Decided against vaccinations for dd...... thoughts please

[bogie]

We had full intentions of vaccinating dd (ds-3 had his baby vaccines but no mmr) but our helth visitor left we haven't had a health visitor since dd was 2 weeks old, our gp practice is rubbish and even though I registered dd after the birth they lost the slip and had no record of it.
So we didn't hear anything about her jabs and when they needed to see her, nor did I have a postnatal 10 week check.
I phoned a few weeks ago when they said they didn't know we had a new baby and that someone must of misplaced the forms dd is now 4 months(18 weeks) and they said we need to get her in asap for her jabs but they have no appointments untill the 16th of Jan, We fly to USA on the 16th so we can't do that day she said well thats al we hae so it will have to be when you get back in feburary.

So I decided to reserch the vaccines and came across lots of anti-vaccine sites including this one
www.vaclib.org/
articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2008/11/11/some-parents-are-home-schooling-their-kids-to -avoid-vaccinations.aspx and we have decided not to vaccinate her based on the many sites we have come across, also the fact that we have alot of autisum in our family including my younger brother who had the mmr whereas I didn't have the mmr.

So I am interested to hear other peoples poins of veiw

Pagwatch - totally understand your POV, DS has never shown any signs of allergy/reaction to anything and since he has been born he has been very healthy (touching wood madly). If he had a history of ill-health or allergies then I think this would have greatly altered the amount of though/research I did prior to having him vaccinated.

Beachcomber - I wasnt aware that children had died as a result of vaccinations but tbh, dont think if I had been it would have changed my decision.

You are both right, in my particular circumstances it was a decision between two very unlikely worst outcomes so I suppose I went with the one which I thought (rightly or wrongly) presented the lowest risk.

For what its worth, I do think that there is very likely to be some link between the vaccinations and autism and other similar disorders, and I was reluctant and very worried on the day that DS had the vaccination. When I tried to discuss this with my HV, she trotted out a one line answer along the lines of the Dept of Health recommends.......... blah blah blah.

I think for a lot of people they have the vaccinations because it is "the done thing" - ie you are following the general medical advice. For me,I couldnt live with myself if I went against the general medical advice and then lost DS. Someone above said that a lot of mothers are far better informed than the average HV or GP on this issue and I totally agree that this will be the case, unfortunately I am not one of them.

Too true pagwatch.

I haven't vaccinated DD2 because DD1 reacted so badly that we were left with little choice.

I share your anger about how the government seems to be pumping money into maintaining a shiny public image for vaccination whilst failing to help our kids, find out what happened to them and prevent it happening to others. And there will be others

For crying out loud how much longer is this sick charade going to go on for? I thought Hannah Poling's case might have an impact in the UK but due to a virtual media blackout most people still don't know that the vaccine/autism link is official. WTF is the government playing at by not trying to find out as pretty damn quick as possible what makes a child vulnerable to vaccine damage.

It's all bloody well talking about the greater good and effing social responsiblity but if no attempt is made to identify the vulnerable than the whole thing becomes unethical and tarnished.

Oh and don't get me started on the government's insane decision to withdraw singles for many major vaccines FGS.

Pag you've put it beautifully: 'it's because we all love our kids so much'.

I had the loveliest GP in south London and then had to leave when we moved as well. IME there are far too few GPs I'd describe as 'great'. Actually, just the one in my case!

Am wetting myself laughing at your DH's 'broken tit' quip!

Beach, in my view (and my limited experience) there are too many health correspondents whose contacts books (unlike that of Martin Walker) probably extend little further than the DoH telephone directory. The government doesn't need to work that hard in terms of forcing a media blackout.

Was that Ms Dng*n Riven? Is that too nosey

And while I also keep repeating myself on this issue: what about the social responsibility to those who have suffered? It seems strangely lacking. Those children whose parents stepped up to the plate in total trust and who were damaged have been abandoned and ignored. All arguments in favour of social reponsibility fall for me at that hurdle.

There are so flaming many on this thread and they should not have to relate these terrible accounts.

I have a Dd who received the 3in1 at 8weeks and then single MMR jabs.
I have a Ds who received an unconsented 5in1 series from 8 weeks and single mmr jabs (don't ask, it's a long story)
I have a ds2 who is about to be vaccinated when he develops better speech and can be videotaped for his sills and abilities on the day he will receive the 5in1. He has yet to have the singles either, but will have at some point after the 5in1.

I will do what is best for my kids, I do not consider anyone else's kids in that decision and do not expect them to consider mine either.

Please remember that 8 weeks is the VERY EARLIEST the Gov't will allow vaccination. It is perfectly reasonable to wait longer, even my HV agrees with that. She had no problem with our deferral and agree with the logging of his skills so that we could provide evidence of regression if any occurred.

Glad you have a sympathetic HV Astarte. I can't forget that it is due to parents talking loudly about what happened to them that after ds1 I stalled on the infant vaccinations and then stopped them all. I feel very angry about the belittling and point scoring that comes their way.

stuffitlama

I can't really add anything but feel the need to say ......
You Go Girl !

Whoa pag coming from you in the frontline that's worth a hula dance from me

I used to do my own secret bit for the cause when I was a working woman

I think the risks of not vaccinating far outway the unproven suggestion of a link with autism - in some cases it may just be very bad luck/timing. it is far easier to find negative information on the internet than there would be supportive information on this subject, so people are going to get biased information.

there are so many possible causes of autism, i don't believe it is right to blame it on vaccines. i work with kids who are severely disabled, including severe autism - so i can understand some of what families have to go through, and it is very sad to work with kids who were normal and healthy untill they got meningitis.

my child will be getting everything offered - i'm not driving myself mad with worry about what could be damaging him from everything he comes into contact with as i'm happy i provide a safe and caring environment for him to grow up in.

A very interesting thread here, and some extremely well informed MNetters. Also, very sorry to hear what some of you have been through with your dc.

I have a genuine Q after reading everything so far. I am pg with first dc. DP's Mum and sister have coeliac disease, sister also had M.E. but has recovered. DP's cousin had diabetes. All 3 are autoimmune diseseases right? Do we need to think about avoiding vaccinating our baby?

I am prepared to do my own research on the matter also!

I really dislike the social responsiblity argument, particularly in the current climate of declaring much vaccine damage as 'coincidence' and with the pharmaceuticals having so much political sway and economic might.

If vaccines carried no risk for all individuals or even if some effort was made to screen for vulnerable individuals then I might just about buy it. But that is not the case.

Why should any parent be expected to take an uncalculatable gamble on their child's health and future in order to benefit others? Isn't that like really unethical?

The government isn't even trying to keep a realistic count of how many people suffer vaccine damage let alone trying to protect others from becoming victims of it.

I don't know how some folks sleep at night.

naturalbaby - have you read any of this thread other than the title?

your comment "in some cases it may just be very bad luck/timing" is offensive in the extreme. so bloody what if it si "just" very bad luck?! How on earth is that supposed to make it right that more people are exposed to this potential bad luck, without any investigations into how or why these reactions happen?

The "bad timing" coincidence is one i simply don't believe in, and you would have to be quite simple, imo, to give it any credence whatsoever. If you have a child who is developing ok, and then they are givena jab, and regress severely - lose speech, develop severe reactions to foods, have incredible painful bowel issues - and the only thing that was different that week was that they had a jab - you call that a coincidence of timing?

And please do look up the hannah Poling case and judgement - my dd2 possibly has a similar mitochondrial disorder, yet I am still advised that I should have her vaccinated (and that's without taking into account dd1's autism)

Oh, and i don't drive myself mad worrying about what could be damaging either of my dds. I just do a bit of research, and avoid things which I know will, in all liklihood, do them damage. It's easy really.

Well, I would, obviously (see my previous posts!) I don't know what the official advice would be, and I'd be interested to know. Auto-immune diseases are so common, though, it would rule loads of kids out of the vaccination system so there would be no herd immunity.

I keep meaning to do more research myself on the causes of auto-immune diseases but never have time. Anyone got any links, at all?

Sorry X posts - my last post was to the Eclair.

ChocolateEclair - with coeliac disease in the family, I'd definitely be cautious about vaccinations.

A large part of dd1's issues are gut issues, resulting in a leaky gut situation, with severe intolerance to gluten and dairy. There is lots out there to read, and maybe you could contact Richard Halvorsen? His book is a good read too, and he is apparently good at taking account of family history and then suggesting possible vaccination routes.

Can people please stop saying that there is no proven link between vaccines and autism. The link has been accepted by the US Vaccine Court. What the debate is now is how many children have been affected, how to help them, how the mechanisms work that have damaged them and how to prevent similar happening to other vulnerable children.

Your information is out of date (and was never true in the first place).

And it's a bit bloody rude and crass considering some of the posts on this thread by MNers whose children have autism as a result of vaccination.

Thanks to temerity and silver frog - I will def be doing some more research. It actually seems quite hard to find research that seems trustworthy (the NHS immunisation site doesn't really tell you anything - don't know why I am surprised!). I will also get that book suggested. Thanks again.

silverfrog - there is no need to be rude. people are not on this website to be offensive and criticise people, well not me anyway!

as i said, i work with severely disabled children - so i may not have personal experience but i am not totally ignorant of what some families have to go through.

and i will stand by my 'bad timing' opinion because that is my opinion.

some/a lot of scientific evidence is based on very restricted, biased research so cannot always be relied on. unless you are a scientist and have researched this yourself how can you trust absolutely everything you read? a lot of parents who do not do as much research as some of you just grab onto a possible vaccine link and may not consider that there couldn be other factors involved.

naturalbaby
actually with respect you may work with disabled children but that gives you not a clue what life is like..
And having read your post I was inclined to be rude too.

The co-inciudence theory is total shite.Total shite. Please don't pass this pearl of wisdom on to any of your charges relatives. It is rude and really offensive to suggest that parents simply hadn't spotted that there child was severely disabled until just after the jabs.
My son regressed very violently within weeks and developed eating/bowel issues.. That is one hell of a co-incidence.

Try reading at least a smidge of the thread..