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Gifted and talented

Talk to other parents about parenting a gifted child on this forum.

School for the gifted

412 replies

NameChangedNoImagination · 05/05/2019 19:07

If there was a school for the gifted, would you send your child? I would have loved one when I was a child. Where learning is accelerated to your own pace and where you have time and encouragement to study special interests.

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Hollowvictory · 06/05/2019 12:32

Would it not need to be quite specialised? We have 'gifted' Gymnasts and swimmers at our school, their needs are v different so they only attend school in the mornings and they train at their gym in the afternoons.

RomanyQueen1 · 06/05/2019 12:35

Yes, there is a school for gifted children and yes I let my dd attend, boarding.
She said if I didn't let her go she would never forgive me.

Hollowvictory · 06/05/2019 12:37

Roman what is your dd gifted at?

BogglesGoggles · 06/05/2019 12:37

Isn’t that what private schools are? They only admit the most capable students are tailor curriculums. They used to do all kinds of things for us when I was at school. I was only in class half the time, the rest of the time I was attending endless workshops, extension classes etc. They arranged for one girl who was particularly talented in mathematics to attend lectures at our local university.

Hollowvictory · 06/05/2019 12:41

Boggles, no, not at all. Some private schools have entrance examinations, some don't. Even the ones that do, don't only take gifted children, they take those that pass their examinations. There are several private schools where we live that have no acedemic entry criteria whatsoever and some that are known as being good for the less academically able.
I guess choir schools, music schools, conservatoires take those that are musically talented. 🎶

RomanyQueen1 · 06/05/2019 12:43

It's music. She went in Y7, currently Y10 and she absolutely loves it.
Great for those who can take lots of pressure, they are always on the go.

AlexaShutUp · 06/05/2019 12:49

No. My dd has learnt an enormous amount from being in the comprehensive system. There are other ways of ensuring that she is stretched, but for me, breadth and depth of education is more important than the speed of progression. I am thankful for her exposure to a wide cross section of society and for the learning which has ensued from that.

LondonGirl83 · 06/05/2019 23:55

Alex why wouldn't a school for the gifted contain a wide cross section of society? Giftedness is the special reserve of any on segment of society...

I would. Some gifted children can thrive without appropriate academic challenge but many can't with quite negative personal consequences.

I suppose it all comes down to the personalities involved to understand what would suit best.

AlexaShutUp · 07/05/2019 00:44

Alex why wouldn't a school for the gifted contain a wide cross section of society? Giftedness is the special reserve of any on segment of society...

Sorry, my meaning was obviously unclear. I did not mean to suggest that giftedness is limited to a particular class or race or whatever. Merely that a school for gifted children by definition limits its intake only to those who are gifted, and I find that rather narrow.

The world is not full of gifted people, and I want my dd to study alongside both those who are gifted and those who are not, to discover that she might have things in common with kids who are very different from herself, and to learn that everyone has something to contribute. I don't want her to live in a bubble full of people just like her. I want her to learn to get on with those who are not like her too, and to realise that everyone has equal value, whether they are gifted or not. Personally, I don't believe that these aims would be best served by placing her in a school full of kids just like her, but I do understand why other parents might choose this. Just not what I would choose.

NameChangedNoImagination · 07/05/2019 00:55

Boggles your school sounds interesting. Where did you go, if it's not too outing?

I went to private school and was in no way stretched academically unfortunately.

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NameChangedNoImagination · 07/05/2019 00:58

Hollow really I meant for the academically gifted rather than sports or music.

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NameChangedNoImagination · 07/05/2019 01:02

LondonGirl83 Yes the emotional consequences of not working to your potential can be devastating for a gifted child. Also intelligent people are much more likely to suffer from mental conditions, perhaps partly because of the stress of being so different, and maybe it just goes with the territory. A school for the gifted could help in both these ways.

We have provisions for children with IQs of 50, with special schools etc, and we realize just how different they are to the norm. What about children with IQs of 150? Why do we pretend they are normal or should be educated as such?

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Hollowvictory · 07/05/2019 08:42

Op how would you identify those that are academically gifted though? Often the most gifted don't do well in tests, or behave particularly well at school. What about twice exceptionals?

BallyHockeySticks · 07/05/2019 10:35

What about children with IQs of 150? Why do we pretend they are normal or should be educated as such?

OK I'll bite. People with IQs of 150 are "normal".

Excellent provision was made for my IQ thanks, I went to one of the most academically stretching schools in the country and on top of that I was accelerated a year. The emotional consequences that, all in the name of enabling me to achieve my full potential, were devastating. My own children go to state comprehensive for much the same reasons as Alexashutup.

Shutting me away in an even smaller school with even cleverer people would have probably broken me even more, I reckon.

NameChangedNoImagination · 07/05/2019 11:38

Bally sorry to hear that . What were the emotional consequences?

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RomanyQueen1 · 07/05/2019 14:49

I think you also need to ask if you would be happy for your child to board.
just as with the specialist music schools there won't be enough children who are gifted in one place to warrant a day school.
It's something to consider when you apply for the existing schools for gifted children. My dd school they come from all over the world, if we just contained the school to the UK they'd still need to board.

AlexaShutUp · 07/05/2019 17:35

People with IQs of 150 are "normal".

I completely agree, and don't think you do children any favours by labelling them as different.

It's true that some children with extremely high IQs experience social and emotional difficulties. However, that is equally true of some children with average IQs. It's impossible to generalise.

In the long term, I don't think it's helpful to label kids and send them off to special schools because it creates too much pressure. In many cases, you'd just be setting them up to fail under the weight of great expectations. Most of the studies indicate that social and emotional intelligence have a greater impact on future success (and probably happiness too) than IQ. Putting kids into an artificial environment which doesn't support them to develop those skills is less than ideal in my view.

I also wouldn't want my dc to board as I think parental influence and support is probably the most important factor in a child's development.

GrasswillbeGreener · 07/05/2019 18:15

I'm speaking mainly from my personal experience here. Developing socially is much more easily done if you have common ground with a group. Most bright children can thrive in a typical school. But a minority of bright children will have very little in common with even the brightest in an average mixed class. I strongly agree with someone above mentioning breadth and depth as most important in educating academically gifted youngsters - and where you might achieve that in a school setting for the 1% or even the 0.1%, the 0.01% need something rather different to approach achieving their potential. Only some of that 0.01% get that opportunity.

I was probably in the 0.01%. My school experience was miserable at times and boring at others. My potential was not nearly tapped although my parents did a lot to encourage my interests, and near the end of school I achieved a lot through olympiad training. Apart from that, I didn't learn how to knuckle down and work steadily - my last minute work regularly got top marks. Last minute continued into university and I didn't really start to run into problems until well into my 2nd year. Crashed and burned in my 4th year yet still did well enough for a solid 1st class degree. A different earlier educational path could have made a difference. I eventually discovered I was a people person - at the age of 22, having always thought I must be an introvert based on how I interacted with most people I knew. Once I was at university I had a more genuine peer group in which to become (somewhat) socially skilled.

So a question is how can you provide the right opportunities to the 0.01%? Highly selective schools can sometimes do it, but can still suffer from being curriculum bound. Boarding would be necessary to get sufficient numbers in one place except in the largest cities. Nowadays the ability to provide real enrichment material via the internet can be a game changer for these children; so I think I'd advocate for short-term residential activities supplemented by online challenges. Meeting and getting to know others "like yourself" can really help children develop self-confidence and a positive identity.

We are very privileged to have been able to obtain subsidised boarding education for our youngest that puts him in an environment with others of very high ability - his progress socially in just a year of that environment is amazing. His sister would have benefited from something similar but I suspect the environment created when you put a group of very bright girls together is somewhat different, so she is in a different sort of school. And socially still feeling fairly isolated though she is not without friends. It is hard to tell but I would guess both are more the 0.1% than the 0.01%. She is as far as I can tell, being realistically challenged in her favoured humanities subjects; has been pushed somewhat in maths; but in sciences her relative disinterest has been strengthened by the boredom of GCSE work (sitting exams this year). Her brother's school, as I understand it, will take them beyond GCSE work then ensure they are ready for the actual exam content near the time.

For me, in the place I grew up, acceleration and permission, as a girl, to attend one of the top boys' schools might just have done the trick ... but both options were as unfeasible as each other at that time and place. A few years after I finished, acceleration became quite fashionable for a while - but as they were trying (to be "fair") to accelerate not the 0.01% nor the 0.1%, but more like the top 5%, the demands of such a system were too great for the majority of children offered it, and I doubt it took long before people could turn around and say, "See, we told you, acceleration is not a good idea".

So yes, for me a "school for the gifted", even if it had been a long way from home, might have been great even as young as 8 or 9.

BertrandRussell · 07/05/2019 18:19

“Also intelligent people are much more likely to suffer from mental conditions, ”

Source, please?

bluejelly · 07/05/2019 18:24

School is only partly about learning. It's also about socialisation. Sectioning high achievers off for their school career is neither good for them nor their 'average' peers. We all need to learn to get on/survive with everyone.

NameChangedNoImagination · 07/05/2019 18:42

Bertrand you really could have googled it, but here's one anyway:
www.scientificamerican.com/article/bad-news-for-the-highly-intelligent/

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sleepingdragon · 07/05/2019 18:59

@NameChangedNoImagination that study just shows that Mensa members are more likely to experience other conditions than average- I dont think anyone would argue that Mensa members are representative of all intelligent people? I dont mean that in a bitchy way about Mensa, but people tend to join the society because they feel excluded in other areas of their lives, and this is likely to be due to other factors rather than just their IQ.

BertrandRussell · 07/05/2019 19:01

Any that don’t just ask Mensa
Members? That article says itself that it needs to be treated with extreme caution.....

Applesbananaspears · 07/05/2019 19:02

Surely to go for a superselectove grammar school or a highly academic private school. There will be plenty of gifted children in those and to be fair, a good comprehensive will also have their share too

RomanyQueen1 · 07/05/2019 19:12

I disagree that a Comp would be able to cater for extremely gifted children. How on earth could they teach someone in a class that was 3 years ahead of their peers.
Yes, they can get a specialist in for out of school or liaise with a university for some lessons to be taken there, but this isn't common place and provided nationally.
My dd is music not academic but even as an 8 year old we were told that they couldn't offer her a fitting education. We were told it would be the same throughout school.
if you have an academically gifted child, years beyond their peers there should be provision as there is for music.
However, as there are unlikely to be a school full of these children in each town they'd need to be situated where children could travel and board.