smear tests

[Tusky]

I'm being totally pathetic,but I'm really dreading having a smear test,despite having had several and a baby! I'm not frightened of what they might find,just the mechanics of the actual test - is anyone else as bad as me ? When my son was born I had the works- episiotomy,ventouse and forceps,so I shouldn't fear a teeny speculum ! My doctor is really nice and understanding (I've had v unsympathetic ones in the past- maybe that's a reason why I'm scared). I've written suitable dates to go in my diary,but wimped out,telling myself I need more time to psych myself up.

I saw a thing on the news about 4 years ago. The NHS were supposed to be using a scan method a bit like when you have your ultrasound. They will be able to look at your cervical cells from this. I havent' heard anything else since though.

Did anyone ever see Ben Elton do a skit on the man from auntie about what actually happens when women go for a smear test? My beloved turned to me afterwards and said he had no idea that was what happened to me and he totally understood why I didn't want to go. Apparently a lot of men learned about smear tests for the first time from that little sketch. I still cringe and hate them, the last one I went to they were fabulous, which is a first for me. Usually I'm so wound up my blood pressure practically sprays out of my ears. I think I would do anything rather than that.

Men are just ignorant sometimes. My ex didn't even know that by sleeping with him I was giving myself a higher risk of getting cervical cancer!

Tell me Jbr, are you of the opinion that all men are rapists by any chance?

Blimey Melsj, where did that one come from?! I read up on smear tests when I got home and yes, sexual intercourse does increase your risk of cervical cancer. Barrier methods of contraception do offer some protection and apparently (according to my medical book) there have been no report cases of cervical cancer in nuns. So, pentrative sex, especially from a young age, does increase your chances of cervical cancer.

Sorry!!!!!
It's just if you add all Jbr's posts together that's what you come away thinking.
And actually, I'd be interested to know if she has anything positive to say about men.

I must say I do think some people are being very rude to jbr, who most of time is just asking questions which are then being reacted to very strongly. Perhaps jbr has had some bad experiences which she doesn't trust us enough to share. Or not. But I do think her views deserve the same respect as everyone else's here.

Me again - I hold my hands up - I was being mean.
In my defence can I say that I've also just worked out that I've got raging PMT - came to this conclusion because in the last two hours I have ...

1. Asked my husband for a divorce - he found some old piccies last night from ten years ago and this afternoon said: "You were a beautiful girl".
2. Told my kids they were bratts - AND THEY'RE NOT!! Although must say they're now enjoying my guilt trip to brattish degrees.
3. Burst into tears on the phone to the plumber when he told me he couldn't make it to fix tap tommorow.

Also I cried this morning when Richard and Judy had their farewell montage at the end of their last show. How sad/PMTish is that - I actually tuned in especially to see it.

And there's no chocolate in the house.

Am going to put kids to bed - and then myself for my everyone's sake.
Sorry Jbr - you were an easy target this afternoon and I regret what I said.
And right now I'd say quite categorically (sp?) ... ALL MEN ARE BS.

No worries Melsj!! I know how you feel! I've just been made redundant - again! My work history has got more holes in it than Swiss cheese! I have spent my time swimming and not feeling very useful!

Re: my posting about men not knowing anything about cervical cancer, it could be a generalisation but the men I know literally don't care or don't know anything about it. I know lots about testicular cancer, I don't think it is too much for them to care about our health!

Sorry, but it's not exactly pillow talk is it? "By the way dear, do you know that you could give me cervical cancer by having sex with me?"
"Oh really? I am sorry, won't happen again dear!"

I know all about my own health, but know nothing of men's health - does that make me sexist? It's just that Jbr spoke as though it was men's fault that we could get Cervical cancer, though I'm sure you didn't mean it like that Jbr. However, people will pick up on these things.

I'm sure there are a lot of STDs men could pick up from us - aren't there?

Most STIs are vice versa of course. Most blokes don't seem to care what they might catch of us though, I just must meet total losers!!

My husband is now here with me and would like to say this on the subject:
"How much do you know, Jbr, about men's sexuality, and would you consider yourself typical in that respect? In my experience women know very little about mens sexuality, and vice versa. Is ignorance such a crime?"

I'm talking about STI's. Put quite simply "if you're going to get it on, get it on" to use the phrase of my local council LOL!

Just to resurrect this thread for a minute... I had a hospital appointment today after having had 3 seperate postnatal smears which all came back with the official line 'unable to get result from cells taken'. So on the third I was referred for a colposcopy. However there was some confusion over my referal letter and subsequently every time I phoned to find out what was going on it was mentioned (usually by dragon receptionist) that '...oh yes, you had an abnormal smear didn't you' to which I'd just agree, secrectly thinking 'did I?!' This happened on more than one occasion, but every time I spoke to my doctor he would say it was just that they couldn't get a result at the lab. Ok fine, I'm going to believe my doctor aren't I?
So, I went in today and as I was taking a seat ready to be told about what was going to happen I glanced at a letter that sat on the desk in front of me. It was a mere split second but I wasn't mistaken in seeing my name on the letter and also the phrase 'slightly abnormal smear'!! But again the doctor didn't mention this at all to myself - why? Then after the unpleasant experience of it all (including biopsy - joy!) the doctor first informed me that everything was fine, then went on to tell me that in fact there had been an infection and this may have caused the cells to change so he had to send the biopsy off and the results will be back in 4 - 6 weeks. Does anyone know if I'm meant to read between the lines here or what?! I have no experience of this before and its fairly worrying to think they could be keeping things from me, but surely they wouldn't, would they?? Any info greatly appreciated...

Lizzer - sorry to hear that you have been having a worrying time. I'm due to have a smear so I was interested to read your experiences. IMO, from reading what you have written, I wonder if the 'abnormal smear' comment emcompasses any unusual cervical changes including infection, therefore in your case they may have used it as you did have one present. This is a very misleading way to put it, granted, and I think most of us on hearing or seeing this would fear it were something worse. On the other hand, you could see why they would have been unable to get an adequate sample of 'proper' cervical cells if you had an infection present, so this could account for the first 3 results. The main thing is the doctor who did the biopsy thought everything was fine. Without wishing to be crude, they have a really good view when they shine that bright light up and they know what they are looking for! Also, doctors, in my experience, are usually noncommital unless they are sure they know what's wrong with you, whereas yours sounded reassuring. I think if there was anything else to worry about they would have given you some indication, I really don't think that they would keep anything from you, that would really be in no one's best interest. However, I don't want to patronise you by saying you shouldn't have worried about it because I know that I would feel exactly the same. But, don't torture yourself with the uncertainty anymore, have faith in what the doctor says, I'm sure that you are absolutely fine and atleast now the infection can get sorted out.

I hope I can reassure you but I think that the best thing would be to ask to see all your results when you go back either to the hospital or to the GP. I can't think why anyone would keep an abnormal result from you unless some mistake has been made. If you have had one, "slightly abnormal" smears are common, often revert to normal and cause no ongoing problems. There may be slight cell changes in response to simple infections and it sounds like this may be the case with you. A colposcopy and biopsy should give you a definative answer. Again, it's not that unusual to have smears that come back without a result, especially post natally. This is usually becasue not enough cells were picked up and not anything more sinister. I think you have had the right management and it's likely that everything will be fine. However, do go and ask about the results or it will continue to worry you. Hope this helps.

lizzer Used to work with the Advisory Committee on Gynaecological Cytology many years ago so a few things I remember - doctors call any smear where they aren't sure of the result "abnormal". That means they include the ones where they just didn't get enough cells to test (used to be very, very common), where they tested at the wrong stage of the menstrual cycle and couldn't be sure that hadn't caused the problem or where it really was a problem. Bit stupid really as it upsets women unnecessarily so I'd trust what your gp said.

Then the sexual bit - we knew that nuns didn't get cervical cancer, that those with circumsized partners got it less often and that some men in America who had married often sometimes had wives who all developed cervical cancer. So it clearly had a sexual link and some men were definitely dangerous for your health. If you slept around there was obviously more risk of sleeping with one!

The cervix is actually more vulnerable at certain times than others - puberty and pregnancy so presumably hormonal. So if you start young and have lots of children you're more at risk.

What we didn't know then was that there is a link to the virus that causes cervical warts. Apparently its the ones you DONT see that are the biggest problem. No-one is too sure how anyone gets cervical warts.

There is actually quite a high error rate on the tests. Doctors dont worry about this because they regard zapping your cervix with a laser as nothinbg much. May explain some of the people who "have cervical cancer" when its unlikely.

Better post this before I get cut off

part 2 - if you've had a colposcopy and the doctor said everything was fine it almost certainly is. He is worrying about a possible negligence claim if he's missed anything and having the lab make doubly sure.

By the way if you're going to get a cancer this is the one to have as its 100% treatable if they catch it early. If it was advanced they would certainly have seen it.

Thanks for your posts, its put my mind at ease. Wendym thanks for the information, that is so useful to know, however as regards to the 'sleeping around' part, could you clarify how many is too many (only joking!)

It is instances like this when Mumsnet is at its very best, there is no way I would have found this out had it not been for this board. Sorry, I'm digressing but its because of the 'book deal' that's made me think how much I take gaining valuble knowledge from here for granted.

A bit boring this but certain strains of genital wart virus are associated with cervical carcinoma. These are usually not the sort that cause visible warts although you can have more than one strain present at the same time. Actual warts on the cervix are rare - the infection is usually picked up on a smear test and abnormal patches of virus-infected cervix can be seen at colposcopy. There are tests available that can tell which strain of virus is present but they are not widely available at the moment unfortunately.

I don't agree that it's not known how the infection is aquired - genital wart virus is sexually transmitted and cervical cancer is now considered to be an STI as well. If you are unlucky, one man can be too many although obviously, more partners increases your risk of all STIs. Barrier methods of contraception are protective, something I think we should be telling girls early on.

Smew - after an argument with someone else when I said cervical cancer was sexually transmited I did some research on the net. While the wart virus can be transmitted sexually there also seem to be people who just develop it. First person to get it couldn't have got it sexually after all That's why I said it isn't really known why some people develop it - most will have acquired it by sexual transmission but not all.

As for the how many is too many - I'm afraid it depends on how lucky you are and how often you used condoms. If your lucks bad one could be too many!

Sorry, I don't want to get into a fight and I'm not sure which web sies you looked at but I still don't agree. Virus infections don't just appear from nowhere and and cervical HPV infections are sexually transmitted. There are of course other types of wart virus infections that are not sexually transmitted like hand warts and verrucas; it is possible to transfer a non-genital strain to a genital site by skin-to-skin contact but this is not linked to the development of cervical carcinoma. The observation has already been made here that women who have never had sex don't get cancer of the cervix.

Didn't actually remember which sites I'd looked at but one was www.cancerbacup.org.uk/info/hpv.htm
If a woman has cervical cancer and she believes her husband had always been faithful to her then I think you need to be very cautious about telling her otherwise. I've also heard of a virgin who had cervical cancer - think I read the case report on Medline but I don't have time to search for it.

I first posted a message about my dread of the smear in June and today,all those months later,I made my appointment for next Thursday. My doctor said I should just decide on the spur of the moment(at the right time in my cycle,of course)and make an appointment so I wouldn't have time to worry ,but I know he'd be completely booked up if I didn't plan a little in advance - anyway,I've just got to get on with it now ! Thanks for all the advice and comfort offered everyone-it has helped a lot !