Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Feminism: chat

Feminism: sex and gender

Original poster

Craig Charles

72 replies

MagicalMystical · 09/12/2024 08:17

In the light of the culture we have now, can someone explain to me how Craig Charles escaped his now-cleared rape charge in 1995? I can only find articles from the Independent which is behind a paywall. It has let me read this one:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/red-dwarf-actor-led-gangrape-of-woman-in-flat-1574082.html

But I can’t read anything that shows how they decided this didn’t happen.

OP posts:
NigelHarmansNewWife · 09/12/2024 08:20

He was found not guilty. What are you asking?

soupfiend · 09/12/2024 08:20

He was wongly accused wasnt he? Thats what i recall from the time.

It affected his life quite a lot at the time I think I read.

bunnypenny · 09/12/2024 08:21

What do you mean “in light of the culture we have now”!

Original poster
MagicalMystical · 09/12/2024 08:22

bunnypenny · 09/12/2024 08:21

What do you mean “in light of the culture we have now”!

The culture of listening to women

OP posts:
UndeniablyGenX · 09/12/2024 08:23

I'm not sure what your question is. He was acquitted - he told a jury he didn't do it, and based on the evidence given in court, they found him not guilty.

Theunamedcat · 09/12/2024 08:23

MagicalMystical · 09/12/2024 08:22

The culture of listening to women

Show quote history

She lied

Original poster
MagicalMystical · 09/12/2024 08:25

I know he was acquitted, I’m asking if anyone has any links to things that are not behind a paywall that shows in as much detail as the article I linked to, why the jury found him not guilty.

I think we know by now that women who bring these things as far as court are not lying. So I want to read for myself how they threw it out.

OP posts:
Goody2ShoesAndTheFilthyBeast · 09/12/2024 08:26

it went to trial and he was not found to be guilty.

edit - cross posted with you.
I don't think transcripts of trials and the explanations of jurors why they made their decision are available.

bunnypenny · 09/12/2024 08:28

MagicalMystical · 09/12/2024 08:22

The culture of listening to women

Show quote history

They did listen to her. He was on remand in prison for 3.5months and then he stood trial. If they hasn’t listened to her no charges would have been brought.

i don’t understand what your question is? Are you really asking why he wasn’t found guilty?

Moonlightstars · 09/12/2024 08:29

There's absolutely no proof that she lied. There was just no proof that the rape had occurred.
I've met Craig Charles a few times and he comes across as quite vile.
That obviously doesn't make him guilty.

skippy67 · 09/12/2024 08:30

Why are you so bothered by this? After all this time? The victim was "listened to", and found to be lying.

Original poster
MagicalMystical · 09/12/2024 08:31

@bunnypenny - I’m asking what happened at the trial that led to him not facing the charges brought. I want to read it for myself.

The tide has only just recently turned. In the 90s men could get away with this so much more easily (and it’s still all too easy now, progress is woefully slow).

OP posts:
PandoraSox · 09/12/2024 08:34

MagicalMystical · 09/12/2024 08:31

@bunnypenny - I’m asking what happened at the trial that led to him not facing the charges brought. I want to read it for myself.

The tide has only just recently turned. In the 90s men could get away with this so much more easily (and it’s still all too easy now, progress is woefully slow).

He did face charges though and was found not guilty.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/red-dwarf-star-cleared-of-rape-7946138.html

HellonHeels · 09/12/2024 08:35

skippy67 · 09/12/2024 08:30

Why are you so bothered by this? After all this time? The victim was "listened to", and found to be lying.

She was not found to be lying.

The accused were found not guilty.

Dash0Cal · 09/12/2024 08:36

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/red-dwarf-star-cleared-of-rape-7946138.html There’s some detail here- sounds
like the prosecution case fell apart under cross examination. The fact that the jury unanimously found him not guilty on all counts, and so quickly, suggests that it was fairly clear cut.

Goody2ShoesAndTheFilthyBeast · 09/12/2024 08:36

MagicalMystical · 09/12/2024 08:31

@bunnypenny - I’m asking what happened at the trial that led to him not facing the charges brought. I want to read it for myself.

The tide has only just recently turned. In the 90s men could get away with this so much more easily (and it’s still all too easy now, progress is woefully slow).

He did "face the charges brought".

That's what the trial was.

He wasn't found guilty.

That doesn't mean his ex girlfriend lied. I obviously have no idea whether she did or not. It means that the prosecution did not prove their case beyond a reasonable doubt.

midgetastic · 09/12/2024 08:40

We can't go and retry people just because we understand rape better than we did - however much you personally doubt the verdict

What is more important is to go forward and improve the prosecution and conviction rates and to denormalise rape and sexual abuse in society

bunnypenny · 09/12/2024 08:40

MagicalMystical · 09/12/2024 08:31

@bunnypenny - I’m asking what happened at the trial that led to him not facing the charges brought. I want to read it for myself.

The tide has only just recently turned. In the 90s men could get away with this so much more easily (and it’s still all too easy now, progress is woefully slow).

Short of going back in time and sitting through the two week trial you can’t. There are no transcripts and the jury reasoning isn’t public.

what has changed though from then though is the narrative that a finding of not guilty in rape means it was a false accusation. Now, an acquittal means it might have happened but can’t be proven.

Don’t know what happened with the Craig Charles case but he was found not guilty unanimously by the jury in 1hr43mins which would suggest it was v clear cut.

PandoraSox · 09/12/2024 08:41

@MagicalMystical I think one big reason the case failed is the lack of physical evidence.

Original poster
MagicalMystical · 09/12/2024 08:43

To those wondering why I’m asking now - I’m not sure I have a satisfactory answer for you. I think at the time, male power being what it was, I just assumed he had done what she said he had done but had got off with it (maybe I could compare it to us all knowing what Prince Andrew did but nothing can be done about it).

Looking at the links sent above, it seems the CPS failed to gather evidence in a timely manner so she had no proof and she was branded a liar.

As a PP says, it’s good that we don’t think like that anymore. She wasn’t necessarily a liar and he didn’t necessarily do it. Her truth could not be proven, so he was acquitted.

OP posts:
PandoraSox · 09/12/2024 08:43

What is very noticeable is that case was done and dusted in 9 months. Now it is taking two years to bring rape cases to court.

Excourtclerk · 09/12/2024 08:54

You will never find out what happened in the trial unless you were in the public gallery and even then if the court decided to hear the case in chambers you still wouldn't find out because the public would have been asked to leave the court room. News reports will only state the outcome. My guess would be that it was found to be insufficient evidence and the jury were directed a not guilty verdict should be given. That is if a jury were inpanelled in the first place. If they weren't then the prosecution would have dropped the case and the judge would have directed no case to answer.

WomensSports · 09/12/2024 09:01

PandoraSox · 09/12/2024 08:43

What is very noticeable is that case was done and dusted in 9 months. Now it is taking two years to bring rape cases to court.

It took from August 2003 to February 2005 for my rape case to come to court from the point of first reporting it. So it's been getting longer for a long time. It just dragged on and on with no end in sight (and then got dropped by CPS on the day); it must be awful for women if it's taking even longer.

username299 · 09/12/2024 09:04

I remember the case at the time and found it very disturbing. Craig Charles was a big star at the time and the woman didn't stand to gain anything from accusing him and his friends of rape.

The reason there was no evidence was because a specialist Dr could not be found when she went to a rape clinic. By the time she was examined, she had unsurprisingly, washed.

This was a time when rape victims were 'slut shamed' in court, quizzed about their sexual histories and what they were wearing. I can't imagine why a woman would volunteer to go through that.

Swipe left for the next trending thread