Is chickenpox more unpleasant than two injections?

[cngodltlbi]

On average.

Beryl, you can't vaccinate a 7 week old so I presume you mean that you would have had your own immunity tested and vaccinated yourself if you weren't immune?

If the statistics quoted by ReallyTired are correct, (haven't attempted to check them but no reason to dispute them), 25 deaths, 81% of them in adults, then that equates to about 5 deaths in children in a year, it's not good of course but pretty rare.

Do the people who worry about this worry about flying in a plane, driving in a car, lightning strikes, water related deaths, level crossing deaths because I'm sure these things cause more deaths than chicken pox.

As for the adults, well there is a vaccine, if they are that worried they could get themselves vaccinated.

My ds 1and 2 had chicken pox very mildly. However, my son's friend was hospitalised due to vomiting ( he was severely dehydrated) and a girl in his class has a sister with c.p. due to brain damage caused by chicken pox. It really is a lottery.

A lottery with very good odds in your favour...

Bumbly, I didn't explain very well. DS picked it up from DD who was 2 at the time. I wish I had had her vaccinated.

Everyone told me that DS would be fine since I was breastfeeding him and I had had cp as a child, but he got it anyway, and really badly. He was diagnosed with neutropenia soon afterwards.

I think that chickenpox is an economic problem rather than than a childhood killer. It is expensive when parents have to take unpaid leave because their tot can't attend day nursery/ school for two weeks. In theory parents have the right to unpaid parental leave, but in practice some employers will make life difficult for parents.

I find odd that the NHS choses to vaccinate pre schoolers against flu rather than chickenpox or mengenitis B. I suspect that the UK vaccination programme is focussed on saving the country money rather than lives.

Bumbley - can we just quickly acknowledge that obviously (given the posts on this thread), I am not the only one who has seen/knows children with horrendous courses and significant chicken pox complications? Thank you.

I haven't said you're the only one. Just that most people's experiences complications usually don't extend further than a few infected spots while yours always seem to be worst case scenarios for pretty much every disease there happens to be a vaccine for.

That's a bit of a "when did you stop beating your wife" kind of argument there. So we have found that chicken pox can be so severe that there are more folk that me who have seen horrendous courses and complications (even a CNS complication). I am not surprised.

"That's a bit of a "when did you stop beating your wife" kind of argument there." not at all.

You just seem to have a lot of anecdotes about serious complications from diseases that vaccines are available for. Do you deny that? You always seem to have at least one to talk about when these threads come up and they're never usually the run of the mill complications either - again, I'm not just talking about chicken pox here.

Yes, chicken pox can be severe - so can a cold. In the vast majority of cases it is not. Most of the people who post on these type of threads will post their bad experiences - the thread is pretty much asking for those types of experiences. That doesn't mean that it is representative of what a typical course of CP is like. It's not exactly balanced.

Well, experience was asked for and I gave mine and other people gave theirs. The OP asked is chicken pox more unpleasant than the chicken pox vaccine and on average from the anecdotes in this thread, it is. You are free to weigh in with your own experience, which will contribute to the thread's average. You don't seem to like that answer, so sorry. Here is some

"on average from the anecdotes in this thread, it is." We'll that's the problem, you're basing your analysis on skewed data. It's not exactly an accurate representation of the population's experience of CP. I thought you had a science background?

Anyway, as I said, it's not just about this particular thread.

I've gone for the vaccine for DS. I didn't have a particularly bad case of chickenpox as a child (itchy, hot and miserable for a week or so), but I have visible scars all the same as my skin marks very easily. Even if DS had it lightly, it would still be a week of feeling a bit miserable and another week of not being able to go out - we reckoned two jabs were preferable to that. (He had no side effects from the injections - apart from a bit of wailing when the needle went in, he was absolutely fine.)

"it would still be a week of feeling a bit miserable and another week of not being able to go out"

You aren't supposed to go out until the spots have crusted over- that is usually much less than 2 weeks. In our case it was 5/6 days. The feeling miserable was the day before - slight headache, feeling tired and then the spots broke out and they were a bit itchy but not overly miserable or anything for the first couple of days and that was it. By day 3 they were jumping around as usual.

Agree Catherina but what else do you expect from BM. She seems to think rare means non existant
My experience
DS friend had stroke at 6 from CP. Half of all childhood strokes are caused by CP. He was perfectly healthy just the CP went to his brain.
Another little friend had leukemia, unfortunately we saw her the day before his spots came out and she had to be rushed to GOSH for the immuneglobulin vaccine (cant remember proper name). That was the 4th time.
A perfectly healthy father at my dcs preschool died from CP.
I know a lot of mothers who caught CP from their child and had bad cases.
This is the experience in my direct contact, not friends of friends.

There really is not that much evidence that CP is waning and the latest research is now showing that the lack of CP in community is not the cause of the rise in shingles, as there is no correlation to the increase in vaccination. Those that are vaccinated against CP are far less likely to get CP or shingles, and even if they do get it there is very little in the way of complications.

Thank you bruffin - I do have a stroke case (the daughter of an online acquaintance) that I did not even mention, because not direct.

Bumbley - I am a scientist, hence my reference to actual numbers earlier (1 in 1-200 chicken pox patients are hospitalised, chicken pox causes a stroke in about 1 out of 12000 cases - those are numbers from studies - I also linked to articles regarding second chicken pox infections and complications in immunocompromised vs immunocompetent children (supporting the statement that healthy kids get chicken pox complications at about the same likelihood as sick kids, although children with preexisting conditions may have a higher risk of dying). You didn't like that either.

I am glad your kids had a comparatively easy time with chicken pox, but your anecdote does not trump anyone else's or the data.

Sigh, and bruffin comes in again with her sweeping generalisations ignoring the fact that just a couple of posts ago I acknowledged that complications from CP can occur but have simply said that the majority of cases are not complicated and that this thread is hardly going to be representative of the population as a whole. Do you disagree with either of those statements?

I have also said on this thread already that complications are more likely and more serious in adults - supported by your own examples of the healthy father in your children's school and the mothers that you know. I have also said that I supported the idea of testing teenagers/young adults and vaccinating them if necessary because it can be more serious in adults. You just go ahead and ignore all that though so you can make your unfounded, petty jibe. How intelligent of you.

Catherina, perhaps it is because of your blog that your opinion is skewed towards thinking that complications are far more common than they actually are. I suppose it is equivalent so someone having a blog about people whose children have all suffered severe vaccine reactions thinking that reactions to vaccines are more frequent in the population as a whole. Of course, when people with those experiences post on this board you, bruffin (and others) are only too quick to be dismissive of their experiences.

If you remember correctly, my comment about the paper you linked to was to do with the fact that the less serious complications were more likely in healthy children. ( I'm not sure why you think 'I didn't like that', I simply read it and posted a response). You didn't reply to that.

s you are a scientist, I was surprised that you were extrapolating the risk of complications from CP in general based on the few responses on this thread. Quite an unusual approach.

I have never said my anecdote trumps others. You would do well to remember that yourself. Certainly my experience, along with those within my extended family, does support the current view that chicken pox is typically a mild disease and that serious complications are very rare.

Bummbleymummy
No sweeping generalisations from me

Of course, when people with those experiences post on this board you, bruffin (and others) are only too quick to be dismissive of their experiences.

How dare you, i have never been dismissive, however if someones story constantly changes then it is right to question it.

"what else do you expect from BM. She seems to think rare means non existant" not sweeping at all... back at you.

I couldn't be bothered trawling threads to prove your second comment wrong but I've certainly seen it from you before. I'm pretty sure the 'autism presents at the same time as the vaccine' argument has come from you a few times.

I dont think i have actually used that argument, when someone on these boards have anecdotally claimed their child has been affected by mmr, but it is a valid argument and will probably use it when others have claimed they have read it anecdotally, If a poster who makes that claim, then constantly changes their story i am going to challenge it.
Catherina may write a blog and come into more contact with these type of cases, but I dont and as pointed out above, the experiences i have had with chicken pox are first person.
My little friends life is just as valid as anyone elses, you cant dismiss her getting a case of chicken pox which could have killed her because she wasnt as healthy as the next child. Thankfully due to the vaccines at GOSH she survived and is now grown up with her own child.
Most people will have CP with no consequences but being a healthy child wont necessarily prevent strokes like my ds's friend had.

Or saying people have 'recall bias'. That's not being dismissive at all.

Bumbley - and maybe it is because you don't like the fact that chicken pox have enough severe and complicated courses that the "average" is not totally harmless.