PMT and the Rage

[DrBanner]

For the majority of my life, my periods have been nothing more than a minor inconvenience. Relatively light, no major physical issues or even hormonal ones. After my second child about 5 years ago they did become heavier but again nothing particularly difficult to deal with. I do know I've been very lucky here and some people suffer their whole lives.

But now - in the last year - it starts about 24 hours before when I just want to crawl into a dark space and weep, then stomach cramps followed by migraines - all of which would be bad but I guess livable. The worse is the Rage - it builds up inside me and I find it really hard to control it.

This last weekend has been a disaster - hence posting now - a couple of other issues including my father having major surgery have added to the stress levels. I spent the weekend either avoiding the family because I knew I was struggling to control my emotions or exploding at DH because he questioned how I was putting a bike lock on one of the kids bike's. Even the kids got caught up in the storm although I tried my best to avoid this - but sometimes I just feel like I will implode with emotion. Come Monday 48 hours after my period started and as always the Rage has past and I'm left with the tail end of the weeping.

Any one else? Or more importantly any one else with tips on how to control this. I'm 43 so don't know if the change is due to my age and potentially maybe moving towards menopause, not sure what else it could be to have caused the change. But god I could do with some help to improve things. Thanks

I get The Rage too. Not sure how to control it, but just wanted to add my support.

In the week running up to AF, I get incredibly impatient with DP, snappy and bossy. I genuinely believe everything is his fault, and if he doesn't do/say/understand something immediately I hit the roof. I sometimes almost literally see red, it's like something happens to my eyes that I get so angry and short tempered a red smoke descends on me. It is like a drug running through me that alters my brain.

Then AF comes, and it's like a dawning of a bright sunny day and I go "Ah, THAT's why I was angry...maybe it wasn't DPs fault after all..."

All I have done to 'control' this is to recognize it for what it is, explain it to DP, and if I sometimes catch myself 'raging' to apologize to DP and tell him why it is happening. We have a funny name for it, so DP is very good at defusing the situation and saying 'Cosy's Dragon has come out to play - can I have Cosy back please?' It doesn't stop it happening, but it helps us to deal with it. I still feel guilty about what I put DP through though.

I should also recognize when it is likely to happen and avoid things like shopping trips, doing jobs around the home together etc - anything that is likely to cause conflict. But I haven't been that good at forward planning yet.

Can you explain what is happening to your family, and ask for a little leeway around that time of the month? Make a joke out of it, tell them 'DrBanner's dragon' has made an appearance and ask them to give you a little space?

If anyone has any real tips on how to control it, I'd love to hear about it. I've tried Evening Primrose, but no effect.

Wow! This is like reading something I've written myself! I too suffer from 'the rage' in the days leading up to AF and whilst I sadly don't have any magic answers I just wanted to offer my support. Such a relief to find others experiencing the same craziness!

The rage hits me in the week or so running up to AF. I'm not angry and emotional the whole time but it comes in intense waves. A rage can be triggered by the most innocuous thing and I can't always see it coming and I find it very hard to control. As with both of you my poor dh gets the brunt of it - I'm really awful to him and I absolutely hate myself for it very shortly after an outburst. It's just as you say cosy - it's like everything is his fault. I don't manage to keep it from the children like you do though - I rant and shout at them and feel constantly guilty and sad about this, which is the worst thing about all this. I know I should be being grown up about this and controlling myself or at least hiding my mood from them but more often than not I fail . At other times of the month I'm pretty level-headed and much calmer.

I had a bad weekend too and got in a ridiculously irrational rage over nothing at all. Dh was threatening to call my mum as he was so worried - he didn't in the end. He thinks I should go to the dr but last time I mentioned it I was told it was 'normal' for my age - I'm just 38!? Plus, I have a feeling that they'd just try and give me antid's and I know I'm not depressed.

Coping strategies are my next focus - and herbal stuff. I've just started taking angus castes and st Johns wort so we'll see.

I'm due AF any day now and I can't wait for the release it will bring!

Chin up ladies!

I don't manage to keep it from the children like you do though I don't have any kids. I'm sure anyone who is close to me gets the brunt of it though.

Let us know how you get on with the supplements. I'm TTC so I'm not sure I can take any of those though.

I really do think that recognizing what it is, and maybe stepping outside the situation and realizing that you just might be overreacting due to your hormones, can help diffuse the situation. If your DP and DCs can understand that too, they can learn to keep their heads below the parapet at the right time, and just keep calm if you kick off...

Sounds sensible in theory, but in practise when the red mist descends its pretty difficult to do, I know.

I think you're right cosy - accepting it for what it is definitely helps. It makes it less scary for me if nothing else - and puts it in context for dh too. Dcs are way too young to understand - 4 and 8. I say 'mummy gets tired and grumpy sometimes' but that's not really much of an explanation for the way I carry on sometimes. When I'm out of the rage I can think about it so logically and rationally and put plans in place for how I'm going to deal with it but as you say, when the mist descends it's so hard to control.

My reference to keeping it from the kids was aimed at DrBanner - she said she mostly manages to.

I'll keep you posted on the affects of the supplements. I think you would be ok to take angus castus when ttc as I took it to regulate my cycles when I was in your shoes. Not sure about St Johns wort though - probably not.

I'm feeling on a much more even keel today as AF is starting. Phew!!

I have very severe PMS which I pretty much have to plan my life around. The things that help most are meditation, diet (lots of good fats, very few refined carbs) and regular exercise. Tracking my cycles helps a lot, as I know when to expect the worst symptoms so I can make sure that I don't take on any extra responsibilities or plan social events around that time, and I can earn my family and plan really simple meals to cook and arrange for a bit of extra time to myself.

If you respond badly to progesterone, agnus castus is likely to make things worse, by the way.

Another one here with the same story. I have two weeks of being normal laid back me and then two weeks of wailing and gnashing of teeth. I know i am being irrational and see it for what it is but can't stop it. Each month i'm on the verge of packing up and leaving, because dp has put a cushion back upside down or something equally ridiculous. Before i had ds i had even blacker thoughts. I do have a history with anxiety and something seems to happen in my cycle that triggers it again.

I finally went to see my gp about it and am awaiting results of blood tests to check what is going on with my hormones, though she warned me hormone tests are very unreliable as they just show one moment in time, not the fluctuations. Am also being checked out to make sure there is no underlying physical problems as periods have got much heavier and closer together. I'm also 43 and was thinking it might be perimenopause, but she seemed to think it was unlikely (though not impossible) as my mum and gran both didn't begin until their 50s.

I'm due to go back to talk about managing the mood swings once i have the test results, so will let you know if anything useful comes out of that. One thing that does help me to control the worst extremes at least is a daily yoga practice - it helps put me in a calmer place and the exercise helps work out some of the rage. Might be worth trying (just so you know, i recommend yoga for just about everything on here, but that is because it works!).

I went to my doctor recently as my PMS was totally unbearable, think two weeks of intolerable rage before going back to my normal self. She is a great GP who I have dealt with regarding issues of depression before and she took me incredibly seriously.

She went through the following options and this is the order I'm trying them in.

Vitamin B6 - this is where I am at, I'm two cycles in and it does seem to be improving, this month I was a bit grumpy and had one day of very grumpy which whilst not ideal was still much better. I'm going to keep trying for at least two more and make some much needed adjustments to my diet. Calcium is also supposed to help but through diet more than supplements (according to some sources).

The combined pill (the mini pill won't work)

Small dose of anti-depressants.

I should add that I have also been undergoing CBT so this has made a difference generally but I had still been suffering from PMS after my other depression issues were dealt with.

Thanks so much for the responses

Cosy Dr Banner is actually my new nickname due to the speed and ferociousness at which "the Hulk" appeared this weekend! I keep it from the kids mainly by avoiding them - which is probably not healthy either nor is it always possible.

I did lurk in the Menopause topic and there did seem to be others who suffered the same and felt 43 is young but no impossibly young for peri menopausal. Threads there and google suggest B6 and Primrose Oil so now I'm feeling "normal" again I'm going to try those and see how things are next time. I feel I need to at least have some facts like cycle, when symptoms occur etc before I go to the Doctor. As so many of you have said once The Rage passes its easy to be logical - so maybe I'm kidding myself about not needing to get a check up straight away.

But seriously just thanks for responding - this weekend I just felt like the only one ever with uncontrollable rages and realising the impact on the family.

I've always had really bad pmt, i'm 32. I seem to get it straight ovulation time.

I hate being like this (due af 10th) not long to wait. Everybody gets it df and poor ds. It's so horrible!!

DrBanner - that's exactly my thinking when it comes to getting a clear idea of my cycle and when the mood swings are at their worst before going to the Dr. It feels like a positive step to focus on what's happening with my body and try my best to control it or at least cope with it - it's almost like confronting it.

I'm very interested in what msmoss says about experience with a trustworthy dr and will watch with interest to see how things pan out for you. I definitely think I'm going to get some B6 - it sounds like it has to be worth a try. Do you think you can take too many supplements though?

I've said it before, but such a relief to find this thread. I feel less mad already just reading it and knowing I'm not alone!

Hi - if anyone is still reading i had my appointment with the gp. All normal as far as the blood tests show although she reiterated that it doesn't mean that the hormone levels aren't fluctuating abnormally, just that it can't be detected by a single blood test.

I'm having an ultrasound to check for fibroids etc, and then may think about trying tranexamic acid to reduce the bleeding. Weirdly, the last period wasn't so bad - the only change i've made is taking a calcium supplement - no idea if that can/should make a difference?

As far as the mood swings go, it seems likely that in my case at least the pmt and increased stress is triggering my underlying anxiety disorder, so am looking at dealing with that rather than treating the pmt. She did offer medication to deal with the pmt and anxiety but i turned that down as i'm still breastfeeding. Also, given this has been such a long term problem i didn't want to have to rely on medication long term, so i'm starting a combination of cbt and counselling in the new year.

We did discuss the possibility of the mirena coil, theory being that by not having normal periods any more i wouldn't get the symptoms (plus reduced bleeding) - sounded ideal though having read experiences of that on here i'm not feeling confident. Bit worried i could end up with even worse permanent rage instead of no rage.

Don't know if there's anything there that will help anyone else, but thought i'd report back. The gp also pointed me in the direction of this which has a good outline of the options available.

My rage comes on 2 weeks before period is due. I always have an overwhelming urge to smash all the plates. I snap and snarl at the kids like a woman possessed and then I cry non stop for being such a shit mother. If I was offered a million pounds in the middle of it, I swear I still wouldn't be able to stop.
Last night I took some rescue remedy after an outburst and it seemed to calm me down much more quickly. It's worth a try.

Me too and much worse past 40 if agree.
My hatred is usually directed at poor dh but for about 10 days I cannot abide him near me. I am irritated by everything he says it does. I fly into awful rages at the slightest thing and say some horrible things even sometimes to my kids.
I feel anxious and hopeless about my whole life and worry about stupid stuff.
Once my period has come I feel amazing and totally loved up with dh and my life and kids.
I've had some success with supplements but not that much.
I often think dh should leave me as its no fun for him.
I think the idea of warning him is a good one,
I'm 46 so hoping the end is in sight.

Thanks for the update MostlyLL - really interesting to hear what the GP says and how you feel your rages are linked to underlying anxiety. That link is useful too.

I would be wary of the merina coil though - I had one for a while and it made my moods even worse than without. It was like permanent PMS - not good at all so I had it taken out. I do know people that have got on ok with it though.

I am currently in my calm phase and feeling fine. No irrational rages, no snapping at the kids and no flying off the handle at dh over nothing. I'm religiously taking supplements in the hope that this month will be an improvement on last month, which was definitely and improvement on the month before. Plus I'm talking positively to myself and trying to come up with coping strategies for when the dreaded rage does strike. I really don't want to let it beat me again!

Chin up everyone. Still so reassured I'm not alone!

That is just what i'm afraid of Maisy. All the evidence suggests that the mirena hormones are confined to the womb, but all the anecdotes say otherwise. I can't contemplate my mood getting worse than it already does.

While i'm waiting for the cbt to start i'm working on mindfulness to see if that will help. I've practised it for a while in conjunction with my yoga and meditation, but am really focussing on using it as continuously as possible in my bad weeks. The book i'm using is this one. I've read it before but never really followed the whole process, so this time i'm doing it beginning to end. Interestingly, the service i've accessed for counselling also offers courses in mindfulness. It may be worth looking at if it is something you haven't tried - it is hard to lose it if you are being mindful, though remembering to be mindful is the difficult part!

Oh gosh - this is me too.

I think I have always have pmt to some extent - but spent most of my twenties and thirties on the pill - which calmed it down.

I am 45 - so think it could be getting worse due to imminent peri/menopause?

Supplements and meds are complicated for me as am on warfarin.

Exercise is good for me. If I can get out of the house for a run for an hour or so - it does clear my mind a little. And kind of makes me realise that I am capable and free and strong etc...

The book looks like it may help lurchers. Might check that out.

I definitely recommend giving it a go. Yoga and meditation help me immensely but i can't do that 24/7! I hope mindfulness will be able to help 'in the moment' if you see what i mean.

myhucking I wonder why it's then we hate? Maybe it's cis we have to live with them, mine is truly amazing too but I find something to moan about and pull childish faces behind his back! I don't even like the way he walks or moved around the house and god forbid him if he is really annoying I feel murderous.

Yes me too! I'm envied. I wonder if that's the key, we know we can get away with it.

I've been taking agnus castus for 3 months now, and my monthly symptoms have gradually decreased in hideousness. But I reckon it's too early to say that it's definitely helped.

If it gets too bad, doctors can prescribe ADs for PMT, to be taken in the latter half of the cycle. I did try Sertraline for a bit- and my God, it totally cleared the PMT symptoms!- but nothing comes without a price, and I gave it up because I didn't like the side effects. I'd say worth a try if it becomes incapacitating though.

This rings lots of bells with me too. I have always had PMS, and worse since the dcs (7-10) days of depression, rage etc).

However the last year I've been taking fluoxetine (Prozac) for depression and the rage has gone. Tiny bit of irritability but insignificant. My gp said that a low dose of fluoxetine is sometimes prescribed for severe pms. Before my depression I would have said no thanks, but to be honest, I am not looking forward to coming off this and have the pms return. So although it seems like a drastic measure, in my experience it is well worth considering.

Well, there's quite a gaggle of us now, and i don't know about anyone else but it definitely helps me to know I'm not the only one to suffer this. It really does make me feel slightly more sane which is very helpful!!

I don't mean to scaremonger Lurcher, but I would be wary of the merina. As I say, I do know people who have used it with no ill-affects but it certainly didn't agree with me. It's all trial and error.

I'm very interested in the mindfulness approach though and will definitely look at that book. Thanks for sharing. I like the philosophy of somehow taking control of the situation and taking some responsibility for making it better rather than being completely resigned to hormones.

Pleased to hear op (sorry, can't remember who!) say that angus castus seems to be making things a bit less hideous. I'm really hoping it's going to make a difference for me! I'm taking B6 and St. John's wort too.

How's things with you DrBanner? - I'm so grateful to you for starting this thread. Hope you're doing ok!