Menopause?? I really hope not.

[bubble99]

For the last couple of months my periods have been unusual for me. DS3 was born 10 and a half months ago and I think my ovulation was beginning to become a bit screwy when he was conceived, as he was a twin (his twin died).

I stopped B/F completely in September (I think!) First period afterwards was very light but the last three have been very heavy and have lasted for two days longer than usual. Also, mood swings Weepy one day and raging the next (again, unlike anything I've experienced before).

I'm TTC again and was really upset when my last AF showed up (which could explain the weepiness) but it's the raging which bothers me most.
Can anyone, who is either going through or has been through the menopause tell me what their periods were like before they stopped?
My mum was 48 when she went through it, so I'm a few years away (if family history plays a part) I'm 40 in July and I'm going to make an appointment to see my GP to see if I can have an ovarian reserve test, but I'm hoping someone can give me some clues based on their own experiences.

Thanks.

Aloha.

You are a wise woman. And spot-on. It must be grief and yet I feel that I can't allow myself to dive in to it, because I'm not sure that I'll ever come out again. It's like pulling a plaster off. I know it's going to hurt but instead of getting it over with and yanking the damn thing off and feeling relief, I'm edging the corners up slowly, then stopping when it hurts too much.

What's eating me is that there was nothing wrong with him. He was a healthy 7lb7oz baby who should have lived. If he'd died because of something that was wrong with him I could deal with it, it would hurt but it would have been 'God's will'.

I haven't looked at his 'photos yet. 10 nearly 11 months on and they are still in an unopened envelope in the cupboard where I put them when I came home from hospital. His ashes are in a jar on top of the 'fridge, still in the cardboard box that the crematorium man put the jar in. I looked at the cremation certificate but when I saw his name and address...address? Why? The poor little mite never made it home, I crumpled and buried my head again.

I've spent the last decade not dealing with grief. Dad, brother and son. What do I do? I need to do something. I need to pull one huge plaster off, but I'm frightened of how I'm going to feel. I tried counselling after my dad and brother died (within a year of each other) but I spent so much time avoiding the pain that I was un-counsellable. My physical pain threshold is very high but emotionally it's non-existent.

I'm so, so sorry Bubble. I truly don't know what to say. You are right. He should be here, right now. Your beautiful son died for no good reason. It is unimaginable really to those of us who have not suffered as you have. I think of you and your lovely son quite often.
You must deal with it as you can, though maybe it will be helpful to think of all this anger and all those tears as normal grief, not a sign that you are mad or sick. Because it is normal to be utterly stricken by sadness if your child dies.
Are you thinking of having a funeral for him? Are you religious?

No, not particularly religious, though I do believe in a 'higher power'. I certainly don't want to believe in Karma as I must have done something particularly awful to have deserved this.

Mr Bubble is Jewish, though not observant, he likes the traditions and culture of Judaism but not it's (or any other religion's) dogma. Jews have a year between burial and 'stone-setting'. They believe that this gives time for the bereaved to come to terms with their loss and for the emotions and the ground to, quite literally, settle. I like this idea and we've decided to scatter Bo's ashes around the time of Elijah's birthday in February.

I remember jangus, who posted here at around the time that Bo died. Her full-term daugher was stillborn and she spent hours looking at her pictures. I suspect she's dealt with it all for the better by doing so.

I know, Aloha, that I shouldn't even think of having another baby until I've dealt, or even begun to deal with this, and I'm not sure what I'm hoping to gain from posting all of this. It just helps to get some of it out. I know that what's festering under my emotional plaster is getting very smelly and I know that it's affecting how I think and feel. I just need to be brave, don't I.

Oh Bubble, oh I'm so sorry. No wonder you're having mood swings - I'm so glad Aloha knew and 'spoke' out loud; grief makes so, so much sense. I had no idea. And I utterly understand the scariness of diving into your grief for your son, let alone all three losses.

Re earlier post: of course I don't mind you asking about me and TTC, though I'm not sure that is the issue now...plus, not worth comparing, I had other problems: long story short, I started TTC late due to illness, then had immune issues that caused multiple miscarriages, by the time they were diagnosed I was well over 40 and in the end I had my DD via egg donation. And I love her to bits, and its more than ok.

Thats not you, though, thats me. And, loss and grief can play havoc with your body as well as your feelings - once you are able to grieve some more, you might well find your cycle normalises.

Hugs and hope you get all the support you deserve in grieving and honouring your baby..xxx

I wouldn't dream of presuming to tell you how you need to handle this. Maybe you are doing exactly what you need to do. I think it's lovely that you are planning to scatter Bo's ashes. Though even I feel horrified that this is what you need to do and I have never even met you, so I am full of admiration for your ability to just get up in the morning.
Having another baby is something that only you know when and if you are ready for. It's such a personal thing and you also know that you don't have five years to make this decision. I certainly would never say it was wrong to have another child. You cannot replace Bo, and you know that. He was a one off, like all children are. I'm sure that seeing his twin grow and thrive is both a comfort and a source of pain to you. I do think grief is a very personal thing but to have a baby die and not feel it is impossible. And grief is a strange thing, that can easily manifest itself as anger, exhaustion, physical illness - anything really.

ps I think you ARE brave. And clear.

Yes, I think you are incredibly brave.

Maybe you need to get all the grief and anger and pain from the loss of Bo and your father and your brother (I didn't know about them before, bubble - I'm surprised Bo's death didn't hit you even harder than it did, after that) out of your system before your hormones can settle down into a sensible rhythm again. And worrying about being menopausal will probably mess them up even more...

I have only skimmed the thread so don't know if you are considering grief counselling of some kind? It sounds as if you have a huge burden of emotion to deal with before you can move on. I hope so much you will move on, and will be able to conceive - without IVF ideally - and eventually look at those pictures and remember your boy with just as much sadness but not the same anger and pain.

Thanks Aloha. Thanks Eli. Thanks all of you,

The power of mnet, eh?! I feel better for having talked to you tonight.

I feel I need to deal with Bo's death before I (hopefully|) get pregnant again. I think I've always known this, tonight has helped to clarify it.

Thanks again.

XX

bubble...i instantly agreed with aloha's first post and have been agreeing ever since.

if there was a reaching out to give you a hug emoticon i'd be typing it.

x

Aloha - what great posts - what a great person you are to have around here

Bubble - I've never experienced the loss of a child, but I have had some painful times in my life! IME, the fear of what lies under the plaster, was always much much worse than what was actually there!

A radical plan perhaps - but would it be possible to disappear with Mr Bubble for a few days before Bo and Elijah's birthday? Maybe book a long weekend at a cottage somewhere, with the express point of the weekend being to have a grief fest - to let it all out - lance the boil if you like.

Time to remember carrying Bo for the last few days, to look at his scan photos with Elija next to him, to look at his birth photo's, the cards people sent. To get all the dreaded bits over with, so that you can return to celebrate Elijah and Bo's birthdays having taken time out to grieve.

I'm sure it seems very scary, but it might just be what you need to do - to unlock the pain that you are carrying around with you!

As Aloha says, all of us can only imagine what you have gone through, and that is harrowing enough You have lived the stuff that is our nightmares - and it is little wonder that you are grief stricken, angry, sad, bitter, incadenscently furious - had it happened to us, we would have been too, we really would have been

Oh bubble you are so so brave.

I agree with aloha totally. It must be tough coming up to Elijahs (and Bo's) birthday too. I cant begin to imagine how you must feel.

And soapbox is so right too.

I think having a look at those photos and seeing your son as he was, instead remembering him as this huge battle you are having with the hospital/medical council. I hope you know what i mean by that.

Dagnabbit! And now I'm crying again. But for all the right reasons.

It's odd. I've had a feeling of 'observing' what's happened for the last (nearly a) year. It really has felt as though it's happened to someone else. I worked as a Marie Curie nurse for a year and a half. It sounds odd, 'enjoyed' is not the right word, but it was rewarding to help people come to terms with death or the death of loved ones. I had to stop when my dad died as it was too close to home. When Bo died I had this feeling of detatchment. I couldn't stop myself from feeling like a nurse rather than a mother. It was, I suppose, my way of dealing with the awfulness of it all.

I held Bo in the room that I was taken to after the CS. I don't remember it clearly as I was zonked on Morphine. I saw and held him three days later but Mr Bubble didn't want to see him again and hasn't looked at the ashes/photos either.

I think he's as much of an ostrich as I am.

That's a good suggestion, Soapy. I think we both need to face our pain. And I do need to be able to see him again, if only in a 'photo.

Thanks to all of you. This is going to sound schmaltzy, but I grew up in a family of boys, ended up with three sons yet always wanted some sisters. I count you now as my mnet sisters.

Bubble XXXX

Hey Sis

There are loads of us here who won't forget Bo in a hurry, if ever

We're here for you if and when you need an ear

Take care xx

After Octavia, one of my twins, died I felt a huge urge to carry a pregnancy through to term - not sure why, it certinly wasn't to replace her. I needed to look through her stuff loads of times, and needed to write my story down. It took a long time to get through. I really think that looking through her stuff worked for me. Her tiny ashes are still in our safe but I no longer panic about hiding them when we go away. I'm waffling and not sure what I'm saying but I totally agree with Aloha about giving time to grieve. I wish you all the best for the future.

Bubble I can not begin to understand how you feel with your loss but a very dear friend of mine lost a baby at term and struggled for years to come to terms with it she tried on her own and that eventually landed her on ADs ... she found the best thing that helped her was bereavement counselling she says now that she had wished she had done it far sooner to help her deal with the huge emotions she was carrying round and that stopped her from moving forward ... the change in her after just a few sessions was amazing - maybe it would help you to deal with your grief in this type of sorted environment...

TTC is the most stressful thing I have ever done it took me 2 years to get my DS and 2 years and treatment to get my DD (and I lost her twin in pregnancy) I would so recommend you give yourself some support to deal with your grief -- don't over load yourself by trying to do it on your own...

safe environment not sorted sorry did not check as am a bit teary... a lot of what you are going thru is close to my heart...

I am not as eloquent as Aloha, Soapbox or others, but I also offer my shoulder bubble.
Thinking of you xx

bubble99
I was reading your thread just before I went to bed last night and was really glad you were getting such a supportive response. I must admit I have thought about it a lot and the only other thing I wanted to add was that maybe everything is coming to a head emotionally for you now. Maybe that is why you were taking it out on dh, xmas and new year is an emotional time and you are coming up to the 1st anniversary for little Bo as well .
Bereavement counselling really helped my friend who had a still born baby girl last April , her dp went as well and I don't think it helped him as much. Maybe you are now more ready for it than you thought .
I really wanted to reply as I have followed your story and feel a bit of an intruder as I have not had such a loss but have thought of you and your family many times. I hope 2006 is a good year for your whole family, be kind to yourself..

I dont have sisters either bubble (have 3 brothers). Im glad of the sisterly support here too

And happier if i can be of any support any time too.

Hey bubble. I usually agree with aloha and this is no exception. I really do think you need to be brave and pull that sticking plaster off - I don't know how, but I do know you can't ignore grief. You can defer it, but at some point it will come back and hit you with the force of a juggernaut.

I really hope your fears about an early menopause are unfounded. I'm sure the amount of stress you're under has as much to do with your iffy cycle as anything else. Going to your GP is definitely the next step - I don't know if counselling would be more helpful now than when you tried it before?

It took me two years to conceive when we started trying again after ds1 (and then I miscarried and it was another 6 months before we conceived ds2) so I do know a little about that feeling of despair when another unwanted af appears. I also had two cycles of Clomid but it didn't work for me - I was about to go up to the higher dose when ds2 was conceived (sheer luck - I had no regular cycle at all!)

I've not added anything to this that's different to what everyone else has said - I just wanted to add my voice in support. As soapbox said, a lot of us here remember Bo.

Much love x

Oh and it's strange but I was talking to my Mum only the other day about the Jewish tradition of waiting a year after burial to place a marker (we're not Jewish, btw). She said she'd always liked that idea because she said the first year is the hardest - each 'first' anniversary is something to get through - birthday, Christmas, the anniversary of the death. Once that first year has passed and you have survived all those dates - it doesn't get 'easier' but it isn't so new and raw anymore.

Oh I don't even know if that's true - everyone is different - but it made some sense to me.

Oh dear, I just posted this on WethreelittlebabiesOfOrientAre's thread about her first baby's birthday instead of here...

In the dentist's waiting room this morning I was reading GH and it had a piece about Lindsay Nicholson, who used to be the editor. She lost her husband and then their elder daughter to leukaemia and has written a book about what happened then and afterwards - it's called Living on the Seabed: A memoir of love, life and survival .

I thought of you the whole time I was reading the article, bubble. XXX

Bubble
Nothing to add. Just thinking of you and wishing you a good day.