like cod

[cod]

arf at this section

parp parp parp
where the " my kid is thick " section

Singersgirl - exactly!

I really don't know why these threads always end up as slanging matches. I am sure everyone wants the best for their children whatever their ability level.
I don't think equating intelligence with happiness is particularly relevant either. It is too much of a generalisation as, obviously, so many other factors are important.

Well, why don't we take a look to see what the psychologists have to say shall we? Apparently most geniuses also have a 'flip side', social skills difficulties perhaps showing up as autism or schizophrenia or manic depression.
You can look that up if you like.

Why, as a nation do we find it soooooo hard to praise achievers? We can't wait to pull 'em back down by their ankles.

My dd is considered G&T (within her school not nationally) and considering her attendance this year is less than 75% I think she's doing pretty well - and if that's deemed to be boasting, well I don't care she bloody well deserves it .

G&T is a term we all have to address in schools as we've been told to as teachers. Parents of children who are identified as G&T will want to know what this means for them and their children and their children's education. It's just a category used in schools - just like Special Needs is. Would you have a pop at the people who post on those boards too? Would you go onto the 'Feeling low' boards and tell the posters to pull themselves together?

Is G&T a bit of a 'soundbite' initiative by the govt? yes probably. but while it's still with us in schools then it will remain a topic some parents and teachers will want to discuss.

Rhubarb's post

Maybe that's why there's a need for a gifted and talented programme - to avoid these kids becoming sad, lonely and problematic.

and anyway - G&T doesn't automatically apply to just 'clever' kids. Kids at our school who are on the G&T register are fab at sports, art, drama, science and a whole other range of things. slagging off G&T does actually smack of insecurity.

Today I was listening to a 12 year old boy play the violin he was deffo brill I asked which grade he was and he had already done grade 8 and he was a music scholar

Now why would anybody want to slag someone like him???

Only someone who was jealous or insecure

So some of the people on here IMHO must be jealous or insecure of children like him.

Would some of the people on here tell his parents that they shouldn't try to do the best for him that they could?

Or would the people on here just slag the parents off for having a GT child???

And actually wanting to discuss with other parents the experience of having a GT child

Shock horror that parents would want to discuss their GT children with other parents

And if you don't want to discuss GT children then go away and let us discuss them amongst ourselves.

Go and discuss crop trousers or scarves

Rhubarb - I am sure that may well be the case for geniuses but I think G&T extends beyond the label genius. I certainly didn't think that the posters were labelling their children as geniuses. I would also hope that in those instances then the children would get all the support that they need to ensure that they handle their ability appropriately. I didn't realise that autism was considered the "flip-side" of genius (or manic depression, etc.) I thought it was diagnosed often at a young age (my SN knowledge is extremely limited I admit). Is there any literature that you could direct me to just out of curiosity? I would be quite interested to see how the groups were selected and studied to arrive at these conclusions.

This is one of those topics that will go on and on.

We need to understand that some parents are genuinely proud of their kids achievements and perhaps their kids have achieved through difficult circumstances (reminds me of the book 'Once on a House on Fire by Andrea Ashworth).

But then there are those pushy parents who love to boast about their children, to compare them with others, to make parents feel inadequate - we all know the type, the ones who insist on having extra tuition for their 'bright' kids and to whom their children are an extension of their own ego.

Then there are the parents of children who are not so bright, or those who have difficulties. These are the ones most offended by the 'boasters'. Who have tried hard for their kids and who are afraid of their kids being judged or labelled or put into 'special need' classes.

Then there are those parents whose children are not that bright no matter how hard the parents push them, who are insanely jealous of the high achieving children, who can't wait to put those children down, to jump on the parents, accusing them of being boastful. These parents have a real chip on their shoulders.

Then there are those parents inbetween who can't give a toss either way. Who will encourage their kids, but who put happiness before intelligence (because there is a difference).

A little understanding between different types of parents would go a long way. But this argument will go on and on, because a lot of shoulders have been chipped!

And at this point I bow out and leave you all to it!

Yoyo, just to answer your question:

"Dr. Ellen Winner, professor of psychology at Boston College and a specialist in human cognition and the arts. Dr. Winner says there is a scientific basis for the popular belief that genius and madness are somehow connected. However, she says that link is mostly between madness - specifically, manic-depressive illness - and the arts. Dr. Winner says there is less evidence of a link between scientific achievement and madness. Within the arts, poets seem especially prone to a form of madness. A number of prize-winning poets have struggled with manic-depressive illness, often with tragic results. Dr. Goodwin and Dr. Winner talk about some of the better known artists who struggled with a form of madness, including Edgar Allan Poe and Vincent Van Gogh. Dr. Winner suggests that the earlier phases of manic-depressive illness - in which thought patterns may be accelerated and extended in unusual ways"

"Next, The Infinite Mind's Deryl Davis investigates the phenomenon known as Savant Syndrome. A rare combination of severe mental disorder and unusual mental ability, Savant Syndrome occurs in one-in-ten persons with autism. Many moviegoers were introduced to the phenomenon by the 1988 film Rain Man, in which actor Dustin Hoffman portrayed an autistic savant with lightning-fast mathematical abilities. In this report, we hear from Tony DeBlois, an award-winning musician who suffers from both autism and blindness. However, DeBlois also is an example of what experts call a "prodigious savant," a person with Savant Syndrome whose gifts would be considered spectacular even in a non-disabled person. According to psychiatrist Darold Treffert, an expert on savants at the University of Wisconsin Medical School, DeBlois is one of only about fifty living prodigious savants. DeBlois can play twenty instruments and has an estimated 8,000 songs committed to memory - a mental gift he shares with many savants, whose memories are, according to Treffert, "exceedingly narrow but very deep." Dr. Treffert and other experts believe Savant Syndrome may be caused by damage to the left hemisphere of the brain, often in utero, and resulting overcompensation by the right hemisphere. Many savants struggle with language and comprehension skills (primarily left brain functions), but often have amazing skills in music, mathematics, and calculation (primarily right brain skills). Although some experiments are underway to replicate the savant abilities by temporarily disabling part of the brain, Dr. Treffert believes we will eventually discover a non-intrusive way to tap into "the inner savant" within each of us."

Google psychology of genius. HTH

had a dream about you last night rhubarb

it was erotic
sheas covered in crumble

and laced with cream

adn oozing everywhere non?

oui oui

Thanks Rhubarb. Interesting reading especially with reference to the arts. Will spend more time on it later as I seem to have been on here for ages. I tend to favour journals over the internet just because of the peer review aspect so don't always think of googling first!

Incidentally, the Andrea Ashworth book is one of my favourites!

Don't understand people getting uptight about this - the label is being used in the education system so it's up for discussion as far as I'm concerned.

Alliebongo - "$#**?ù%%!!¤$#!!"

I just explained why people are getting uptight! DON'T YOU PEOPLE READ ANYTHING?

is that french?

some people with manic depression who are famous

\link{http://mixednuts.net/bipolar-famous.html\ a propos of nothing!}

i knew virginia woolf wasn't "normal"

eh?

oh well, maybe anyone whose child has been labelled G&T by our education system should just fuck off and not talk to anyone, because what the hell have they got to worry about?

yawn

\link{http://mixednuts.net/depression-famous2.html\ and these too}

bollocks savant syndrome occurs in 1 in 10 people with autism (it's more like 1in 10000 I think- will check with the nas later). And if one more person asks me if ds1 is good at maths (dunno he can't talk) I will scream.