Has anybody decided not to vaccinate their child or to only selectively vaccinate them?

[arabella2]

And if so, how did you come to that decision. Ds has not had any vaccinations as yet, but once he goes to nursery I think it may become more important. Even then though we do not want him to have the whole lot as we think it's too much for the system to absorb, but it is very difficult to know which ones are more important and also better tolerated by the body. We would also go for mercury free vaccinations which my gp told me were available. I want to know, if they are available, why aren't they offered as a matter of routine - expense presumably.
The whole thing is a minefield because it seems to be very difficult to get a balanced viewpoint of the whole issue with the pro people being very pro and the contra people being very against.
Any thoughts appreciated but no lecturing please.

One of my boys had 'viraemia' when he had mumps. Is that related to viral meningitis or encephalitis, does anyone know? He was crabbit and had a fever and pin prick rash, like the one you get in meningitis. Dr said it wasn't serious and ds recovered in a couple of days. Dh had mumps at 36yo. He felt deathly but didn't have any symptoms down below, thank goodness.

Aloha- according to that sunday times article the dept of health has no plans to bring in varivax now. Thought that was interesting.

Pupuce - you WANT your children to get measles??? It's not always just a bit of a temperature and a few spots. I had measles at age 3 and it affected my eyes badly. I had to have an operation to have them uncrossed (!) but that was the least of the problems. I had to wear glasses too - not trendy ones like you get now, but nasty little round NHS ones (which my Mum tied on with string as I wouldn't wear them ). I had to go to the hospital every three weeks for years to do exercises and have my eyes checked. They improved a bit and stabilised for a while but have never been "normal". Last visit to optician I was told that I may have to have another op in a few years as it looks like the squint might be coming back (nice). And more seriously, my eyesight is deteriorating again and I will probably end up blind in one eye. All measles related. Up to you if you vaccinate - both of mine had the MMR, late after a lot of agonising over whether to do it - DD1 is asthmatic, DD2 has eczema. And both were, fortunately, fine. I don't live in UK (but in EU) and they have no fuss over the MMR here. Single vaccines were available here until last year, but now it's the MMr or nothing.

Tnazie - I am very sorry you were affected badly by measles... I had it too, so did DH and my own brother and BILs.... mone of us had any real problem with it. I do know the risks I still prefer it for my kids to get their immunity from the real disease not the vaccine. For what it's worth I do know a child who had the MMR vaccine (and the booster) and got really bad measles.... you can NOT be full proof what ever you do.
I respect your views, I would hope you respect mine - they are equally thought through... it's actually VERY hard to decide not to vaccinate !

And measles outbreaks have been recorded in fully vaccinated populations. I can dig out the reference if anyone wants it. No guarantees indeed (actually it was a GP who told me that- about the guarantees).

Believe it or not there are some advantages to getting measles. One being lifelong immunity. And immunity passed onto young babies. I've been reliieved for ds1 and ds2 that I had measles. Others being conditions you are less likely to get if you have had measles. Of course this is only an advantage if you get through measles unscathed (as I did- although my mum had a terrible time with measles and was left deaf in one ear because of measles- she won't let ds2 anywhere near the MMR though). As always its swings and roundabouts.

Both DD and DS had everything other than MMR more or less on schedule although they had bad reactions to the triple. They had to have second and third doses in hospital being monitored which took time to set up so were a bit late getting these.

I hummed and hahhed over MMR for a long time and finally got DD vaccinated with single doses at 3.5. DS had singles at 2.5, but still hasn't had mumps as they have run out of vaccines.

Its soooooo difficult isn't it. I just felt I had to be socially responsible enough to have measles done, but I am very aware that I could afford to make the choice to go for single vaccines. However at £180 for the three injections many families can not afford that choice and I do really really feel for them

SF Zebra - appreciate that, where kids are concerned, it can be nastier to have blood taken than a jab, but don't think that even Wakefield has ever suggested that bloodtests might be linked to autism.

SF Zebra - appreciate that, where kids are concerned, it can be nastier to have blood taken than a jab, but don't think that even Wakefield has ever suggested that bloodtests might be linked to autism.

aargh

My 16 month old dd has been vaccinated for everything that she is due, including MMR. I can't pretend to be as well informed and well read on the subject as some of you, but I put my faith in the BMA, RCN, and general NHS policy.... on the basis that the medical experts are precisely that - medical experts. And whilst this doesn't preclude them from making errors of judgement, I surmised that they are more likely to be collectively 'right' than lay people (however well read)......

Both my sons had MMR jabs,ds1 is now 6 & has high functioning ASD & ds2 is now 3 & is autistic-no speech,in his own world etc.I recorded the film & debate on MMR but have yet to watch it.
My mother didnt let me have any jabs as a child so I suffered with all the childhood illnesses & am partially deaf from one of them.
So I am quite up in the air on wether its a good or bad thing.Theres definately not enough info available to the public to be able to make a proper informed decision about something that can affect our childrens lives.

I've done the lot, I'm afraid.

Measles - which I had as a child, very mildly - scares me stiff because my mother's eyes were damaged in a very similar manner to Tanzie's, and a friend of mine went deaf for a year as a child. I know all this is purely anecdotal, but it still scares me.

If I want mercury-free, pathetic question but how do I insist?

MMR is mercury free, IIRC, always has been. It's the diptheria-tetanus-etc. bundle that still has mercury preservative in it.

To clarify that point about insisting - the way jabs are done at my GP practice is that you ring up, you book, you turn up. Or you go to the **ing baby clinic. Should I book a specific appointment with someone - GP/practice nurse? - to discuss the jabs? Or what? I genuinely get fazed by the 'we are the professionals, we're doing it this way' approach (couldn't get a blood test as well as a scan when I wanted one in pregnancy because the midwife refused...).

Exactly my view Handlemecarefully!

I think I would start by making appt. with a GP, M'Inferior.

hmc- they are right - but only in their field. Which is public health in terms of infectious disease. In other words their interests are not mine. I'm interested in the whole health of my child. It is well known that the 2 interests can collide. For example all vaccinaions carry a risk of death- even if it that is from anaphylaxis from an added ingredient. For that child public health has been determined to be more important than their life. Extreme case-and not a reason to stop vacinating- but it happens and is why thereshould be a decent vaccination compensation fund- rather than the shambles they have currently.

The decisions taken are often pot luck. A friend of mine has a fully vaccinated dd, and unvaccinted ds. She is now completely relieved she didn't vaccinate as her ds has been dxed with epilepsy and the dtp is contraindicated for children with epilepsy. If he had been her first he would havebeen vaccinated. There is another mum on mumsnet (maternity leave at the moment) who was put under enormous pressure to give her 2nd child the baby jabs- her second child was ill and she refused. When she finally saw a consultant immunologist he said that had she vaccinated him the polio would probably have killed him (her story is on the circumcision thread). Always swings and oundabouts in an individuals case.

Remember as well a lot of these people are doctors. They are not scientific researchers and they have a very different training to those in research. I don't quite count myslef as lay as I have a PhD in Biology. I'm quite happy to read everything out there and take on board what it says (which is that no-one knows very much about vaccinations).

this is a good article explaining the problems with the studies.
www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2002/10/27/nvacc27.xml&

Certainly vaccines work in terms of reducing population levels of certain infectious diseases. It's the other health issues that concern me.

motherinferior- I had a chat with the practice nurse when I was dithering and she was happy to order in thimerosil free. I do have the added advantage of having an auti eldest though- they tend to shift a bit then. However you may have more a problem now as the dpet of health don't want babies to recieve the thimerosil free jabs at the moment (as they contain acellular pertussis rather than whole cell- and they think this may have caused the recent hib problem- although they don't know). Unless someone has now produced thimerosil free wP jabs (hadn't last time I looked into it).

motherinferior, nothing to be 'afraid' about...you did what you thought best.
dd1 had normal triples, but I asked GP for mercury-free jabs for dd2 and after she dug out some info for me to read we got them, just like that. the nurse did try to make me feel bad though, because it means an extra needle each time (cos you have men C too) and she gave me this look that meant..."why are you doing this?"

bundle you're doing it because mercury is one of the most toxic substances known to man. If someone said "here's some thimerosil can I inject it into your child please" you'd say no.

It's only in the jabs as the drugs companies can't be arsed to make the products in sterile conditions.

Aren't there risks from more or less everything to do with modern medicine? I had a very serious reaction to pennicilin when I was a toddler and a child in DHs family died from a local anaestetic.....We all know there are risks. However, I believe that you have to weight up the risks and take a rational decision. I know that if I was really unlucky, my child could react badly to the vaccine. But yes, public health is important to me. It worries me that the vaccination figures are so low. It also scares me when people come on this thread and actually want their child to catch measles. Perhaps those people should travel the world a bit. Look at the devastating effects of measles on populations who have no access to vaccination? Or perhaps speak to parents of children who have been damaged by the illnesses? Or to my friend whose "heart baby" would probably not survive measles and she is relying on us parents of healthy babies to vaccinate to prevent epidemics.

And of course we are all interested in the "whole" health of our children. Sorry, but I didn't get that point Jimjams......

FM- exactly that is my point. Parents are interested in the whole health of their child. When people implement vaccination programmes they are interested in the effect it has on the incidence of that disease. Adverse reations are widely recognised to be completely under-reported (read calling the shots if you disagree) even by those who are pro vaccination. Vaccination has been potentially linked to all sorts of problems. The safetly studies that need to be done simply haven't. The public health officials though are not looking out for these sorts of problems at the moment.

DD is due to have the MMR vaccine in two months' time and we are trying to decide what to do. We have followed discussions in the media and have talked to a friend who is a GP and are likely to go ahead with it. However, there is one thing we can't get a straight answer about and that is the reason why single-vaccines are not available through the NHS. Is is simply due to concerns about non-compliance, as children need a series of injections, or are there specific concerns about single vaccines themselves? Any medics who can enlighten me?

it is due to concerns about non-compliance.

i'm not a medic - doubtless you will have seen the doh's "mmr the facts" - that is the reason given there.