Need to pick 3 from FM, Maths, Biology and Computer Science for A-level

[lalasmith10]

DS was supposed to study 4 subjects at a-level but had to make it 3 as he got 8 for one of his a-level subjects. He had to have 9 for all his A-level choices to be qualified to study 4.

Now he needs to rethink the combination of his A-level. His choices are;

1. FM, Maths and Biology
2. FM, Maths and Computer Science
3. Maths, Computer Science and Biology

He picked Option 2, but I feel it's quite narrow.

He could do Option 1 and coding as a non-a-level topic to make his a-level choices broader.

Or, he could keep Option 2 and then do a language A-level privately to make his choices more balanced. He is bilingual and I am a teacher so no problem with preparing for the A-level privately. He is also doing a music diploma this winter, so Option 2 plus a language as the 4th subject and a music diploma sound broad enough??

Currently, he says he wants to do maths at a good university. He is good at maths but I am not sure if he is good enough to do a math degree as I hear it's a place for a real maths genius. He got 9 for maths but 7 for FM for GCSE so he is very good at maths but not a genius.

I am also wondering if he can cope with FM a-level as his FM gcse was 7 not 8 or 9. Perhaps he should drop FM and do the rest of the three?

Any thoughts from knowledgeable people would be very much appreciated.

That's tough. Many schools allow FM as a 4th subject as it's often studied alongside Maths A level.
Some do Maths in Y12 and FM in Y13.
Some start FM but give it up in Y13.
It would be an advantage if he wanted to do a maths degree but not essential. Even Oxbridge don't insist on FM because not all schools offer it, but it would be helpful to have it
There is obviously overlap with computer science and physics if you do maths.
Might he want to do CS as a degree?
My DS did Maths, FM, Chem, and Physics and now teaches maths A level.

If he is dead set on a Maths degree I would agree with option 2 plus a language. However I would have a conversation with the school or college about being more flexible and allowing him to at least start FM in Y12 as a 4th.

Some unis won’t accept FM as a third.

Or they will but won’t consider it as good as if it’s a 4th and if he wants to study maths somewhere competitive this would be an issue.

If he otherwise got all 9s his school are ridiculous not to let him at least start FM as a 4th. And not do an EPQ and just focus on the A levels.

Ah just seen he got a 7 in FM
That might mean not pursuing at A level but in which case I see little point in doing a random language 4th if he’s applying for a maths degree. Focus on getting top grades in the main three

If the maths degree is none negotiable, he needs to do 1 or 2.
BUT they are both pretty narrow (although widened by his extra curricula stuff).

Random suggestion: would a different school or college let him do the original 4?

If he wants to do Maths at uni then fm is a must.

Fm is a lot harder at a level than gcse though.

Ds's school won't let them do FM as a 3rd, only a 4th. And why was shown by the fact that by the end of term 2, only 1 person was left in FM, the other 11 having left the course as they didn't like it or couldn't keep up.
Is biology, math, FM not an option? Its a bit broader and CS isn't needed even for CS

If he wants to do Maths at uni then fm is a must.
It isn't.
Look at university admissions criteria for maths. If a student hasn't done FM it is covered in the first year.

Fm is a lot harder at a level than gcse though
This worries me. He found math gcse easy. He also said FM isn't harder but just deeper so he feels he can handle it at a level. But then he got 7 at gcse. So I am not 100% convinced by his words...

Random suggestion: Would a different school or college let him do the original 4?
He applied to only one school so no other choices. It's a long story...

If having FM as the 3rd subject is not acceptable, he really should do the language to make FM the 4th subject. The school doesn't offer the language but we can arrange it privately. He is going to keep studying the language anyway as he wants to live there in future so it may be a good plan perhaps.

FM is not a must to do a degree in maths. My DS is just about to start a degree in maths and whilst he did do Further Maths as an A level it was by no means a requirement. The top universities for a maths degree this year had a minimum entry requirement of A*AA but those that would take a B grade in one subject would not take a B in Further Maths. Further Maths is by no means an easy subject to do and in hindsight taking an easier subject would have lessened the pressure.

No it really isn't. Yes, "some" unis insist on FM at A level for their Maths degrees or an alternative test (can't remember what it's called). But there are plenty of RG and a couple of top 10 (for Maths) Unis that don't.

My son didn't do FM and got offers in Maths degrees from Lancaster, Leeds, York, and Newcastle. He's just got a first from Lancaster and starts a graduate job with a blue chip firm in a couple of weeks' time, so not having FM did him no harm at all. (except for having to do a bit of self study in year one to cover topics not covered in normal A level Maths).

If he wants to do a maths degree and takes A level FM he must get an A grade. Ds took four A levels and needed Astar AA to get into Uni. He got Astar AAB overall but because he had taken Further Maths it HAD to be included in the A*AA entry requirement. If his B grade had been in FM he would not have been accepted. He actually wished many times that he hadn’t taken it.

This. The school is being ridiculous.

I'm not up to date on university requirments (oh godness it's so long ago!) but I will say if he's interesterd enough he will be able to do a maths degree. Yes there are some exceptionally bright people but he doesn't need to be a savant to do it. It will give him so many options when he's out of uni that it'll be worth it. Don't discourage him!

I also heard CS really is a hard subject. I guess it depends on your strength and perhaps it won't be too bad for DS. But obviously, I would like him to pick subjects that he can enjoy but also can achieve a good grade...

DS said he checked the Imperial College's website as an example and said they didn't say you had to take 4 subjects if one of them was FM. So 3 including FM is fine...

If he thinks he might want to do a maths degree he really wants to do maths AND FM. Does he know why he got a 7 in FM GCSE? Did he think he'd get a 9? If it was for a reason such as he didn't bother to revise as he saw it as an "extra", at least that's an explanation.

If maths is his future destination then maths, FM + one other is fine.

If he's unsure I'd personally be ringing other sixth forms to see if anyone else can offer him a spot to study 4.
Studying a language as a 4th A Level is only really useful if he thinks he might go on to use that language (further study, job ...) Otherwise it's not really adding to his list of options. And one of DD's friends who is bilingual with a teacher mum just got a B in her A Level. B is of course a good grade, but MFL A Levels have a lot of native speakers taking them, so it's hard to get top grade.

Slightly scaremongering here ... not all universities need an A in FM to take a maths degree.

Of course his A Level results will influence which universities he can apply to. But that's the same for any subject!

Maths Biology Computer Science would be my choice. It demonstrates a far rounder candidate and allows for more scope at Uni. Personally I think he’d be a fool to do two maths and a science (and that’s exactly what I did).

@Ohthatsabitshit Why do you think he'd be a fool? Is it to narrowing and boring for the two years or is it a problem after?

I'd agree with trying to convince the school to let him start FM as a 4th in Yr12, it seems harsh when he got 9 in everything else. It would give him some flexibility to drop it if it was too difficult, if he can only do three he won't be able to drop it the year after if he wants to. But maybe doing the private language ALevel would solve that if he's strictly not allowed (i.e. he could drop FM in Yr13 and still have 3 full A levels).

Most of the people I knew who did FM as a fourth in Yr12 dropped it in Yr13 (at my sixthform almost everyone did 4 AS levels to start though, then dropped one for Yr13). Due to either not wanting to do maths at university (often a science instead), they preferred their other subjects, or it was simply very hard. I guess it also depends on which university he wants to go to, the top ones for Maths seem to all want FM but there's plenty of other good ones that wouldn't need FM, might be worth having a quick look.

As for computer science or biology, if he's set on maths at uni, I'd let him pick which he prefers because they're both good to accompany. And A-Levels are hard and it's easy to get overloaded doing too much, so best to do something he enjoys x

I don’t think it’s boring I think it’s narrow and a more rounded choice would make applying for Uni easier. Also if he’s unlucky he could end up with the same teacher for maths and further maths which obviously is more risky and exposes you to far less teachers.

That's what I did as well. And if you have your heart set on maths, you don't need the breadth, and university admissions don't care about you being rounded - they care that you are good at and interested in their subject!

If he doesn't take further maths, he's either ruling out a lot of top universities or making transitioning into a maths degree much harder.

if you have your heart set on maths, you don't need the breadth I couldn’t disagree more.

You're aware that education is not just about what is done at school?
Taking a 4th A Level you don't "need" is about the worst way to become more "broad" (although doing an EPQ might be a good alternative for OP's DS).

pursuing hobbies, reading widely, having a part time job all help to make a more rounded person. A Levels are not about making rounded people. They are about teaching students to pass exams.

I think maths, further maths and computer science if he wants to do a maths degree. If he's naturally good at maths, further maths A level shouldn't be any harder than maths. Not sure about his fm gcse as not many schools do this, maybe his teacher missed out some of the content? This combination would be the least amount of homework. Dd does this and gets all her work done in free periods at school.
If he's not sure about fm, then option 3.