Why has my dd1 been complaining of feeling unwell, being tearful for last month! HELP

[haychee]

DD1 is 7.
She is usually full of beans and very lively.

Just recently she has not been her usual self.
No temperature.
No sickness.
No diarrhoea.

Complains of tummy ache, particularly after eating (say an hour later).

Can be her usual self, but 80% of the time is quiet/subdued and just not right.

She has an appetite and is eating well.

Has been so nondiscript that i have continued to send her off to school, wondering if she is just trying to get a day off or increased attention.

Im expecting the school to call me today, as she was complaining again this morning, of "i dont feel well". Yesterday apparently she sat with a sick bowl in class.

She isnt usually one to sit about, and its been going on so long now that im beginning to worry. I dont think she is putting it on because shed of got bored of that by now, because i havnt really given her much extra attention, very little actually.

Id feel daft going to drs with her, and say what, she has no tangable symptoms - but she is just not right.

Could it be teeth?? She has 2 big-uns at the back comming through. Hasnt complained about them, but maybe making her feel rundown?

Sorry, haven't read everything, but could she be intolerant to something? Is is wheat/bread related?

Hope GP is helpful

How would i know?
Trial and error? or is there a test for intolerances?

Oh yes, they'll be able to test for it....but excluding a food and then reintroduction is a relatively easy way to find out...perhaps a food diary? I only mentioned wheat cos its quite common but in theory could be anything. Its worth seeing if the GP comes up with a similar idea?

Do you know, some people react to stress and anxiety 'viscerally', ie with their stomach. I am one of them.

Whenever I got stressed as a child, I would have a stomach ache.

I would put money on somethng upsetting your daughter at school, perhaps some conflict with her friends or some trouble with a teacher. The fact that it starts up nearer to bedtime, when she will be worrying about the next day, and is gone after school when she would just be relieve dt to be out, hints to me that something is going on at school.

Ask her about her friends. Ask about her teacher.

If you think it is really indigestion then rennies is good idea ( or try half glass of water with squirt of lemon juice and pinch of bicarb... drink while fizzing. Tbis is excellent indigestion remedy)

but i think you should take her to the doctor anyway too...my dd2 was complaining of tummy ache (and headache) on and of for days...turned out to be tummy virus.

BUT i would definitely talk to her teacher at school too. It sounds to me as if there is a problem that she is either unwilling or unable to talk about. I am a teacher and i know that vague on/off tummy aches and headaches are often associated with unhappiness at school. This can sometimes be a specific subject or activity or teacher or other pupil who triggers the tummy ache. And the aches are real..not imagined. But when the stress causing thought or situation is gone the ache goes too most of the time.

Im sure its not school.

Why would she feel anxious tonight an hour after dinner. She knows its friday, and the weekend is free.
She suffered through the half term too.

The school and problems at doesnt make any sense to me.
She is popular.
She is in the top sets etc.

I spoke to the teacher today, and i know the TA very well. Both just say, that shes not right. Tearful at times. And complaining of feeling sick/or tummy ache.
But no temperature.
No actual sickness
No diarrhoea.

MMM, IF SHE SUFFERED THOUGH HALF TERM THEN PROBABLY not SCHOOL.

oops!

Doctors then?

Yep, i think so.

Will make the appointment on Monday.

Will write back on this thread to keep it alive, and let you all know what they think. Dont suppose ill get an appointment though until maybe wednesday ish.

oh dear....nothing more worrying than not KNOWING isn't it.

To be honest ive not been that worried. Its more annoying that she cant keep active and functioning most days for a whole day.

Shes not been that bad that ive been so worried.

Actually, when it all started she was far worse, she slept a bit during the day and was really obviously not right. Now though, she has either got used to it or it is better than it was, but something is not right somewhere im sure of that.

Coeliac Disease could cause all the symptoms you describe (have a look at the coeliac uk website). A simple blood test is used to screen for it-but do NOT cut out wheat before getting her tested as a gluten-free diet invalidates the test.

Think a food diary between now and Wednesday may be an idea....see if anything makes it worse

after last nights report id say it deffo sounds like indegestion problems, (oh by the way, i checked hubbys pack of rennie and it said its ok from age 7) u could also try giving her andrews, brilliant stuff.

Food diary started.

Another Rennie given this morning an hour and a half after her weetabix.
She says it helps, i guess about 50%, but the relief only seems to last an hour or so.

She reports pain overnight too.

Will keep a record of all of this, food, times, etc.

Is she worse after eating wheat/gluten... ie sandwiches pizza crumpets etc...
it sounds like how I feel after eating wheat..

Hi, how are things? Did you go to the docs? x

Thanks for the concern and interest!

Took dd to the drs yesterday and he examined her after i told him whats been going on. Amazingly, he thinks its a pulled stomach muscle
Im not convinced.

I carried on giving her rennies as id tried the other night and it was quite obvious after a while that they wernt doing much if anything. I think she liked the thought of sucking a sweet.

The dr has given us nurofen to take regularly 3times a day for at least a week or so. Its now day 2 and she hasnt felt any better yet.

She is quite lively in herself, can still manage cartwhheels and loved pe the other day. But when she sits still after a meal she starts complaining of feeling sick and that her stomach hurts.

Now, im still not sure how much of it is attention seeking.
But dp and i both agree that she most likely isnt putting it on, its just not like her to sit and moap about like she has been.

The dr also said no pe or dance (which she is totally distraught about).
He came to his muscular injury conclusion when he examined her. He couldnt feel any enlarged organs and when he asked her to sit up from laying (using her tummy muscles) he asked her if that hurt and well she said yes. It wasnt very convincing, she didnt grimace as she sat up and her answer was a bit well yes it hurts all the time kind of reply.

I am going to continue with the nurofen for a few more days and then if no better ask for a different dr to see her.

Ive spoken to her teacher again, who was very level headed and quite unconcerned really. But she did assure me she seemed fine with friends etc, and described how she had been complaining at times of tummy ache and being unusually tearful. However, the same as i have found, she can complain one minute and then skip around etc, so you dont really know just how severe the feeling is.

With regards to wheat intolerance, well i wouldnt know where to start in finding out. She has school dinners 3times a week, and regular childcare with dp (whom i cant rely on to keep track of what she eats and when). Needless to say the food diary went tits up when i had to work on sunday.

It is definitely after eating though, and doesnt affect her appetite.
I mean she will be starving before a meal or snack, eat well then start complaining an hour or so later.
She doesnt appear to have much pain when she is hungry.

I dont know its soo difficult to work her out.

Btw, im not one for whittling about my dcs health. Both are never given calpol or anyhting until its absolutely necessary. I never take them to gp unless im very concerned. DD1 has been to gp only 3 times in her life and dd2 only once.

update

Hi haychee - haven't seen this before. Sorry dd is feeling unwell, and that the doc was less than helpful. Just one thing though - neurofen isn't brill on tummys so I'd watch that, it may make it worse.

Also my dd has had wee infections (sort of a low grade ongoing infection) without a temp so maybe worth dropping a sample in?

Not read the whole thread so apologies if repeating but could it be a food intolerance? maybe wheat, gluten or dairy - the symptoms you mention sound a little like IBS to me but she is young for that - a gluten/ wheat intolerance would cause the same thing.

WRT not wanting to go to school - have any of her friends been off with tummy aches and feeling sick? They do tend to mirror symtoms of others if angling for a day at home!

Hi
Yes wheat intolerance has been mentioned earlier and i said i wouldnt know where to start investigating that.

The pain is always there, but she is able to enjoy life, skipping and cartwheeling and doing everything she normally would, until after a meal or even a snack, then it gets much worse.

Tonight for dinner we had sausage and mash (shes not a great sausage eater and didnt touch that, but ate all the mash) she hasnt complained of stomach ache this evening.

So maybe some eveidence that it is a wheat thing.

I ahev been continuing the nurofen which seems to have a very small if any effect. We are on day 3 now.

It has been going on for a month at least (certainly since before the half term) and she was complaining during half term. Id of thought that if it was just for a day off etc then she would of got bored of that by now. Also if it was an issue at school that was upsetting her she wouldnt be complaining on a friday or weekend or even during half term.

There was one girl we had over to play who had a touch of diarrhoea at the same time that all this started. My dd doesnt have any diarrhoea. If it was a bug from this other girl then she should have well and truly shaken it off by now.

Should i try omitting any wheat products and see how she goes? And, how will i manage that She loves bread, cereals, crisps and so on. She will end up eating nothing.
Does wheat intolerance make you feel sick, cos she often complains of feeling sick too when the pain is bad.

If it is an intolerance then removing wheat from her diet would solve the problem.

However, as Tiggiwinkle says, if she is coeliac (where the problem is caused by gluten which is in wheat/barley/rye actually damaging the villi) she needs to be on a full gluten containing diet to get an accurate blood test and then if that was positive for a biopsy. The tearful/quiet/subdued part is very common in children who are undiagnosed coeliacs. I had great trouble having my son diagnosed - it took six years - we were told he had a grumbling appendix! He finally had an allergic reaction to gluten (from the small amount that is in the barley flavouring in Rice Krispies) and when I insisted on the coeliac blood test at that point it was positive. He had been getting increasingly lethargic and grumpy. When he went glutenfree his energy level soared and the grumpiness I had put down to becoming a teenager totally vanished and he was back to his cheerful self. If she has less/no pain after a glutenfree meal then I would go back to the doctor and tell him this and ask for a coeliac blood test. Good luck.

Haychee - family of coeliacs here! I would advise that befoe you do ANYTHING regarding food exclusions you monitor her poos: when, consistency, colour and smell....sounds horrible, but there are a number of gut related problems she could have, and although not guaranteed, symptoms often show in the stools. In particular, look out for foul, smelly, gassy or floaty which is associated with gluten, and alternatively, rabbit droppings (gluten again). Chrohn's disease does other things, I think . Having said all that, I would tend to agree with the idea that she is worrying about something and that it is producing physical symptoms, that come back when she stops to think. My dd2 does exactly the same thing, aged 5, and has even had us ready to do an emergency dash with no reason!!! If her poo is normal then I would consider other things than diet, at least for a while. Lastly I would say that children can be affected by swollen glands in the stomach that hurt when a bug is present, in the same way that our throat or armpit glands may swell to fight off infection. Your GP might have missed this (even though he shouldnt). Are there any other signs that she may be trying to fight off something - loss of appetite, lethargy, possible weight loss, temperature fluctuations etc?

Hi

No, no temperature at all.
No weight loss.
If anything she seems hungrier and is eating very well at the moment so no loss of appetite.
Not really lethargic either.

She just comes over pale, grimaces and complains of feeling sick and a tummy ache that "comes up" as she puts it.

Whenever i ask her, she says it hurts, so pain is always there. But after a meal it is more obvious and it clearly hurts more.

I dont see her poos, but she says it helps the pain if she can try to go to the loo even for a wee or a poo. So she is much more frequently on the loo these days. When i ask her about her poos she just says they are normal, not loose or hard. I dont notice a smell either and i often go in after her. I shall take more notice over the next couple of days and ask her not to flush so i can see.

I really dont think she is worried about anything. I have spoken to her teacher and she says she mixes well. She certainly isnt a problem to get ready for school, she is willing to go and enjoys school. She doesnt struggle with her work and is in the top sets for everything.
There is nothing going on at home that she could be worried about - its all quite stable in fact much more than it has been over last couple of years.
She is quite content really.

Its just this pain.

after her mash potato earlier i didnt see her complaining at all. But by bedtime she was beginning to feel rough and asked for a hot water bottle to hold on her tummy.

Its so difficult, i never know if its a real pain or if she is saying she is in pain when shes not just for a bit of sympathy etc.

I dont doubt now that she does experience pain, but when and the severity of it is virtually impossible to measure.

Tummy ache that 'comes up'. Does she mean heartburn, acid reflux type pain I wonder. Is it at the top of her tummy or the bottom haychee?