Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Guest posts

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Guest post: Sandi Toksvig - "The time is right for the Women's Equality Party"

533 replies

MumsnetGuestPosts · 06/11/2015 17:49

I'm rather old fashioned in my beliefs. I always thought that when Parliament passed a law, people were supposed to take notice. So how is it that 45 years ago an Equal Pay Act was introduced, and yet no one has really acted to make sure we get it? When I mentioned the gender pay gap to the environment minister, Liz Truss, she said "It's smaller than it's ever been." It's at 19%. How big was it before?

Much of the world baffles me. How does the UK tolerate the fact that so many women because they are women still live in poverty, suffer harassment and violence, and abandon careers they enjoy because of the exorbitant costs of childcare? I've come to the sad conclusion that in its current form our political system can't be trusted to deal with any of this. There are twice as many men as women in the House of Commons, and they seem to spend most of their time shouting and jeering at one another. Frankly, like many of you, I'm embarrassed by it. Seven months ago, in conversation with my friend Catherine Mayer, I realised it was time for us to take matters into our own hands.

So in March 2015 we founded the Women's Equality Party, a new political force that (we hoped) would unite people of all genders, ages, backgrounds, ethnicities, beliefs and experiences in the shared determination to see women enjoy the same rights and opportunities as men. It would be something new. Non-partisan. Attracting people from the left, from the right, from the centre. People who have had enough of waiting for equality. I have to say even at my most ambitious and optimistic, I could not have predicted the flood of support that soon washed over us. Within seven months WE have more than 50,000 members and supporters, ably led by Sophie Walker, 65 branches across the country and will be standing candidates in the spring elections.

This is not some dreamy group wistfully hoping for change. Late last month, just six months after that initial conversation, I found myself sitting in a hall packed with cheering activists and supporters, clutching a book of wonderfully pragmatic policy proposals. Policies developed through close consultation with experts and our members, and representing the experiences and concerns of thousands of women and men across the country.

WE heard from mothers who want to go back to work but can't, because of crippling childcare costs, and because so few workplaces have actually embraced flexible working.

WE heard from mothers who choose to stay at home, but feel dismissed by society for doing so because, despite its immense value, caring labour is still not recognised, respected and supported.

WE heard from fathers who desperately want to share the joys and responsibilities of parenthood, but are stigmatised for wanting to balance work and home life.

All these experiences reinforced our awareness that care is not taken seriously in our society, nor are the people who care.

WE want to change that.

That's why we propose a dramatic overhaul of parental leave policy. We would guarantee both parents six weeks of non-transferable leave on 90% pay, with an additional 10 months of shared parental leave at statutory pay. This policy would, of course, encompass same-sex couples and adoptive parents, while single parents would be entitled to nominate a second caregiver.

Once this period of leave has passed, WE believe that families should immediately have access to affordable, high-quality childcare. The educational benefits of childcare are clearest in the first 15 hours a week, so those hours should be entirely state funded, with the rest payable at one pound per hour by parents.

These policies are good for women, who have greater freedom to balance work and home life (which will, of course, mean different things to different people). But they're also excellent for men who, for too long, have been excluded from participating fully in family life because care is seen as unmanly, and paternity leave as unprofessional.

Of course, all of our policies require a blend of legislative and cultural change. The reason the Equal Pay Act still isn't working properly is because back in 1970 we changed the law without changing the way people think.

And that's where education comes in.

Many people think equality in education has already been achieved, since girls consistently outperform boys academically. But education is about more than grades, it's about learning how to live, and work, and build relationships. And at present, our children are learning to live according to ludicrous, outdated notions of 'masculine' and 'feminine' behaviour.

So WE want more diverse role models for both boys and girls, starting with encouraging more men to enter primary school teaching and other caring roles. And WE want careers guidance that pays no heed to gender when helping young people to map their futures. And WE want proper, honest sex and relationships education to finally become a reality.

It all sounds very obvious and straightforward, doesn't it? Sadly, enacting these policies will be a lot harder than formulating them. And that's why WE need you. Join us, share your ideas. The time is right for this movement, and WE want you to be part of it.

Photo: Fiona Hanson

OP posts:
EmpressKnowsWhereHerTowelIs · 09/11/2015 19:36

Confused Women's Hour? Loose Women?

You missed the bits about rape crisis centres, prisons & teenage girls in school changing rooms then?

Trans people can have whatever they like. Rights, space, identity. It's when they start trying to take them from women that's the problem.

kua · 09/11/2015 19:40

Crazy If you want to have a "transgender hour" on the radio, "loose transgenders"on the tv feel free to get in contact/campaign with the media to request this. I would support you on this.

In regards to women only gymns/changing areas there in we will have to differ. As I believe in safe areas for girls/women.

Crazygirl123 · 09/11/2015 19:40

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Crazygirl123 · 09/11/2015 19:43

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

kua · 09/11/2015 19:44

Eh? Video gaming, sheds? I do/ have both still identify as a woman. Though to be fair don't belong to a gentleman's club? However, as Oscar Wilde said ..
.

EmpressKnowsWhereHerTowelIs · 09/11/2015 19:56

My DSis and DBIL have a shed each.

Ignoring that though...

Why are you insisting on shoving into women's safe spaces when we're making it so clear why we we're fighting to keep them? Why are you stealing our identities and silencing our voices? A lot of us used to be trans allies. Fight for your own spaces and we'll be right beside you. Keep on like this and the gap between us is just going to get wider.

Crazygirl123 · 09/11/2015 20:00

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

kua · 09/11/2015 20:03

No, they don't. There I said it .

Crazygirl123 · 09/11/2015 20:07

Yes they do

DioneTheDiabolist · 09/11/2015 20:22

So there are no reliable/any stats. Yet some feminists here are saying that we cannot redress the systemic inequality in our society until the trans issue is sorted as it skews the stats wrt to pay, poverty and healthcare for women.

Archery, Stromba and other posters who argue that this point, can you provide me with the statistics that have convinced you that this is the most important issue facing women in the UK today.

kua · 09/11/2015 20:23

"Crazy" I dont wish to argue with you. I'm stating fact, whether you like it or not.

There are plenty of comments above and on other threads where women have stated their concerns on very valid/salient points yet you have chosen to break it down to nonsense.

I have much respect for the apparently few vocal Trans who are able to see both sides and are able to put their view across without damaging the hard fought won rights of women.

ArcheryAnnie · 09/11/2015 20:23

But they aren't women, Crazygirl, if they have working penises and male bodies.

kua · 09/11/2015 20:27

DIONE How do you define a Trans woman?

hedgehogsdontbite · 09/11/2015 20:44

How can you have a reasonable discussion with someone who equates loss of single sex rape crisis centres with loss of a shed?

I think I've well and truely fallen down the rabbit hole.

kua · 09/11/2015 21:00

You can't, I'm right behind you...

DioneTheDiabolist · 09/11/2015 21:02

When I see a valiant points, backed up with accurate statistics I will consider them and the impact they have on the very real issues facing women today. I have been told on this this thread that the trans issue is skewing stats to the extent that we cannot progress until it is sorted out.

I have seen no stats. Kua, you have said that they don't exist. So how do we know that they are skewed to such an extent that the WEP cannot progress the cause of equality for women until it is sorted out?

kua · 09/11/2015 21:11

Don't skew my words.

First of all you did not answer my question.

How would you state who a transfer woman is? You apparently have an idea better than rest of us. So, please share.

kua · 09/11/2015 21:16

^transgender

howtorebuild · 09/11/2015 21:22

Are you suggesting no further talk happens unless your questions are answered first? Shock

DioneTheDiabolist · 09/11/2015 21:48

No one has answered my question regarding the stats that they mentioned. If someone is telling me that there exists an issue so big that the progress of women's equality cannot be forwarded, I want to see them. And they better be concrete and substantial.

What would you call people who try to stall the progress of the women's movement in the UK Kua?

kua · 09/11/2015 21:55

Still haven't answered my question. How would you state a transwoman is?

Dione How would you state a woman is?

DioneTheDiabolist · 09/11/2015 22:04

Kua, I did not compile the statistics. If I were to be shown them, I would look at the criteria used to define trans.

I would state that a woman is one of the 32million people in the UK who do not have equality because of their gender. Please tell me why you think the existence of ? trans should stall this effort?

Kittlekattle · 09/11/2015 22:18

The number of transgender people is small, perhaps 0.2% of the population although trans groups suggest that this is an understimate and with the expanding definition trans groups estimate more like 1-2% as a conservative estimate.

So, if by statistics you are refering to averages, then obviously these numbers are not likely to have a huge effect in the vast majority of cases.

However, statistics is not just averages but is about how samples are chosen, how the data is collected, what measures are used and how they are reported. Lies, damned lies, and statistics and all that.

So to specifically address a couple of those points you raise Dione.

Health

  • The example I was thinking about was the fact that there are campaigns for sex/gender to no longer be recorded in birth certificates because of fear of discrimination transgender people have if they have to present a birth certificate to work etc. If birth certificates don't record sex then some research that reveals inequalities against women and girls cannot be done. So, to please 0.2% certain health data cannot be gathered as relates to the female sex as a whole population. For example, historically (in the UK, still an issue in other parts of the world) birth certificate data helped reveal the excess mortality of teenage girls relative to boys. For a specific recent example see this article in the Lancet appropriately titled 'A scandal of invisibility: making everyone count by counting everyone':

www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(07)61307-5/abstract

In particular see the data on the 5th page in the grey box talking about the improved use of data for birth monitoring in India which directly revealed the scope and scale of the selective abortion of female fetuses.

Violence:
Here, the absolute numbers could be quite dramatically be altered by the inclusion of transwomen into the female statistics. This is because of the difference in numbers between female and male offenders. For example, in 2011 there were 103 female sex offenders in prison. This is less than 1% of the total number of sex offenders in prison at that time. If transwomen are to suddenly be counted in female statistics then that might easily lead to a dramatic increase in absolute numbers. As in my previous post, transwomen offend at the same rate as males not females so therefore if even 0.2% (20 people) are to be counted in the female statistics suddenly that leads to the statistic (and headline): '20% rise in female sex offenders'.

Poverty:
I agree that statistics on average salaries are not likely to be affected by a few transwomen. However, the range or in particular groups might be. For example, the highest paid CEO in 2013 was a transwoman. Now I don't hugely care about the ridiculous pay of a few individuals, male or female, but if that is then used as a reason to say the glass ceiling has been broken and to pat ourselves on the back for all we have achieved for gender equality then I do have an issues with it.

You might rightly say that there are other better measures than CEO pay when considering poverty and I would absolutely agree with you. However, these kind of outliers and accurate but misleading statistics are used to argue that feminism has already won and to distract efforts away from the millions of women in poverty. Look at the fact the guest post on equal pay day is subtitled 'the gender pay gap isn't a myth'.

This is a government who are quite happy to abandon measurements of child poverty to hide the fact more children are living below the breadline in this country. I have no doubt that they would be more than happy to use statistics other than simple averages to prove how women-friendly they are.

I still do agree with you though - there are bigger issues. But I still think the risk to eroding women's rights needs to be at least seen. I also think that we can still support transwomen in certain areas, off the top of my head - maybe the short form of the birth certificate could make no mention of sex but it still be recorded for the long certificate and official data. I also think that the WEP should be campaigning for decent data on measures like child poverty or the pay gap whatever possible causes of bias or error. And when looking at crime, male violence is the problem to be named and addressed and people of all genders would benefit from a reduction on that.

And if the Men's Equality Party want to campaign for sheds, do feel free.

kua · 09/11/2015 22:18

Oh please, through this thread we have had a fair discussion. But, here we go, shut down for daring to discuss female issues.

Still never answered. .

Crazygirl123 · 09/11/2015 22:38

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.