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Find tips and tricks to make your garden or allotment flourish on our Gardening forum.

Allotment/Veg Patch Thread 6 - Weed 'em and Reap!

997 replies

bookbook · 04/06/2016 22:20

Thanks WhoKnowsWhereThe Time GOes for the title of the new thread.
So, we head into summer, praying for sun, gentle rain and no slugs
Everyone welcome to join in and share joys and woes and advice, given freely!
Previous thread here
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/gardening/2582241-Allotment-Veg-Patch-Thread-5-The-Diggers-Rest?pg=1

OP posts:
Thread gallery
83
bookbook · 28/08/2016 21:28

sorry, that was very garbled .....

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Cathpot · 28/08/2016 22:36

Hello- good to hear about everyone's abundant harvests. I cut out the old canes from summer raspberries and secretly snaffled the few I found without giving them to the children. Made a paneer, spring onion and chard curry tonight and it was lovely and I ate far too much of it. My rocket is a mass of flowers- I should just pull it as it keeps self seeding all between the patio slabs but it's so busy with bees I can't do it. Half an acre of veg garden sounds amazing - I would have a large walk in fruit cage and a mini orchard and raised beds and and and and.... Completely agree with plant what you will eat. Look up companion planting- lots of interesting things about which plants to put together and which to keep separate. Think about an irrigation system maybe- one of those flat hoses you put in under the soil- I don't water my raised bed enough and things tend to bolt. Also my raised bed is very wide and because I belatedly put wires across the back of it for peas etc, I now have access issues- so don't do that. Try and get things like water butts and greenhouses second hand. I'm jealous! I'm trying to squeeze my edibles inbetween everything else.

bookbook · 29/08/2016 13:42

Afternoon!
A lovely day here now, after a misty and rather cool morning.
I have had a couple of hours down at the plot weeding, and picking raspberries.
While there I mused on the half acre plot of wearegoing. Actually it's huge. A rough idea - my full allotment plot is about 1/8th of an acre. And that has sheds, water butts etc, and quite a lot of undeveloped space.
So I think I would advise to take it slowly and in a small way at first. In fact Cathpot 's suggestion of an orchard and a fruit cage sounds like a possible plan long term for at least a portion of it. ( I have always wanted an orchard, with free range chickens !) I think I would carve out a few beds to get going , and then add to them as you see how the workload impinges on everyday life. You don't have to do raised beds a such , but maybe raised heaps or dug over areas of about 4' by 4' with walk ways that can be mown between. That way you can concentrate on feeding and weeding where absolutely necessary. Otherwise it will be like painting the forth bridge to keep on top of things.

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Belleende · 29/08/2016 18:50

Lovely to see all the crops. Book your stuff looks like a picture. Had a fab day today. The courgettes that I nearly dug up after the slugs decimated them have sprung back to life. I had a lovely ripe pumpkin, but best of all some absolutely perfect tomatoes. I was given a few plants by a lady in the allotment and a few I grew at home. 5 different varieties and they are all so so tasty. Have also lifted the first leeks.
The broccoli I planted in June is looking really healthy and has outgrown its tunnel thing. Need to build a bigger cage.

But the bind weed is running amok and nettles have returned to places I dug them up from. Also need to cut back the raspberries but don't know where to source enough mulch to put down to weed suppress. Don't want to spend a fortune!

WhoKnowsWhereTheTimeG0es · 29/08/2016 22:21

Evening all,

Been away for ten days and back to the plot today. Do you remember my mysterious "round green cucumber"? It turned orange while I was away, so that's Hallowe'en sorted Blush. My "butternut squash" has hatched a pumpkin too, I obviously got all my similar looking seedlings muddled up at some point Grin.

Apart from that I have loads of climbing beans, loads of courgettes and loads of sweet peas (I nipped every bud and flower off before going away to keep them flowering). Also loads of bindweed, but the other weeds weren't too bad, I did a big hoeing session before leaving which has really helped I think. I'm going up to bed with my bullet journal in a minute to create an autumn allotmenting plan, which I think will include getting some dwarf apple and pear trees and a patch of bulbs and wildflowers.

Welcome to the new allotmenteers. Inkypinky - I'm in the SE (Hants/Surrey borders) and on clay soil too. I've had my plot about three years (in fact almost exactly three years as FB reminded me the other day) and am gradually improving the clay with compost and other organic matter.

Wearegoingtobedlehem · 30/08/2016 07:33

Bookbook thanks for your reply.

The patch was grazed by pigs last year so it was effectively cultivated and fertilised by them. We then ploughed it and rotivated it twice to get it level and loose. However a very busy summer of work and it has all just turned into a weed patch.

I like the idea of orchards and growing fruit - but we have a lot of deer and indeed other "pests" being rural - so stuff can easily get nobbled Sad
It may be something for the future but I need to be able to put quite a lot of money to a sturdy fruit cage really.

I think veg is the way forwards at the moment - I do have a small poly tunnel that I need to put up that I wanted to use for strawberries and some salad. I also have a greenhouse for the tomatoes and cucumbers.

Any thoughts on any thing I can do going into winter would be helpful Smile

bookbook · 30/08/2016 21:41

Evening
Nice to hear all is well at the plot WhoKnows - and how organised are you with a journal!
I wasn't due to go down to the plot today, but I ended up going in the late afternoon ( just for a quiet few minutes) so managed to hoe amongst the leeks and weed the asparagus bed, and picked raspberries.
wearegoing it would be wise to try and 'deer proof' I suspect. I hear from gardening programmes that they are pretty destructive- and add in rabbits..... Whereabouts are you? North or South? For now, I think you may just have time to sow spring greens, and possibly some chard/perpetual spinach. Lettuce/salad leaves and rocket should be fine. Garlic is planted October /November. You can also overwinter shallots and broad beans - though you can do these in spring as well.Strawberries are absolutely fine outside - they don't need to be in a polytunnel. Have a look around to see if anyone is selling veg plug plants as well - there is just about time for cauliflowers to be planted out if you can find some, along with kale and cavolo nero .

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shovetheholly · 31/08/2016 08:06

Wow, half an acre!! That is GIGANTIC. You're verging on proper smallholding territory there, rather than allotment-sized. Bear in mind that a full-sized allotment is 10 rods, which is 250 square metres. This was considered enough to keep a family of 4 in veg for a reasonable part of the year, but more and more councils are finding that most people don't have the time for it, so they've cut plots in half to make them more manageable - so 125 square metres. Half an acre, if I've got my sums right, is about 2000 square metres. That is like having 8 full-sized allotments or 16 half plots. It's HUGE!

I think a major, major thing here is going to be firstly, how you put up a barrier to keep pests like deer out (hedging? fencing?) and secondly how you make it manageable so you don't break yourself in two with the work involved if you also have a day job to hold down.

Fruit is wonderful because it's easy, and apart from annual pruning, trees do tend to look after themselves. To be honest, in a few years you could have an orchard big enough to allow a good deal of nobbling and you would barely notice it because you'll be inundated with stuff anyway that you'll be glad to get rid of some! Grin It's also sometimes something that can be done in a partially shaded part of the plot. Raspberries, gooseberries, currants are all really easy too - you probably will want a cage for these to stop the birds getting to them!

Give a good think to infrastructure as well: for a plot that size, you will want huge compost heaps like Monty Don's, where you can just turn one into another. Leaf mould stacks, places to put tonnes (literally) of manure that you will need to get delivered in a trailer, that kind of thing. Water for putting things in is going to be an issue - perhaps a huge water butt? Thinking about where you locate all these to make your life easy will make a load of difference.

Cost-wise, reusing whatever you can makes a huge difference. I built a fruit cage out of some poles I found in a skip and some cheap netting. You can use any old wood to make raised beds - most of mine were built using the old fascia boards from my house! I'm just doing a small plot, but when you're trying to plant at scale, even cheap materials can start to get expensive.

Agree with book that the battle when you're starting any plot, even a small one, is psychological. It can be easy to fly into things and plant up huge areas that aren't sustainable to keep weeded through the season especially when you need to balance clearing ground with tending ground. If you go slowly and steadily, it's less stressful, and you get to the same place without the heartache! Smile

teacuphalfempty · 31/08/2016 16:26

Hello All !

Sorry I haven´t been here for a bit - things have been sent to try me. Will post properly after I've caught up.

Meanwhile - 13 butternut squash, there may be more Grin

I'll be back ...

IpanemaChica · 31/08/2016 16:53

Hello, I'm the same as teacup - haven't been here for a whileBlush. I shall try to catch up especially as I've been offered a plot, although at a different site from where I put my name down, it's 4 miles away - too far? Anyway I shall read back 10 pages or just look at the lovely vegetable pictures

shovetheholly · 31/08/2016 17:18

I hope you're OK teacup, whatever it is. I really, really hope things ease off soon and that you have some (green) room to breathe. 13 butternut squash is amazing! I am Envy

ipanema - Hmmm, how hard is the journey and do you have a car for those times when you're lugging heavy crops back or heavy tools to and fro? I think I might be tempted to hold out for something closer - it really does make it easier if it's in walking distance. My plot is just a bit too far (1.3 miles away) and I sort of wish sometimes I'd held out for one in the site that is literally up the road. But I say that as someone who already has a plot and who was too impatient to wait, and it's not really THAT bad!! Grin

WhoKnowsWhereTheTimeG0es · 31/08/2016 17:33

Ipanema, I think distance also needs to factor in such things as when you are likely to garden, if you are able to spend hours at a time at the site then it doesn't matter if it's further away. If OTOH you are like me and trying to slot it in amongst numerous other commitments (DCs, school runs, part time work) then it's more important to be close. Mine is about 1/2 a mile, 10 mins walk and I frequently pop in on the way back from other places but rarely manage more than a couple of hours in one go.

bookbook · 31/08/2016 18:59

Evening!
Ipanema* my plot is about a mile away , so I try to make it worth my while to go. So I usually try to factor in 2 hours at a time, otherwise my time is all about getting there and back. But only you can know if its do-able .There is often a lot of lugging back and forth.
teacup -hope all is well. I I second the Envy on the butternuts - I haven't a one ( and what rubs salt in the wound - a plotter at the end just bunged some plants on top of a weed heap covered in membrane, and has barely looked at them - guess what.... butternuts)

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Cathpot · 01/09/2016 00:07

Hello. Just put my work down and got into bed. Slightly head exploding with new job after two very sedate years pootling about just looking after the kids and doing a bit of tutoring. Quite worried I will never get out into the garden again. I did manage to rope DD1 into putting in more leeks as the last ones she did survived which she was quite chuffed about. Now I just need to get her to try to eat some... How do I know when they are ready by the way- at the moment they are bamboo cane thick so too small but will they get as big as supermarket ones?

I finally pulled the rocket that had gone to seed- between that and the garlic chives flowering it was a comedy sea of bees, I can't believe I was worried earlier in the year that they had gone. I like bees but even I moved to have a cup of tea a few metres away. Anyone got any recipes that involves huge amounts of garlic chives? I've got tomatoes finally but they are very green and the plants look like they are giving up already. I've fed them but the leaves are curling up and yellow. Any thoughts?

Photo is of what I may have to start calling my garlic chive 'situation'

Allotment/Veg Patch Thread 6 -  Weed 'em and Reap!
shovetheholly · 01/09/2016 07:18

cathpot - so many congratulations on your new job!! And empathy with the level of tiredness. I'm sure that looking after the kids is actually more exhausting (judging by my experience of childcare, it is approximately 4 times more exhausting than the hardest job), but the first day in a new place is just so enormously stressful, with so much flying at you!

I think you garlic chives look absolutely stunning. They'd not be out of place in the poshest of herbaceous borders. Do they smell strongly, or could you get away with growing them as flowers?

book gets amazing leeks -hers are as big as the supermarket ones. I have only managed more slender ones to date, but I'm hopeful about this year's lot. Fingers crossed.

Cedar03 · 01/09/2016 08:10

I am back from my holiday and have caught up with this thread.
Wearegoing - that's a big plot. You'll have space to try loads of different things but as others have said do it in stages. Things that take up quite a bit of space with minimal effort include potatoes (these are brilliant for helping to break up ground too) and courgettes, pumpkins, squashes. Definitely look out for plug plants for winter crops such as cabbages and depending on where you are you can still sow things like chard.

Shove pleased you've found time to get back to the plot and hope everyone is feeling better.

Cathpot my leeks haven't grown anywhere near as big as those in the shops yet. You can eat them when they are small too. We eat them with fish which is good. My daughter won't eat them though so I often hide them in soup. Congratulations on your new job.

Ipanema being closer to the plot does make it more convenient. And it does depend on your time. My parents' plot neighbour lives about 10 miles away from their plot but they come and spend most of a day at a time there. You'd have to think about parking near it - is this easily available otherwise it will be really awkward for getting things up there.

Our plot survived our holiday. We managed some sweet corn (harvested before the mice got the lot) and there were loads of blackberries. And weeds.
I also garden in the south on clay soil. It's not too bad, if you manage to catch the two days a year when it's not too soggy or too hard to dig Smile

bookbook · 01/09/2016 12:55

Morning ! ( well - pre lunch :))
Cathpot - teaching? its totally tiring, especially when you have had a break
Leeks - ready dependant a bit on variety. I tend to grow 2 - always Blue Solaise which is my favourite, and that harvests from November right through to end of winter. This year my earlier variety should start cropping soon - September through to Christmas. But I have already had some go to seed, so have dug those couple today for soup ( its on the photo I will pop on). I think leeks are like a lot of vegetables which basically grow under the soil. Its much easier for me as I am on free draining, stony soil, rather than clay as they have an easier time expanding. I don't do anything but dibb a hole about 6" deep, pop in the leek seedling and fill the hole with water, and leave them to get on with it. I suspect going to seed is due to the dry spell we have had. I use them a lot in soup and stir fries, but another favourite is a Delia Smith one from her original cookbook which is eggs and leeks au gratin. I can't find it online, but if you want I can write it out for you. Its delicious with a baked potato. Garlic chives are used a lot in stir fries, but I think I would do a soup - (but I do make a lot of soup). But with shallots and probably potatoes to thicken it would be lovely.
Cedar - hope you had a good holiday - and we all come back to weeds!
I got hi jacked at the plot this morning, talking about ground elder and how to agree to tackle it together with my end of plot lady. So I didn't get quite as much done as I would wish. But, I did my hours digging over, and most of the picking. And my other NDN gave me a bunch of beetroot ( I didn't say no, even though I have plenty. He is a shy older man, and has barely spoken before apart from Morning and a small thing about the current weather, so I feel like its a breakthrough). So pics - one of leeks, showing size so far - they were planted in April/May and then my picking today. including leeks going to seed. Spot the mistake in the courgettes Grin

Allotment/Veg Patch Thread 6 -  Weed 'em and Reap!
Allotment/Veg Patch Thread 6 -  Weed 'em and Reap!
OP posts:
Cathpot · 01/09/2016 21:52

thank you- I am very chuffed to get back to work if a little bit fraught at the moment.

shove the holly the garlic chives don't smell unless you crush the leaves and they are completely low stress - I do nothing with them but dead head as they go to seed. I like the idea of soup- I used to do a fish and potato one I could resurrect as DH loves it and he flies home for some leave tomorrow. This is quite a full on week.
bookbook I like the thought of you bonding with next door over a beetroot! Your harvest looks great.

WhoKnowsWhereTheTimeG0es · 01/09/2016 22:49

Congratulations on the job Cathpot, not surprised you are tired/fraught. I love garlic chives, but that is an awful lot of them. Not quite the same, but I bought a tiny tub of garlic chive sprouts in Asda a couple of weeks ago and they tasted amazing in cheese sandwiches.

My leeks are still only bamboo cane thickness too, in fact it's not long since I planted them out. This is my first time growing them and I didn't manage to get the holes 6' deep as the soil kept collapsing in on the holes (when I tried watering it first it just turned into clayey sludge that was also hard to get a proper hole in). So, I have been saving loo roll middles and think I am going to follow a tip I read somewhere, slitting them, wrapping them round the leek and back filling with compost, before they get too much bigger. Cheese sandwiches are also one of my favourite things to do with leeks, thin slivers either in a normal or toasted cheese sandwich taste great, like really mild onion.

TheSpottedZebra · 01/09/2016 23:01

Hello hello! It seems there are a few of use for whom life has got in the way of veg plotting...

Erm - what to report? I've been at glut levels of courgettes forma while now, but they are tailing off fast. And my tomatoes are plentiful too - but I think they feel like more as I have less time to cook and process them then I'd like. My purple beans have been prolific - odd as IIRC, on Gardener's World, they'd totally failed with that variety (Cosse Violette aka purple podded) in the 2 RHS gardens trialled. Basil has been good too.

But my leeks are appalling. In fact they are not even as fat as a chive. They're still alive, just in stasis.
I think I'll dig them over soon, as the nice person who gave me all the fruit last year, has given me 1st refusal of fruit bushes he wants to pull out. I think he said 2 blackcurrant, 1 red and a gooseberry. Of course I said yes please.

But they're massive. Hip height. I shall need to figure out how on earth to get them in - they'll need jolly big holes which will be awful to dig on my hard baked clay.

Cathpot · 01/09/2016 23:09

YOU CAN EAT RAW LEEKS?? That has made my week.

bookbook · 02/09/2016 08:11

Morning!
Life does get in the way of veg plotting.
Yes Spotted - my purple bens have ganged up on me , and the cobra green ones. I saw the Gardeners World too and was a bit surprised , and slightly smug! My tomatoes are doing okay - the Roma ones are just about ready to start picking for cooking, but at that stage where 2 or 3 are really ripe, but the rest are still a few days away.
I wonder if the leeks thing is due to your clay soils WhoKnows and Spotted -
Cathpot - Grin - there are very few veg which I won't eat raw tbh. Maybe broccoli and swede........ But I do tend to cook them!

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shovetheholly · 02/09/2016 08:13

spotted- YAY you are here! Grin It is so good to hear about your crops - I'm glad things have come good! I am very jealous of all the purple beans on this thread - mine are boring and green and the purple ones are so lovely looking.

I am jealous of you all having these relationships with your plot neighbours. I never see mine! There's hardly anyone there when I go up STILL! I think I must do it at very different times of day to other people. The only time I did speak one neighbour he told me about how he was an alcoholic who threw his dog across the room in a rage, and I have been avoiding him ever since. Sad

Amusingly, another neighbour further down is an ex-MA student of DH's who always looks totally shocked to see DH in dirt and scruffs, and slightly worried that he might ask him where his homework is. He seems like a lovely kid, though, and it's nice to have some youngsters on the plot. (I am going to be 39 in November, so I am donning the mantle of middle age and starting to use words like 'youngsters') Grin

Cedar03 · 02/09/2016 08:29

Shove I don't see many of my plot neighbours in spite of going over there at various times during the week and at weekends. The person who has the one at the bottom of mine did a lot of work in the winter but seems to have lost interest. They did come and look at it the other day but they didn't actually get around to planting anything this year at all. So inevitably the weeds are taking over the areas that were cleared.

My leeks aren't very big but my neighbour's ones are. They seem to have really taken off in the last few weeks. I think he just got his planted out a lot sooner than I did (I had to direct sow some of mine and that took two sowings to get a crop). My variety are supposed to be really big but unless the warm weather holds I'm not sure they'll make the growth.

We have quite a good tomato crop on the way which so far hasn't got blighted. The trick seems to be plant direct in the ground and pretty much ignore them all summer Smile

shovetheholly · 02/09/2016 12:54

cedar - I'm glad it's not just me that has apparently ghostly allotment neighbours!

Our site is really odd, because there are two halves with a road down the middle. Each is separately fenced and gated so each feels like a different community - I would feel a bit strange wandering over to the 'other side' because I'd have to unlock a gate and it would feel a bit like I wasn't supposed to be there! We are into the third year of our side now (just) and there are still loads of plots that haven't really ever been properly cultivated because people do it for 10 minutes then stop. The weeds are bigger than me! The other side has been occupied for just a year or so, but the people who are doing it seem way more committed - the drop out rate is a fraction of what it is on our side. I can't work out why this would be. Maybe it's just luck, but it's quite marked.

I think what might have happened is that they invited people on our side from other allotment waiting lists who perhaps really wanted a plot elsewhere, whereas people on the other side actively signed up for this one. They're not very good at monitoring how well used plots are (too many cuts I think) so once they're uncultivated they stay that way for the best part of a year.

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