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Gifted and talented

Talk to other parents about parenting a gifted child on this forum.

Original poster

Thank you MN Towers for this topic

154 replies

RTKangaMummy · 15/05/2006 13:57

Thank you MN towers

I know certain other posters are being really immature and silly about this topic

We will get picked on for posting on here

And certain other posters will be not be able to cope with a new topic

Why should it harm them to have this topic???

We are told off if we post in Education

My DS is SEN and GT so has different needs in both camps

For example, he is in top 2% for English in the country with a very high IQ but has dyspraxia and hypermobilty in his joints which means this week his classmates are doing cycling proficiency at school but he is unable to ride a bike well enough to be able to join in. SO he is the only one in his class not able to join in.

SO you guys can PARP and tease me all you like but I don't care.

You can just go and post somewhere else and link to newspaper articles about pushy parents all you like I don't care

.

OP posts:
Original poster
RTKangaMummy · 15/05/2006 21:04

Has it made it better changing schools?

OP posts:
harpsichordcarrier · 15/05/2006 21:07

actually, I am interested in this now - never really thought about it before.
I am very uncomfortable witht he idea that being gifted and talented is a SEN and is subject to diagnosis in a similar way to autism. I am not at all sure that this can help the individual child (for example, I would be astonished if being designated as G&T would reduce the chances of being bullied) or the education system as a whole (singling out the "clever" ones - what does this mean for the rest?).
Interested to see what practical difference it might make/have made to anyone here.
I have to say that I would have been appalled to be labelled in this way at school. Utterly appalled.

zippitippitoes · 15/05/2006 21:11

I'm certain it's not subject to diagnosis in the same way as autism

but the Government has said that provision and identification has to take place in schools (see earlier link)

Gillian76 · 15/05/2006 21:11

I think it's the terminology that gets on peoples goat. Gifted suggests the individual is somehow superior to the rest of the human race. It is also a general term, labelling the "child" as "gifted and talented" in all he/she does.

Having taught in primary school for the best part of 6 years I have seen evidence of children's gifts and talents in many areas which would not permit them access to this narrow category. As far as I know we do not have this in Scottish education and rightly so I would say. I believe it is unneccessary.

FWIW, myself and my DH were both academically in the top 2-3% of our year groups and both suffered derision because of this. Both of us endured a little boredom in school as well. But both of us have grown into well-rounded individuals with good careers without the aid of a G&T programme.

My DD started school last year and doubtless she is bored by much of what she does at school. But I see it as my duty as a parent to provide her with opportunities to learn above and beyond what she does at school. After all parents are the most important teachers of our children.

Labelling of children in this way is, IMHO, unneccessary and will in the end lead to more division in the education system.

figroll · 15/05/2006 21:13

I don't think I want anything in particular for my dd, I just want the teachers to respond to her in an appropriate way. They just give her more of the same, because she finishes quickly, or get her to help the others. I don't even want her to be "labelled" as g and t, that is a govt thing. I just want her to be taught and not ignored, as she has been since about year 2.

Not to worry, she goes to grammar school in Sept and hopefully they can provide the education that she needs and that I have paid for (as a taxpayer).

I would also just like to be able to say my dd is very clever and I am really proud of her.

Blandmum · 15/05/2006 21:14

FWIW I don't think that being g and t gives you sn like being autistic.

And if there is cash to be spent, first it should go to those who's SEN are more 'conventional....for want of a better word.

But real top of the range G and T is a special need....just in a very different way.

What I find with lots of thse kids is that they need to be shown this it is actualy OK to excel. That you can be good without someone saying you are big headed, that you mother hot housed you and that your family are all smug. It is saying to these kids (and all the others while you ae at it), you go and be the best 'you' that you can. And don't you worry what people say.

I teach a class of thse kids atm. They can be themselves, it is fab, And they are not boffs and misfits and snobs and smug, they are just themselves. Why should they pretend to be what they are not, just to make ol cod face happy? (harpie?? Grin)

Gillian76 · 15/05/2006 21:14

Oh yes and I agree, I would have died at being labelled G&T at school.

Kids are cruel and most of them will endure bullying for some reason or other. Doubt being part of any G&T programme or whatever would improve this.

figroll · 15/05/2006 21:15

I have never been able to say that last bit before in public.

Blandmum · 15/05/2006 21:17

Any child will tell you who is top of the class. they already know who the g and t kids are. Pretending that those kids are average doen't 'protect' them

Original poster
RTKangaMummy · 15/05/2006 21:18

For English at primary level it hasn't made any difference for DS, he is the only one in his class

He still had to do all the practise papers for SATs

If it had been maths he would have been doing year 7 maths

But English is difficult for them to teach at different levels

So he just writes stories etc and reads whatever he can at home

Next year it will be better as he will be stretched etc. And he will be starting Latin which he is really looking forward to.

So he is not a GT at school cos they don't do anything for him

OP posts:
zippitippitoes · 15/05/2006 21:19

It's surely because talent is derided and kids are encouraged to hide their light under a bushell that kids who have great potential fail to achieve..I think this is what the government programme is trying to address..especially for those whose parents are not likel y to recognise or be able to provide for their children's talents

Gillian76 · 15/05/2006 21:19

I just can't get over labelling the whole child g and t. Surely the ones who can do trigonometry at 6 are not the best artists and the best at technology too?

Original poster
RTKangaMummy · 15/05/2006 21:19

Figroll Smile

Yes all the children know DS is top in English just as they also know that J & B are top in Maths

OP posts:
Original poster
RTKangaMummy · 15/05/2006 21:21

Gillian DS is not whole child GT

Maths is deffo not GT

Physically deffo not GT

OP posts:
Gillian76 · 15/05/2006 21:21

And would they excel at gardening if it were on the curriculum too?

zippitippitoes · 15/05/2006 21:21

and in fact it's why kids as a whole fail to achieve because success is seen as nerdy

coppertop · 15/05/2006 21:21

WRT whether or not being G&T can be classed as SN, at ds2's latest meeting with the Paed I was told that ds2's official diagnosis should be that he is autistic and incredibly bright. Make of that what you will.

Gillian76 · 15/05/2006 21:21

But that is the implication with the label and that is what gets people annoyed.

zippitippitoes · 15/05/2006 21:23

yes..horticulture is a school subject ds did well in city and guilds at 16

figroll · 15/05/2006 21:23

Why get annoyed if someone's child is cleverer than yours? A fact of life, surely. I know loads of people who are cleverer than me, but I am not annoyed about it - well I might be just a bit!!!

Blandmum · 15/05/2006 21:23

But that isn't how it works.

There are two parts to the sceme.

Gifted kids are the ones you are thinking about. they tend to be very, very good at a range of things, often the conventionaly academic subjects, like English , maths and sciences. talented children are very, very good at one thing, could be maths, copud be football, could be art or music etc.

5-10% of every school should be listed as g and t.....so some schools will be setting the bar higher than others....kids in grammer schools on the regester will have different selection criteria than those in inner city schools with a 15% A8 tC GCSE pass rate.

This isn't about selecting Einseins, but streching and broadening the most able. (I taech BTW which is why I know this stuff, none of my kids are on the regester)

NotAnOtter · 15/05/2006 21:23

I always remember standing next to a neighbour who was a 'runner' at a school sports day. My DS was maybe 8 - his birthday is 20th August so he is young in the year. My neighbours daughter was an athlete and stormed the mixed sex race winning it easily and of course my neighbour was screaming encouragement and quite rightly brimming with pride.
My son was approximately 8th from last in the whole yeargroup and as he came round the final corner a good five minutes after my neighbours daughter he plodded round leaning forward looking half dead ..( me all choked up nowBlush) he waved at me a HUGE wave and a smile and i was so red and embarrased i barely waved back.

Now 6 years later he is a bright spark won two yeargroup prizes this year and is top of his class in a top school ( state grammar)

My friend and her daughter were publicly applauded for her daughters success in sport but academic achievment somehow has to be hushed up . This seems to be a strange dichotomy whereby we are not allowed to speak about this sort of success.

Blandmum · 15/05/2006 21:24

Coppertop, the most g and t student I have is ASD.

His SN cover most bases. He is 16 and I am already coveing some degree stuff with him

Gillian76 · 15/05/2006 21:26

I am grateful for our Scottish comprehensive education system.

tamum · 15/05/2006 21:26

Completely agree Gillian76. I'm in Scotland too and I see no sign of gifted children suffering from the lack of a label. It's done much more subtly than that IME.