foot and mouth

[Kia]

Hey Tigger! My street cred went up miles today when I was able to talk knowledgably about foot and mouth to a man in the animal feed business. I could almost SEE the thoughts over the phone - how does an executive tart know about the mouth ulcers etc?! Many thanks, I couldn't have done it without you! i was almost an honorary man for a few moments!!

.... and I keep seeing the little red tractor sticker, which I hadnt noticed before! I really will watch and look at what I buy now (as opposed to rushing round the supermarket in a blind panic with children in tow) having had your info Tigger. I agree with Kia, there is so much information about this awful disease, and you spoke about it so clearly - I understand! Hope you're OK.

Yes Tigger, sorry to see the outbreaks in Longtown and Carlisle.
My parents live about 20 miles from Carlisle and while they are retired townies living in a small town they love the countryside and are very upset at what is happening to farming in general and to the hill farmers in the Lakes in particular.
Fingers crossed for you all.

I am really feeling very depressed now, 2 cases of F & M have been discovered in our area Dumfries and Galloway. We are as of today disinfecting all vehicles and footwear, and I would urge everyone to be extra vigilant when travelling around. The animals that were moved from Longtown market to Northern Ireland, would be transported along the main road which we turn off to go onto our rural road to get to our farm, as the port they would go through would either be Stranraer or Cairnryan. Sorry to keep posting about this, but this is now so close to our farm and many others round here, that all of us are now past the stage of our deepest darkest thoughts, this is now in our area for real. A very depressing time for us all not just the farmers but all those connected with farming, like the hauliers etc. BSE was bad enough, nothing compared to this, I don't think that a lot of people will recover from this at all.

Tigger, how awful. All the news seems to be really depressing at the moment doesn't it.

Really sorry to hear this, Tigger. I'll be watching the news tonight and thinking of you.

Tigger I'm thinking of you loads, hoping this will pass soon...

Unfortunately it has now spread to within 30 miles of us. Can't even let the dogs run down the road when I'm on the motorbike now, I can only let them run in our enclosed fields.

Trouble is, Pamina, that for every person who thinks hard about what they eat and where they get it from there are maybe 100 who either don't care or really cannot afford the extra cost involved in being selective about your sources. The supermarkets and food manufacturers, having created the market for ultra-cheap food, can justify continuing to offer it on the grounds that not many people can afford to buy organic meat or are sufficiently confident in the kitchen to eat partly veggie or even cook that much from scratch.
I've always been selective about organic eating, preferring to choose local British produce, from local Kent farms, over allegedly organic beans flown in out of season from, say, Zimbabwe, at considerable environmental cost.
I hope this crisis does encourage people to think long and hard about why pigs and sheep are hauled 100s of miles to be slaughtered, thus making it easier for the disease to spread, instead of efforts being made to keep small local abbatoirs open. But I think a lot of people out there don't wish to know about the murkier end of the food industry and just tune it out.
Tigger, thinking of you. Is your eldest now off school?

As Marina pointed out, most livestock now has to be transported hundreds of miles to a slaughterhouse, because the smaller ones closed due to meat and hygiene inspector, vets being there etc, they had to do all of this out of their own pocket no other help of any kind. There have been 5 cases of German Beef coming into Britain in the past few days with the spinal cord intact, IT IS REMOVED IN BRITAIN (BSE). This after effects of this disease will not start to get better until I would say the back end of this year. When all stock goes back onto the market, it will be at rock bottom prices, but the supermarkets will not sell it at these prices. It would be better for all if, the likes of the other mums here could go to a farmer and say "look I want half a lamb, half a pig and whatever beef you need say 1/4 or 1/2", you then as the consumer can know its date of birth, its dams tracebility by her ear tag and where it has come from either farm bred or bought in. Same with the vegetables, it should be the same there. For to long the supermarkets have been allowed to in theory "ROB" the consumer, and it is something I feel very strongly about, as the profits they make from sales of beef/pork and lamb are nearly obscene. If you buy straight from the farm it is cheaper and will actually taste better as it is "hung" for longer than the supermarkets. They kill one day and cut up within 3 days, a butcher will kill and hang for a fortnight. Some of the pork coming into Britain is coming from China, what sort of conditions will these pigs have been in before they were killed. Foot and Mouth is a virulant disease, that can travel in the air, on our clothes, feet, vehicles, dogs, cats, horses although the last 3 cannot get it they can carry it. The major supermarkets have promised to supply British Meat after the present F & M epidemic is past, but at what price?, it is up to us as the public to make a stand and start buying at source and cut out the middle man.

Spot on Tigger.

Tigger, my fingers are crossed for you.
I hope there is some good news soon.

Tigger, following on from Marina, don't you think its bizarre that people will spend say £3 for a pint of beer that they consume without thinking. And yet think twice about paying a smaller amount difference between organic or 'better meat', versus cheap meat from unknown sources. Its not the 'decent' meat that is expensive, its the supermarket meat that's CHEAP.

Whay is the British culture so mean when it comes to food, and not interested in quality, and yet will spend £4.50 on a packet of fags?? Let's hope becoming part of Europe will gradually show us the importance of GOOD food!!

Oh, meant to say, thanks for putting a human person to the faceless 'farming community' that we are watching everyday now. My sympathies are real.

Too right Lil. The priorities of British people as regards to spending on food is bizarre and at odds with most other countries. It horrifies me that meat used in burgers comes from places such as Namibia and Thailand where the conditions for the animals are apalling. I don't have a strong view on the subject myself but it amazes me that the populace seems to be so strongly anti-fox hunting. Many of these same people are the ones happily munching their way through battery-chicken sandwiches and so on. People just don't seem to care about animal welfare here unless the animal in question has that "cute" quality.+-

Lil, thank you for your support and excellent comments, husband has read them and agrees totally. Good news, some cattle are starting to move again, the ones that are fit for slaughter, so hopefully we'll keep the imported stuff out!!. Right, I've to ask you all this, so please do answer, if you could all buy meat at source, i.e. the farm, would you buy it that way? As many farmers are trying to diversify this way, we might if we could get a good enough market for the stuff.

Tigger, I'd be happy to do this, but as a city dweller I've got 2 problems:

1. Getting the meat in small enough packages to be manageable - I can't accomodate half a cow, or even half a pig! (Come to think of it, even a whole chicken presents problem!)
2. Getting to the farms - I wouldn't know where to start.

How about some kind of farmers collective teaming up with a distributer to get it going on the internet as an e-commerce venture? - you'd get guarenteed publicity given the press interest at the moment. Or does that effectively get you back to square 1?

Tom, you would be able to choose the amount of meat you needed, depends on freezer acommodation. Cuts are now sold per kilo, we put one the freezer last November and there was 360 kilos of meat!!, good job we had another freezer. We need to find out what demand there is for this before anything can really be done, research etc. I do feel very strongly about this, because you as the consumer is being ripped off, a prime animal is sold for say £0.98 per kilo and you can pay up to £12.00 per kilo for beef and lamb is sold for £38.00 for a 45 kilo prime lamb killing out at 50%, and I've seen it at as much as £14.00 per kilo for a leg of lamb and some chops. It cost us £170.00 to get our animal killed and cut up by the butcher, but to have bought the whole carcass makes my hair stand on end at thought of the price!! Ok anyone else interested in this.

Yes, this is a great idea, but how do you answer part 2 of Tom's query. Would the farms tend to supply their local areas e.g. Surrey farms sell to Epsom! And how woul it be transported? I've always thought that in this age of the internet, that Unigate should make more of its delivery network. They could be used to sell meat direct to homeowners. What is your idea for transport?

Some of the larger delivery firms have refridgerated transport and would be able to transport directly to the consumers door. I will need to get in touch with NFU regarding interest in this matter, I would imagine that it would be of a lot interest to a lot of them. Will keep in touch about this, I'll need to see what interest there is.

Tigger, I have been thinking about this, and realistically, the only way I could buy from the farmer is if they were camped out in Safeways car park during my lunch break! Or at a farmers market on the outskirts of Reading during the week, perhaps - but definitely selling between 1 and 2 pm. Our nearest farmers market is in the next town and runs on Sunday mornings, a very inconvenient time for us, as I try to get all the mundane shopping out of the way during the week or on Saturday am, and we are often away for the w/e anyway. The problem is to target dual income families or single working parents with not a lot of time or flexibility to seek alternatives to the supermarket, good luck.

Sml, try and find out who is in charge of the sunday market. From there you might be put in touch with one of the farmers who could supply you directly without you having to go on a sunday morning, and be more convenient for yourself. Hope you read this and have success.

I buy my meat directly from a farm in Kent which has a web site and delivers to my door. It is not cheap at all though but the taste is amazing.

Tigger, as I read this, I'm convinced there are very good business models to look into based on the internet. I'm sure that if you could get distribution set up, it would fly, and you'd have absolutely no problem getting publicity - you could go straight through the national media - get the story running on the Press association and it would be all over the place.