be in such a group! Sorry, this is derailing the thread - but as a phenomenon it's worth knowing about!

[Calicoco]

Really interesting thread. My DS has an offer from Imperial for physics and I must admit to sharing some of the concerns expressed by posters in the early part of the thread about the social life and accommodation. However, I think it would be an amazing opportunity. He's really excited about the course and I'm reluctant to dampen his enthusiasm by focusing on the potential difficulties that come with studying in London, but I think he's aware of them to an extent.

DS wouldn't know anyone at Imperial, or any of the other London universities for that matter. But he's looking forward to making new friendships from his course, halls and societies, so hopefully there won't be too many impenetrable cliques.

Having said that, I studied in London back in the dark ages and was in the same position, but ended up having a great time...

[Needmoresleep]

didntwork, I doubt this is a factor at Imperial, simply because the grade requirements are so high.

My observation, from academic London days schools (as Bubbles points out - though in fairness I was responding to OPs mention of a specific school), is that Imperial and similar London Universities are pretty natural fallbacks for good scientists who don't achieve an Oxbridge offer. Native Londoners are not put off studying in London in the way others might, plus there are several super-selectives where a good section of the cohort will get the grades.

Despite this I can't see any of DCs friends choosing a University because their friends were there. It was almost always about course. I too learnt about it on MN.

In terms of cliques, some Universities have a reputation for attracting boarding school types, who like to stick together. Bristol is one. Exeter
another. But even so, any such group will be a minority, and there should only be an issue if you pick the wrong hall. DD reports that there are relatively few ex-private school kids either in the sport she plays or on her course, with a large number coming from the North, all seemingly on their own. She, like they, is more than happy to make friends through shared interests rather than background.

Imperial will have even less of this. Yes, there will be Londoners (rich and poor) and overseas students who don't socialise at University. But my impression is that very bright mathematicians and scientists tend to enjoy each other's company, regardless of background. Selective London day schools are already very diverse, reflecting the diversity of those working in senior positions in London, and the very international environment at Imperial renders any "what school did you go to" question pretty provincial. Universities like Imperial and LSE, despite being in the same City, often seem suit bright former private school pupils because they are culturally a step away from school, whereas to some extent Oxford can be more of the same. I know my neighbours son regrets being funnelled towards Oxford when in retrospect UCL/Imperial might have suited him better.

[sothatdidntwork]

Thanks Needs, that is very interesting. Imperial isn't in the mix here - as it doesn't do the relevant subjects - but very interesting to read what you say about the cultural difference from school as compared with Oxford. Anyway, I think non London universities (non Oxbridge) will be the relevant category under consideration!

I see your point that it's only a small minority sticking together, but I am not sure that's it's still an insignificant phenomenon, having seen several references on mn! And of course the problem with not choosing the wrong hall is that unless you're already in the know you won't know it is the wrong hall until you get there!

These 'soft' non-course related points could be quite important, but it can be difficult to find out about them. For instance I hear there are some universities where a higher proportion of students head home at weekends rather than stay around, which could be quite demoralising for the stayers. But which are those universities are, I have no idea! Of course none of this will matter to the socially gregarious, but for others it may be an additional hurdle.

[BubblesBuddy]

From what we have observed with frineds of DDs and children of friends is that there are nuances at universities and there is a certain amount of choosing with your tribe.

As an example: At Bristol, ex boarding school pupils rather like Wills because it is catered with occasional formal meals. It is what they are used to. The quad building is especially attractive to them. They are shared old fashioned bathrooms, old furniture in the rooms and only a tiny kitchenette. Other boarding schools pupils like Churchill and quite a few Harrow boys go for this hall. Both halls are near to each other so you can keep friendships going if you wish.

St Andrews is very popular with private school pupils. It is a small town so knowing your "tribe" is good for your social life. Other universities such as Exeter are similar and very popular with pupils from my local grammar schools. Of course pupils do look at the courses but not forensically. So doing History at Bristol or Birmingham, the student may choose where they feel more comfortable. That applies to any pupil from any school.

There is also a big phenomenon of students staying at hoe and going to the local university or not far. A friend has just done a degree at Liverpool. Far fewer students from the South than the North on her course. Northern students seem increasingly interested in staying in the North. London students may well stay at home and commute. These were actually a majority on DDs London course.

As for students who go home, this is quite a phenomenon at some "leafy" universities. Royal Holloway is one and anywhere that has students who can get home easily, to London. Most RG universities do not have this phenomenon but once you get universities recruiting students locally by giving them lower offers, you will get far more local students and they go home.

[amirrorimage]

I have heard that the English students at Edinburgh also group together in private school cliques. May not be true of course.

Imperial does not appear to be cliquey apart from some Asian students talking Chinese to each other.