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See all MNHQ comments on this thread

To not let dd have the HVP vaccination?

999 replies

DogGoneMad · 22/09/2011 22:20

Dh and I really disagree on this.

OP posts:
Blueberties · 24/09/2011 01:28

I do agree that her disease might have been prevented by the vaccine - of course. I am in no way an absolutist - I'm not sure why you think firstly, that HPV doesn't cause cancer or that the vaccine can prevent HPV. I've never said this, whereas you claim that vaccination is the only thing that could have been effective.

This is my understanding of your posts - I think you've been quite emphatic on this but given the heated nature of some of your posts it's possible that you do not think that vaccination is the only intervention that would have been effective. It would be helpful if you could make this clear now.

I don't think the risks of the vaccine are justified when regular and frequent smears are needed anyway, and when the vaccine doesn't preclude the need for regular and frequent smears.

I know where ever she is she is shouting at you I have no idea what you are talking about

You've the same right as anyone to your own opinion yes I have - please stop abusing it

but you have not managed to address any of the facts I have given. actually not ten minutes ago I pointed out that you were absolutely wrong about post rollout event investigation

no matter how much you roll your eyes or call me names don't like it? don't do it and these debates will remain much more temperate. you haven't been called anything you haven't used yourself - first.

Blueberties · 24/09/2011 01:29

Unfortunately pap smearing is being pushed back and will probably be pushed back further because of the vaccine. Therefore I will pay rather than risk the vaccine.

PIMSoclock · 24/09/2011 01:31

Goodnight bb, I'll be sure to post a witty response first thing in the morning

PIMSoclock · 24/09/2011 01:33

And stop accusing me of abuse. If you can find any report it!! I'll do the same

Blueberties · 24/09/2011 01:34

I don't care for wit, or point-scoring. This isn't a game. If I talk to you the undesirable way you talk to me - that's to show you what it's like and because I want you to stop. It's has nothing to do with the subject in hand, and I'm only interested in talking about the subject in hand. We are adults.

Blueberties · 24/09/2011 01:35

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Blueberties · 24/09/2011 01:36

Yes, I'm sure you will now have a hunt through to look for anything to report. You are quite happy to start name-calling but less happy when you are called on it.

PIMSoclock · 24/09/2011 01:37

Hardly abuse bb, a wee bit of perspective please
Night

PIMSoclock · 24/09/2011 01:38

And I'm not that petty, im not the one claiming abuse.
Have no intention of reporting, missing posts spoil the flow of the debate

Blueberties · 24/09/2011 01:41

"Hardly abuse"? I have called it name-calling, though I haven't reported it. Let's see if you do.

Anyone who is very confident in the cogency of their argument ought to have no need to resort to this.

PIMSoclock · 24/09/2011 01:43

Love how this ends the way all other vax threads do, a few posters left claiming abuse and petty name calling.
Think perhaps I'll just give a summary of all the info and refs tomorrow.
That would be useful.

Blueberties · 24/09/2011 01:43

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Blueberties · 24/09/2011 01:44

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PIMSoclock · 24/09/2011 01:44

Are you still talking bb, cause I dong see anything helpful in ur posts now.
Maybe you should go to bed too.
You'll give better info after a good nights sleep x

Blueberties · 24/09/2011 01:45

And I am thinking not only of this thread, but future threads. There is no need for the kind of childish response we have seen from "your crew" today.

Blueberties · 24/09/2011 01:46

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PIMSoclock · 24/09/2011 01:46

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PIMSoclock · 24/09/2011 01:47
Smile
PIMSoclock · 24/09/2011 01:48

Have actually had quite a few emails saying how helpful my info was. Glad you noticed

bumbleymummy · 24/09/2011 07:36

PIMS, I hope you are right. I hope that cervical cancer cases continue to reduce with more people taking up screening and that the vaccine does offer some protection without us finding out about some long term side effects. At this stage I don't think there is enough evidence to completely reassure me of the vaccine's safety. (yes, i have read what you have posted and more) It is still early enough for the benefits to be exaggerated while the risks are underplayed or even not completely known.

Historically, vaccines are released with claims that they don't live up to. The MMR was supposed to be one vaccine for life. Now there seems to be a need for a third booster for teenagers/young adults. The first MMR was introduced and had to be withdrawn within a few years due to safety concerns. The OPV vaccine had to be withdrawn because it was actually causing cases of Polio. The swine flu vaccine has been linked to narcolepsy 2 years after we were told it was perfectly safe. Who knows what else we'll find out about it. I'm sorry but with that track record I just can't have the blind faith in the vaccine that you have. I'll be watching with interest but I wouldn't be lining up for it just yet and I wouldn't be encouraging my daughter to either.

As an aside, I'm glad I wasn't holding my breath for an apology. Not sure why you think that it isn't rude to accuse someone of being insensitive and inflammatory when they post their personal experience and when you realise you are wrong you apologise to the person you misled but not the person you accused. A bit petty don't you think? .

ArthurPewty · 24/09/2011 07:42

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Blueberties · 24/09/2011 09:27

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PIMSoclock · 24/09/2011 09:40

No don't think I've been petty.
Back to the issues please!Smile

silverfrog · 24/09/2011 09:59

THe issue is that screening is as effective a tool against cervical cancer as the vaccine is being made out to be.

unfortunately, unlike the vaccine, screening is not being pushed at everyone, form a young age.

it is being pushed back and back, and there are many people who underplay the importance of it as part of the prevention of cervical cancers. how many times have we heard someone say "oh, my smear is overdue?"

how many teenage girls do you know that would happily go along for smears? I certainly know from my teenage years that the majority do not (back in my day it was from age 20, or within 2 years of becoming sexually active, whichever was sooner; and repeated every 2 years. it is nothing like that now) the surgery at my university had a hard enough time convincing young women to go along when it was the recommended regime. I hardly think that there will be many teenagers today who push for smears, following a jab which they will probably (judging form how badly the information is being absorbed at the moment) think is a total prevention.

it is shocking that a method thought ot be as effective as the vaccine, and with many more years behind it to back it up, is being overlooked and pushed back, when it should, if the aim of the health dept is really ot dramatically reduce numbers, being pushed equally aggressively - that would indeed be a regime worth aiming for.

but instead, the dept of health is pushing a vaccine (effectively putting it out for mass trial), and hoping that the following years prove that it is both as effective as they hope (recent track record with vaccines does not make this likely) and as safe as they hope (ditto).

Blueberties · 24/09/2011 10:05

Absolutely. And it's worse than "being overlooked" - it seems it's now being denigrated as risky, dangerous, invasive and ineffective. A smear test.

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