Advice on anorexia - any help/comments appreciated

[LudwigvanBeethoven]

Hi, I am new to Mumsnet and I'm only sorry I'm posting on this subject as my first posting.

I'll be as brief as poss - I'm in my mid 40s and have two daughters aged 6 and 3 - I was anorexic, not too badly so, in my early 20s but it has now returned. I am concerned at the distress it causes my husband, who is the light of my life, and my two beautiful girls - I fear that at some point soon they're going to pick up on it, but I really cannot force myself to do the evening meal thing any more - it is causing me so much distress and panic. In my view I am pretty overweight - all this BMI stuff is only a guideline, as is the weight to height ratio - I am 5ft 8ins and weigh two pounds under 8 stone in the morning and 8 stone 2 in the evening. Seriously, if you saw me you would say that I am not underweight and really I am overweight - I carry too much weight that really is not necessary.

Yet, my views on my weight are at odds with my family and it's this distress that concerns me. At the moment I feel that I am condemned to a life of being fat just so that I don't cause any problems. Needless to say this is doing my head in. I am booked to see a specialist counsellor next week but I have to say that my dealings with counselling in the past has not been great, so I have warned the counsellor I'm seeing of that.

It was the visit to my GP that gave me a bit of a shock. I went to him recently and said that another issue I had was related to the fact that I carried too much weight. now, a while back he had asked me if I had always "been that slight" and I had told him about the anorexia of 25 years ago. So, on this recent visit he got incredibly upset and said "what are we going to do? are we going back to the anorexia again?" I wasn't really able to give a coherent reply other than that it might help to get a psychiatric assesment rather than "prescribe something to lift you out of this" which is what he offered also.

I'm in a bit of quandery here - so any advice or comments would be so much appreciated. This is unbelievably selfish, but all I want to do is to be thin and all I can see is how fat and pathetic I am as person and frankly a really rubbish mother if being thin is more important than their well being.

An update and a query - still going strong with the counselling but here's the thing - I have now become extremely dependent on the counsellor - is this normal? I actually only feel safe when I am with her and now find life in between the sessions really, really hard and frightening.

She has pointed out to me that I am extremely distressed at present - just working through lots of stuff, so I guess I'm going to cling on to to anything that is perceived as remotely secure, but this is just such a hard process - I am remembering more unsavoury things from the past that I know is good to work through and process but which I find hard to move along. I don't think I have ever felt this vulnerable or sad. Will it get better?

Hello G here.

What you describe sounds really really good, it made me so relieved in a way - I know it's horrible, but it sounds like proper catharsis is happening and that means your counselling is working.

It's totally normal, it's a good thing, this is what she is trained for and yes you will come through it!

You're doing really well. Don't stop now. She is there to hold your head above water through this so you can experience the feelings you've been storing for so long. It's the only way to get rid of them and get well again.

Good luck xx

Thank you so much G - I really, really needed to hear this. I so much appreciate it. At the moment I am finding it hard on so many different levels that I didn't know was possible. I seriously do not know how this amazing woman does this job - there must be such a vocational part to it and yet she must have to apply such a professional attitude towards in order to protect herself. AT this stage I'm more worried about her than I am about me.
Of course I may find that at times I'll want to never speak to her again but if it means that whatever she is doing is working then great. My only issue is that I wish I was a stone lighter...

She will be fine. She is probably really pleased that you are able to do what the whole thing is about. I bet most of her customers don't get that far

It's part of the training and also that she does not have a connection to you outside the therapy setting that she will know exactly how to cope with you, and all the stuf you need, to hate her and love her and need her.

It's alright.
x

I guess she will be fine - she must be used to it. I would hate to bother her outside of our time together in therapy, but she really is such an incredible person. If she has children of her own they are very, very lucky.
Thank you so much for your reassurance. It means alot.

hello, sorry for the long pause - DS has been poorly and I've been offline. I'm really glad you're getting so much out of your counselling Ludwig. How have you been doing today? I hope things are getting better :)

Hello Overcameana - thanks for writing and do hope your DS is better. It's that time of year with the beginning of the new term etc.
Thanks for asking about the counselling. It has been really, really hard but she seems to be pleased with the way I'm going. I have had a pretty tough time with depression - some days I really don't want to do it any more - it's far safer in my own little world to stay where I am. I think though, I've come to terms with the things that my father did and can put that away and not use it as lever to activate the currently unhelpful coping mechanism. My only issue at the moment is that I am vomiting quite a lot - not that I am making myself (well not most of the time) but just that when I do eat now I really do feel so sick that I actually am. Anyway - I'll keep soldiering on...

Oh dear God, big set back these last two days - one specific event that's just too boring to talk about. Crashingly low and anything I have eaten I've vomited. I don't understand why I'm doing this - it's driving me mad. All I want is to lose weight - a rather pathetic mantra but I cannot think of anything more real at the moment. Bad day I guess...Sorry for this whingeing post but I feel really lost and frustrated that I"m not helping myself.

I just stumbled here and wanted to send out some love to you. I suffered from anorexia from age 16 to 27/28 but I'm now 100% recovered - it is possible, so please hold that thought. I'm so glad to hear you are having counselling. It took 5 years of counselling to put me right, together with a regular meeting with a dietician - might this be something you could ask about? It helped to hear objective facts (and practical, doable eating ideas) that were about keeping my body healthy and working, coupled with the emotional support and proactive advice that counselling offered. I haven't read the full thread but will and I feel so much for you. I could type a book on things that helped me but my key message would be this:

Anorexia is an illness. It will tell you you are fat and you will believe it. This does NOT mean it is an objective truth. Frame it as your enemy, and one that will pull a lot of punches. Get angry with it and fight back. To do this, you need help, so however tough it gets - keep going. Tiny steps eventually cover huge distances. Life is nicer out of the tunnel, and it isn't such scary place to be, I promise.

All the very best to you. PM me and ask anything you need, if this might help.

Thank you so much for this - It is really encouraging to read that you have 100% recovered. At the moment I can't even begin to imagine what that must feel like as I equate recovery with getting even fatter than I already am. I have been out tonight and had some red wine and bread which equals failure, but on a good note I haven't vomited anything up.
Thank you for saying that life outside the tunnel is better and not so scary. It's the lack of safety that I feel on a daily basis and it would be nice not to feel like this, I must admit.
Every morning I get up and hope that I won't give in to my weakness and end up eating something. It makes me feel such a desperate loser.

My counsellor is really, really good and is also a dietician - hopefully we'll get to talking about the food side of things - but at the moment we're still dealing with my past; she is keen to make progress on the present too, which I wish to embrace for the sake of my two children and very, very understanding husband but at the moment I really do feel that they are better off without me as I feel that I am putting them in more danger by existing with them on daily basis. I hope that I fix this but I just have so little perspective on it all.
I know that there are choices in life and I know that it's up to me to make them but being governed by the very knowledge that I am overweight, which I truly am - I really cannot accept these BMI, weight vs height ratios as being right - whilst I am 5ft 8ins/7st 7lb - this is too high a weight for my frame, rather than my height - choice isn't really something I can look at until my weight is acceptably lower.
Apologies for rambling - thank you again for what you have written. So much of what you have said makes sense and means so much.

Oh Ludwig, I do feel for you. But keep reading my last post - you can beat this. And you can do it.

I can only speak from my own experience and frankly, so please don't take anything I say to heart, or think that I'm being a tad blunt. But, there is not one human being in this world who could have your bmi, your height and your weight and be the unusual one for whom these dimensions don't apply and are, actually, overweight. Stand back and think about this for a moment. You are drastically underweight and this is an objective truth. Of course I know you don't think this, this is the insidious and cunning form that anorexia takes. So, I'm not belittling what, to you, feels very real. But it isn't real. And that's a hard one to get your head round. But trust me, I'm 100% right.

Indeed, the numerical aspects of your weight are, ironically, largely immaterial. This is about how you feel about yourself and your body. There is no weight that you could reach that would make you feel happy for more than about half an hour. Even though I'm sure you have goals that feel like it would all be ok, if only you were x weight...it wouldn't be so. You would invariably want to lose just a pound or two more, just to be safe. I haven't weighed myself for 6 years and have little interest in what the scales say. One day you will be able to throw them out. I smashed mine up actually.

Unfortunately for you (but fortunately really!), recovery from anorexia is wholly incompatible with weight loss. I always thought, well, if I could get to x weight, then I can start to think about getting better, because if I gain a pound or two in'recovery' it will be ok. Whilst this feels safe, it is untrue. The less you weigh, the more firmly anorexia will have you in it's grip. When your eating becomes more regulated and you are getting the key nutrients you need, you are able to think more rationally about the disease. This is tough. But it is true. So, hard as it sounds, losing a bit more weight is NOT and will never be the answer to getting a handle on things. it isn't about getting fatter, it is about getting weller. I almost hate writing this. I've walked in your shoes, I know the drill. And I wish i could wrap everything I know up in a pill, get you to swallow it and see things from a happier perspective. But this is a journey you need to take yourself through.

Saddest of all, is that a truly 'good' anorexic, who doesn't give in to 'weakness' - well, I needn't even tell the end to that story.

Ludwig, I don't speak of my ed very often. It was a dark time but it taught me a lot about myself and about life. But, I felt the urge to write to you, put my hand out and say ' hey - it doesn't need to be like this, you are ill whether you feel it or not'. And I want to be of help for you but worry that this might all be a bit brutal. I'm not a counsellor or anything.

Practically, it helped me to lay out with my dietician, some 'safe' foods that I could turn to when I was in a real tizz and nothing was right. Body image work was also highly important to me, even though I resisted it for ages. Relaxation tapes are also invaluable to me, and you might find this helpful, when you are ready. Stin Hansen has been a lifesaver (google). Yoga has also been of great solace.

Be kind to yourself. You aren't overweight, but you are poorly. I found channelling my worry into the being poorly part, was ultimately the key.

Love to you.

Oh thank you whereismywine - it is exactly what I think - if I could get my weight down to 7st I know that I will be willing to look at getting better and yet as I write this I know it doesn't make much logical sense, it's just the overwhelming feeling that I have of being able to approach the recovery - kind of getting worse before getting better syndrome. My counsellor has also said that because of the starvation it's not possible for me to think about this in the right way so I can see that it's a bit of a vicious circle. I'm just so scared - I've been out for a long walk this morning with the family and all I could see and think about were my enormous legs... I look so very overweight.

I guess it's all the talking about it and tackling the issue of trying to even think about not being fat and having to eat that's making me feel worse - I was warned of that, but it's almost like getting up on a horse to ride a race and then realising that I can't actually ride a horse and that infact I'm terrified of them.
What a mess - between the proverbial rock and a hard place.

I am truly honoured that you have shared your experience with me and yes, if you ever invent a pill to take let me know! I know it's the journey I have to take in the long term that counts and that one day I might not want to weigh myself every day or make myself sick.

I also do yoga which is helpful but I'll look up those relaxation tapes, thank you for that.

Thank you again - I really appreciate this.

An update. I had an appointment with my GP recently who advised me that I should consider medication in relation to my eating disorder. Now, my counsellor does not feel that this is necessary as I'm not really depressed. But, from how I feel at the moment I am quite tempted by the idea of it - as I feel that I am kind of mentally stuck. It was actually really useful to talk to the GP because it gave a different view point, but unfortunately it made me realise that I have become too dependent upon both the counselling and my counsellor and that I'm not really addressing the issue that I still so desperately want to lose weight. My counsellor is wonderful and I fear that I am looking for some kind of attention from her that I did not get from mother as a child.

So, now I feel in a way that I have wasted so much of my counsellor's time because I don't really want to get my head around eating. I don't want to eat - I want to lose weight and that can only be achieved by not eating. I am so ashamed of myself and do not deserve to have the gift of life, let alone a wonderful husband and family. What kind of person am I that I only care about the weight I want and need to use?

I feel that if I go back to the GP to discuss the idea of medication further I am deceiving my counsellor. So, I was thinking that in my next session with her that I should say all of this to her. Does this make sense? I feel as though I am slowly going mad and that I need to do something drastic in order to make a change.

Hello Ludwig.

I just noticed your thread today and really wanted to just send my thoughts to you, as another person who struggled for nearly a decade with bulimia from my university years to mid mid to late twenties. I do now consider myself recovered after some o/p treatment and a whole lot of work on myself. I'm in my mid thirties now and it's been a long journey but I do believe it is possible for all of us and I wanted to share in case it gave you some hope.

I feel your struggle about just not wanting to eat simply because your goal is to lose weight and that seems the most important thing to you. I wanted to be thin or look a certain way too and I was so scared that when that was taken away from me, there'd be nothing left or I might not like the person I found. The big challenge of my ED recovery was having to let go of my coping mechanism (for me b/p-ing and for you, not eating) and having to cope with life without that to help me - a huge chalenge when you're moving through counselling and having to face up to the reality and all the shame that goes with it but in the end, I decided that I felt those feelings anyway no matter how hard I tried to stuff down the self criticism and self loathing so I may as well feel it properly and see if by working through them, they might go rather than remaining semi-controlled in my mind and my body by using a control mechanism to stop myself really feeling. I would just ask you to think about who is speaking when you say you want to be thin more than be well for your family or yourself? Is that really you speaking or is that the voice and fear of your eating disorder trying to cling on to the hold it has on you? You have asked for help - deep down you truly want to be well. You must remember that.

I feel I'm rambling. I just wanted to offer some support. I may sound like a walking cliche here but have you tried any yoga/meditation? I started practicing yoga whilst in recovery - mainly ashtanga to get rid of weight - but it took me by surprise how it made me feel about my body. With time, I slowed down my yoga and found it seemed to physically dissipate the tension in my body and help me view myself more positively and gae me mental strength for the fight and a new perception of my body as something that could do surprising things and not just something to be controlled. You can probably tell from my name that it is something I feel helped save me in many ways and i practice yoga and meditation every day now to stop the whirring voices. Understanding why I had my ED was important to me but it was the practical things like yoga and caring for myself that gave me the tools to beat the voice tellling me my ED was more important than my career, realtionships, finances health and life - all things I was on the verge of losing. Meditation helped me spot when I was speaking and when it was my ed in the early years and the more I recognised the ED, the more I could choose to ignore it.

Not for everyone and I'm not suggesting it's an alternative for therapy or medications by any means - I just wanted to ask how you were caring for yourself or doing nice things ot be kind to yourself to provide a balance of self-love as you move through challenges such as eating scary foods/increasing food. This side of things is very important too but I'm sure you know this. Please don't get lost in just counselling and family life without really taking care of yourself right now.

Sorry I can't help with the medication question but thinking of you. Please take time to do something nice for yourself every day, even in just a small way, even if you don't feel you deserve it because you do.

Thank you very, very much for replying ITryToBeZenBut - your post is much appreciated and really helpful. I am desperate for feedback and advice at the moment. I particularly picked up on the parts of your post that mentions using a control mechanism to prevent oneself from feeling. Letting go of the coping mechanism for me at the moment is just not on, it's not something I can do. I don't even feel that I am doing the eating disorder thing right - I'm not even that thin. I feel as though I need to make it a lot worse before I can have any sense of perspective. So, I guess that's the crux of it - I'm not able to try and help myself - makes me feel really pathetic.

I do understand the difference between the illness speaking to me and myself speaking to me. My counsellor is keen for me to try and connect with myself a bit more, so I have been trying dancing and I do yoga every day, twice a day. However, the meditation sounds good - I might give it a go - would count as the one thing for myself to do each day. Only problem is that I really, really hate myself for what I'm being like with my family at the moment - they really don't deserve it.

Thanks so much again for your advice and for taking the time to write.

I understand you totally about letting go Ludwig. Maybe it needs the right time and motivation. I tried therapy twice before I had success. The second time I just felt that my life was on the verge of going very badly wrong but at that time i'd also been reading a lot about what the ED could do to me and maybe I was just so frightened of dying that I was motivated to try the things I'd not been able to before. I also only had myself to deal with (time and space to be in whatever mood I neded to be in). I'm sure letting go when you havea family is very different. Maybe that is holding you back to some extent? You have a role to fulfil and what would it mean to let go. You already feel bad enough as it is and maybe on some level are worried about how it might be for them if you did let go. Have you been able to talk to anyone in a similar position, with a family?

Even at my most destructive, and I was pretty destructive, I convinced myself that it wasn't that bad or wondered why I was in a room with other people who seemed more ill than me. I'm sure you are thinner than you think and I'm also sure you're damaging yourself in other ways. It's the worst thing being scared to go forwards but not able to reverese from where you are. It's not pathetic.

Well done on the yoga. I really found the meditation bit key - just shifted everything so my practice became a moving meditation. There are lots of different types of techniques to try (the dummy's guide is a good place to start or maybe try a beginner course or workshop). A course is good as the traditional buddhist techniques like vipassana/mindfulness meditation are really hard for anyone to ebgin with as you are learning to just sit with yourself with no mantra or focal point like counting etc to help keep you concentrated and I think if you're feeling bad about yourself might be hard for you to just sit! When it becomes an established practice, the only way I can describe it would be to compare it to a situation where you could see your thoughts scrolling down a computer screen and so you can see the ones that come up time and time again. And you learn to recognise your patterns and choose not to interact with them. And it was helpful for me to realise everyone has thoughts of these type - albeit of different natures and extremes.

take care.

ps Have a look at yogaglo (I'm not advertising for them - honest!). It's a us website with online yoga and meditation classes - i think you can get a free trial. They have lovely meditation classes from 10 mins to 45 mins and a beginners course online so all you need is a quiet few minutes and a laptop and you can settle down and be guided which is a great place to start.

Update again. I have now been in counselling for 6 months. I have made considerable progress in being able to open up to her and to acknowledge a lot of things that have contributed towards having an eating disorder. I have been able to discuss this with my husband with mostly a successful outcome and I am able to understand how and why I have got to the situation I am in now. I have also expressed my emotional attachment to my counsellor which I had been concerned about but she assures me that this is OK. At the moment I cannot imagine a world without her.

I still have problems with eating - serious issues really. Most days I am making myself bring up anything I have eaten but my weight isn't any different in the last 3 months which is disappointing, I had hoped to have lost weight by the end of this year.

I think this is going to be a long process, partly because I'm making it so, but I really hope this is going to work out. I just can't see how it can - I just seem so stuck. But, having all this help and encouragement on line is great. Thank you. Here's hoping that 2012 will be my recovery year...