T level v BTEC. Worried DC is making the wrong choice.

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In the process of choosing 6th forms. DC is not particularly academic. Predicted 6-4s in GCSE. They are doing enterprise (business) BTec now and are predicted starred distinction. It’s their strongest because of both enjoying the subject and the way the course is planned / assessed. Their English and maths teachers have said they could get 7s in those subjects too but are not strong at exams.

They don’t want to do A levels, so instead have been looking at BTECS, most likely in business. I think it’s a great choice. We’re in London so we have the luxury of having lots of choices of 6th forms / colleges too.

A lot of their friends (though not all) are likely to go to one particular very popular 6th form. It’s huge, it’s not local (though easy to commute to). It’s a very good school, good facilities etc. So my DC also has that as their first choir right now.

But, if they do go there, they’d need to do a T Level (business and administration) rather than a BTEC as they don’t do the extended diploma there. DC said that’s fine, but I don’t think they’ve really considered the difference and what’s expected for a T Level. My understanding is it has the work experience element, which is great. But the academic side is more akin to A levels, with more meaty exams rather than continuous assessment and more but shorter exams over the two years.

My concern is that the T Level doesn’t play to their strengths. Watching them revise for their GSCEs has been quite painful, to be frank!

Can anyone advise if I’m being concerned over nothing or if I should try to steer them in the other direction? They’ve got great alternative options, but the draw of going where friends go is strong!

Encourage them to research plenty of other options, go to open evening/open days so your DC can get a feel for the different places and what they offer, and if they are any good at their jobs, they will sell their courses to your DC.
Also is there a head of year or similar that you would trust to talk over options with your DC ? I know it's difficult, teens think they know everything and parents know nothing 😁

We’ve been to the open days, done all of the applications and have got all the conditional offers. Annoyingly DH went to this particular college with DC and just kind of left them to it when they got there so I’ve been given very little info on the offer discussions re subjects, type of course etc.

From a quick google it says that there’s exams and then an employer set project and practical assessment, so it’s not all exams.

Given the job market I would grab any chance at practical placements with both hands. IMO DC would be daft to not take this opportunity because they might not be great at exams.

An ok grade with experience is worth more than distinctions with none.

I think the industry experience element is great, absolutely. My Google brought up the T Levels are good for those who have a good idea of what they want to do next. My DC has no clue at all!

Ive also just read a thread on here about someone possibly changing from A levels to a T Level or BTEC because they were finding A levels too hard. One of the replies says that T levels are as challenging so if a levels weren’t for them, neither would a t level be. This is my concern.

I teach T-Level Business, and used to teach BTEC (and have taught GCSE and A level Business too.
The exams are indeed meatier (great term, might pinch it!), and they enter exam windows which consist of 1.5-2 hour exams for us - each centre arranges these differently.
They have to complete 315 hours work placement over the 2 years. Essentially it’s promoted as a reverse apprenticeship (80/20 theory/placement)
We tend to find that that a student with 4s or above (preferably 5s) in English and maths can cope with the T, but only if they want to. It is certainly more academically rigourous than the BTec.
Please do give me a shout with any specific or other questions and I’ll try to help.

One issue is that T levels are very new and as such not really tested. I know a lot of YP and I only know one person who is doing a T level.

I have heard tales of industry placements not being as well thought-out as they should be. I would probe that well with the college – what has the previous experience been, what sort of grades have students gained, from what sort of GCSEs. T levels have been around since 2020 but more subjects have been introduced between then and 2024 – so how many past students have done this one? How did they do?

ETA x posted with helpful comments from @BackToTheFuture9

Thank you, this is so helpful and i am very likely to DM you at some point!

DC is bright, but just doesn’t enjoy the academic side of things. They’re very honest about not really being that bothered or interested in school. But, they are revising now and want to do well. I (and they) expect 6s in maths and English annd they’d be disappointed with themselves if they didn’t achieve that. Ultimately exams aren’t their thing. And that’s fine.

My son has been looking at BTECs and T-levels too. Certainly the advanced BTEC he has applied for requires higher entry grades than the T-levels. It’s very confusing though isn’t it? especially with the plans to discontinue BTECs. At the moment he is quite undecided.

That’s interesting as it’s the other way around here. BTEC extended diploma requires 4/5 GCSEs grade 4. TLevel is 5 GCSEs grade 4 or 5. TLevel has the higher offer. Both are equivalent to 3 A levels.

Is it a north London sixth form beginning with W by any chance? If it’s the one I am thinking of, then it’s known for being academically tough and my DD has friends there struggling in Y12 who got 7s and 8s at GCSE. So I would worry it would put pressure on T Level students in the same way.

If it’s not, I would want to check the sixth form’s track record with T Level results so far and find out how they treat the practical side of the syllabus. It shouldn’t be treated like an afterthought but as an important component.

No it’s not that one! Do they do T levels? We know a lots of DC’s who’ve applied and most have been wait listed. Way to academic for my DC to consider.
The T level they’re looking at will be new this year, which could also be a concern. I’ll see if I can find info on the results from the other T levels that have been running for a while.

I would be concerned too that it’s their first year of offering that subject. I’d be asking whether the course leader and tutors have experience of delivering T Levels and who is going to be the work experience coordinator. It’s really tough arranging WE at the moment, as graduates are applying for places Y12s and 13s would normally try for as a way of getting a foot on job ladder. So the WE coordinator needs to be really on it.

Have you looked at Capital City College?

These are questions I would ask if I were looking at the T-Level Business as a possible course:

1. what were your achievement rates for last year?
2. what is your policy on re-sits for exams? How do you split the exams up? (Best practice is some first year some second year, but some places try to do them all together for logistical reasons)
3. what support is in place to find work placements? How do these look? (Evidence shows day release model most successful, but some places choose block release, because again, logistics)
4. can you give some examples of employers you work with? (Shows if they have good industry connections)

Hope this helps

Ah yes if it’s the first year it’s run that’s worth probing further as I and others have said. It’s not the business one taught by @BackToTheFuture9 then?

Yy ask in detail about the work placement aspect.

Good point - I assumed OP meant new to them, not brand new!

Personal experience here:

DD did a L2 in her chose subject as the first year at college and loved it. She smashed it with a D*. She then went onto the T level and hates it with a passion. The core business elements are dull as ditchwater. You have to find your own work placement and for so many hours without getting the apprenticeship support for the business that is hard.

T levels have been slated by businesses and unis as neither giving the academic rigour of A levels, nor the practical skills depth of an apprenticeship or the L3 BTecs. Most BTecs are now only for 19+ to force kids down T level route, but T levels have a substantially higher drop out rate than any of their equivalents.

Short version - if you can still get. L3 BTec at 16/17 grab it!

This is so helpful. I’ll email the questions over and see what they come back with.
It’s the Business and Administration T level starting this year at the college. Is that the one you teach?

Can I also ask, how do they chose where a student goes for placement? My DC has no idea what they want to do after college. I worry that if they end up in a placement that doesn’t interest them, they won’t do very well.

They didn’t apply to Capital as they don’t do a level 3 extended diploma in business.

Oh gosh that doesn’t sound great. That’s the kind of thing I’m worried about. He’s much rather do the extended level 3. So annoying this particular place doesnt do it 🙁

We are at the point of making the choice she is going to stop the T level and take a year out to allow her to hit 19 and get onto the BTec. You only get one stab at a L3 funded and you need to smash a T level with a distinction for it to have any hope of being a uni entry option.

If your DS has no interest in uni then pick another course!

The placements for T Levels are very hit and miss. Where I work, we had some big name companies in the first couple of years and some students were even offered degree apprenticeships after their T Levels. But this has tailed off for a number of reasons. Some of the students weren’t cutting it so the companies became less keen. I also understand there is some issue around withdrawal of govt funding direct to the companies but not sure of the detail on this one. T Levels are great for some students but invariably draw the less academic and can be a mistake for many. My own children are approaching this age and for the one who is unlikely to do well at A Level, I would be steering them to a Btec rather than a T Level.

Ah, that's a shame, as it's a great college otherwise.

T levels do limit university options - not a reason no to select it but one to bear in mind.

Any more than a BTEC wouid?

I have an older DC who did the first year of T levels (though different subject) and one currently in his final year of one.
The t level has been a great choice for them both…the placement option has been brilliant for both, they did one day a week for best part of a year and then a 4 week block too.

Both my two enjoyed the mix of practical with some theory.

one is now at uni…though you wouldn’t get into a red brick with one. The other wants an apprenticeship and the practical side of things has helped him in interviews as he has some real world experience to talk about and relate too.

i would recommend.