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Films

Oppenheimer

208 replies

Prrambulate · 10/06/2023 21:16

Anyone planning on seeing this when it comes out on 21st July?

I'm looking forward to a fascinating exploration of the life of the atom bomb inventor gazing at Cillian Murphy for 3 hours.

Some recent promotional stills. The horse riding one gives off Peaky vibes!

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MotherOfRatios · 23/07/2023 00:39

I enjoyed it.

I think I'll go again, it's layered and complex I would recommend pre reading.

It really highlights themes of the male ego and white guilt which is also layered because he's Jewish.

10/10 the music is how you create suspense for suspense sake!

Meltinthemiddle · 23/07/2023 00:43

Yes definitely wish I had pre read before watching!

whatafaf · 23/07/2023 09:41

Thanks @SleepingStandingUp for the info, always harder when their friends have permission.

GCAcademic · 23/07/2023 19:28

Did anyone else find the dialogue hard to follow? I missed entire lines, including the final one of the film because the "background" sound was so obtrusive while Cillian Murphy's character was softly spoken. Perhaps it was the cinema I was in but my abiding feeling on leaving the screening was irritation at the sound.

Heffapotamus · 23/07/2023 19:31

GCAcademic · 23/07/2023 19:28

Did anyone else find the dialogue hard to follow? I missed entire lines, including the final one of the film because the "background" sound was so obtrusive while Cillian Murphy's character was softly spoken. Perhaps it was the cinema I was in but my abiding feeling on leaving the screening was irritation at the sound.

Not just your cinema sadly.
I'm itching for it to come out on DVD so I can watch it again with subtitles!

PermanentTemporary · 23/07/2023 19:36

I don't think anyone should feel even slightly worried about stopping the under 15s seeing this. There's such a thing as too much of a burden for younger minds. To me the sex scenes weren't the issue but the suicide scenes and the immensity of what the film was grappling with were.

melj1213 · 23/07/2023 19:38

I loved it - it was simply amazing, the cast was amazing, the cinematography was outstanding, the way sound was used was smart as hell, it was all round just brilliant - I didn't even notice it was 3hrs until I tried to get up at the end and my knees had seized up by sitting there for so long!

Murphy as Oppenheimer might be the focus of the movie but the ensemble cast show that he was just one of many cogs and if it hadn't been Oppenheimer organising the Manhattan Project then it could have been one of countless others and that was the point. The bomb was always going to be made, with or without Oppenheimer, but at the time it was a decision of whether they made it first or the Nazis did, because someone was going to do it and they wanted it to be the Allies.

The film shows plenty of Oppenheimer before and after his involvement in the Manhattan project, before the project he is shown to focus only on the science and developing that - it goes into his professorship at Caltech, Berkeley and Harvard as well as his his time in Europe at Cambridge, Leiden and Zurich prewar. He is shown to be an impressive academic who people either admired or resented for his ability to make the work look effortlessly brilliant.

The film actually goes into a lot more of the actual science than I was expecting - I have a science background but even I was lost in places and a friend of mine who is currently studying physics at Caltech loved how much science they included (she saw it before I did as they got it earlier in the US and she could barely contain her joy at the amount of science and "physics cameos" they included when they could have skipped right over it in favour of making it easier for the audience). A lot of the film covers the scope of the Manhattan Project and just how many scientists were involved in it - the fact that the likes of Bohr, Heisenberg, Rabí, Álvarez, Lawrence, Lomenitz, Donald and Lili Hornig, Feynmen, Bainbridge, Neddermeyer and many more physicists are included in the ensemble cast shows just how much Nolan wanted to show the scope of the project.

Because of that it allows the film to explore the relationship between the politics and the science, a lot of the early part of the film focuses on Oppenheimer's political stance and the complications this caused both personally and professionally before, during and after the war. In fact his political stance is a big focus, especially for the later part of the film where it looks more to the vilification of Oppenheimer when he came out against the H-Bomb and in his role on the Atomic Energy Commission he fought hard to prevent continuing work on the H-Bomb at that time, due to both lack of need and the enormous human casualties that would result from its use, but the politicians disagreed. That ultimately lead to Oppenheimer's downfall as the politicians used their connections and influence to blackball him and discredit him for wanting to limit their powers because he had realised just what he had created when he became "Death, the Destroyer of Worlds" in his creation of the bomb.

As for the whole "gratuitous nudity" - I thought it was done very well as a comparison between how Oppenheimer was with Jean and how he was with everyone else. Everyone else saw him as this great educator or scientist and was in awe or admiration of his skill or knowledge whereas Jean just wanted him to see her, to spend time with her and for sex - his scientific prowess was of no interest to her, she didn't even want flowers, she just wanted him ... And when they were together they were totally comfortable accepting that their relationship was purely physical there was no pretence of it being anything other than a physical relationship but they were both comfortable enough with each other that there was no embarrassment to just sit there naked having a discussion after sex, they had an understanding between them that Oppenheimer didn't have with anyone else, even with Kitty when they got married. The only time Jean wanted him to use his knowledge and education wasn't to impress her with his ability or to whisper sweet nothings in her ear, she wanted him to prove himself to give herself the power over him during sex, nothing more.

ColinRobinsonsFart · 23/07/2023 19:43

As it's three hours long... is there an interlude for a pee?

The length put me off as I have a small child's bladder...👽

melj1213 · 23/07/2023 19:52

Not unless you go to an old school cinema that has an intermission halfway through.

I just went during the adverts and then again at the end and I was fine, it's only 3hrs most people manage more during the day at work.

WobblyLondoner · 23/07/2023 20:05

I thought it was great. Agree on it being useful to know a little of the bank story (the cutting between different eras got a little confusing at times) but I thought the casting and acting was amazing. Emily Blunt felt rather underused but my god she made an impression at the end.

Did anyone else have to sit through that indulgent 9 minutes too long Estrella advert? Good god! Never buying another bottle.

WobblyLondoner · 23/07/2023 20:35

Ps it was so wonderful being in a busy cinema - showings of various films sold out, a queue for the toilet etc. Brilliant.

BrandyandGinger · 23/07/2023 20:46

I really enjoyed it. Cillian Murphy was as good as I expected and there are loads of other excellent performances. Casey Affleck was absolutely chilling in a very small part. I didn't recognise Josh Hartnett. I liked the like nod to Good Will Hunting.
My teenage daughter didn't know much of the story and came out of it with dozens of questions, which is great. She said she didn't find it hard to follow the timelines because Cillian's hair told her when it was.

Tacocatgoatcheesepizza · 23/07/2023 21:13

Watched it this evening and was absolutely blown away. An absolute masterpiece as far as I’m concerned. I love Nolan films anyway but this was truly outstanding. I’m not exaggerating when I say I was speechless at the end, didn’t want to talk to dh and could barely get out of my seat. Phenomenal acting, the whole thing was just incredible.

sunglassesonthetable · 23/07/2023 21:16

@melj1213 interesting take on Oppenheimer and Jean.

melj1213 · 23/07/2023 22:21

sunglassesonthetable · 23/07/2023 21:16

@melj1213 interesting take on Oppenheimer and Jean.

Theirs was a complicated relationship but I think it was very well explored within the movie, I've actually had quite a few conversations with friends about it in the last couple of days.

I had read the book the movie is based on so I knew some of the history between Tatlock and Oppenheimer, but I thought Florence's portrayal of Jean was pretty clear that she was an independent woman who was in a relationship with Oppenheimer but she needed him as a friend (with benefits) more than she wanted him as a partner in a relationship, especially due to her depression - she needed to know he'd answer her call whenever she needed him and he always did ... Until he didn't and then she killed herself.

Oppenheimer was initially more into Jean than she was into him; he proposed multiple times and she turned him down each time because while she loved him she wasn't in love with him, she was on her own academic path and didn't have any intention of giving it all up to become his wife (as was expected of women at the time).

I thought that was eloquently shown by the repeated theme of Oppenheimer bringing her flowers, despite her telling him not to and then each time he brings them she doesn't do the socially acceptable thing and accepting them with grace and getting rid of them later. Instead Jean immediately takes them, tells him she didn't want them, bins them (often while holding eye contact with him) and then moves on - she doesn't hold it against him but she also doesn't change her stance.

Their relationship is one of mutual understanding - she needs him around to be her support and her friend, she doesn't need him to be smart or intelligent or some sort of authority figure like everyone else. The only time she asks him to use his intelligence is so she can get herself off while they're having sex, not because she wants him to be smart but to exert control over the situation.

However, over time as Oppenheimer was taken further and further away from her by his marriage, kids, the Manhattan Project etc she seemed to realise she did need him after all, just as he realised he couldn't be there for her anymore and had to end their relationship. This took the power that she was used to having away from Jean and ultimately (in the movie at least) it is shown to contribute towards her reasoning for committing suicide.

The only other time there is the "gratuitous nudity" is in the trial scene where Kitty having to listen to her husband recount his relationship with Jean and again I think it was used fantastically to show the power balance of their relationship. Kitty and Robert's was a marriage of necessity (which they both never denied) and she did love him but she always knew he was having affairs and she knew that Jean was always "the one that got away" for him and that he felt responsible for her death, which was something she could never compete with, despite her years of loyalty to him.

thebear1 · 23/07/2023 22:29

I watched it on Friday with my 15 year old, we both thought it was wonderfully done and thought provoking. I'm looking forward to rewatching it in the future.

melj1213 · 23/07/2023 22:32

I also forgot to add that I think that Emily Blunt was chronically underutilized as Kitty, there was so much more they could have done with her character especially as a juxtaposition to Florence Pugh's Jean but I hen the film was already 3hrs long and there has to be limits.

ErinAoife · 23/07/2023 22:53

Great acting but I wasn't blowed away by the film. Emily Blunt was barely recognizable, I don't know if it is her make up but it put me off the character and I usually like her. I much prefer tenet and Dunkirk.

WobblyLondoner · 23/07/2023 23:04

melj1213 · 23/07/2023 22:32

I also forgot to add that I think that Emily Blunt was chronically underutilized as Kitty, there was so much more they could have done with her character especially as a juxtaposition to Florence Pugh's Jean but I hen the film was already 3hrs long and there has to be limits.

I agree, though she did shine in the last 30 mins didn't she.

XelaM · 23/07/2023 23:13

It was ok.

Great acting and absolutely superb cast, but I absolutely HATE the modern phenomenon of constant flash backs and muddled time lines. Why not just show scenes in chronological order?!? Also, some important facts were changed and major characters missing.

Where was Fermi and what was up with all the Edward Teller nonsense? He didn't even have anything to do with the atomic bomb as far as I know. It was a different Hungarian - Leo Szilard who played a crucial role and he's not even featured in the film.

melj1213 · 23/07/2023 23:35

XelaM · 23/07/2023 23:13

It was ok.

Great acting and absolutely superb cast, but I absolutely HATE the modern phenomenon of constant flash backs and muddled time lines. Why not just show scenes in chronological order?!? Also, some important facts were changed and major characters missing.

Where was Fermi and what was up with all the Edward Teller nonsense? He didn't even have anything to do with the atomic bomb as far as I know. It was a different Hungarian - Leo Szilard who played a crucial role and he's not even featured in the film.

Edward Teller definitely was involved with the atomic bomb, he worked on the Manhattan Project in the Theoretical division at Los Alamos before being redeployed to a separate team looking into the viability of the H-Bomb, exactly as portrayed in the movie ...

I don't know whether you just missed it but Leo Szilard was featured in the film, he was played by Máté Haumann as was Fermi, played by Danny Deferrari.

XelaM · 24/07/2023 00:10

melj1213 · 23/07/2023 23:35

Edward Teller definitely was involved with the atomic bomb, he worked on the Manhattan Project in the Theoretical division at Los Alamos before being redeployed to a separate team looking into the viability of the H-Bomb, exactly as portrayed in the movie ...

I don't know whether you just missed it but Leo Szilard was featured in the film, he was played by Máté Haumann as was Fermi, played by Danny Deferrari.

Ah I definitely missed Fermi and Szilard. Wasn't the main thing that Fuchs passed to the Russians Fermi's calculations and the fact that i instead of heavy water the US were using graphite? I also thought that it was Szilard who discovered the nuclear chain reaction and showed it to Einstein? In the film, it looked that Teller was the main character in all of that.

BreadInCaptivity · 24/07/2023 00:15

Just back from the cinema.

Not going to lie, I wasn't wowed by it.

Usually love Nolan's films and it's a subject of interest to me...but, but...

It's FAR to long imho. It needs at least a 30 min prune. I think it's padded by giving the all the star cast enough film time.

Didn't mind the different timelines per se and did not find it confusing but again I think this contributes to the long run time as each timeline reasserts itself.

I'm sure it will do well with the critics and at the awards but for myself I won't be looking forward to watch it again on TV (as I did with Tenet and Inception).

BumWhisperers · 24/07/2023 00:29

I find using female nudity as a way of showing a comfortable relationship, or anything really, pretty lazy

XelaM · 24/07/2023 00:33

BumWhisperers · 24/07/2023 00:29

I find using female nudity as a way of showing a comfortable relationship, or anything really, pretty lazy

Totally agree. All the scenes with Kitty were odd and unnecessary.

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