15 year old raped at the beach. Bbc news story

[Goddessonahighway]

Bbc story today that a 15 year old girl was at the beach with her friends when an older male in his twenties pulled her out to sea and raped her. Are girls not safe anywhere?! I'm not making any new or interesting points but just sharing my despair and sadness that a young woman was having a fun day with friends and would never have guessed she was at risk of any harm.

I was just reading that story. It's horrific, the poor girl.

No, women aren’t safe anywhere. Never have been. Most assaults don’t hit the news and most men just get away with it. Obviously something like this is rare, but sadly men attacking young women really isn’t.

No, women are not safe anywhere. Never have been.

That poor girl. Heart-breaking.

Sadly I’ve read stories a couple of times about this happening. Just horrific. You would think you would be safe swimming at the seaside. Poor girls

As a man I think the sentance for rape needs to be far more than it is. I'm not sure I'd ever let the rapist free, if he gets out of prison he should be tagged for life.

This. Girl babies are raped in the cradle. Women's bodies are violated in the morgue. Because of under-reporting of rape, it's hard to know whether rates of rape are changing, but, sadly, women are never entirely safe anywhere.

exactly this
they just get a slap on wrist
and the whole process makes it incredibly tough on the victim
not to mention how paedophiles are just casually released back into society
I will get a lot of flack for this but imo there should be a death penalty for proven paedophiles who have committed 1 serious offence or multiple 'lesser' offences including for possession of child pornography.

It's probably the only crime where a victim is made to feel like a criminal. And by police of all people. At least it used to be like that, doubt that it changed much.

If your house gets robbed, people won't say 'but why did you have all that expensive stuff in it? Why didn't you have cameras? Why didn't you have more sophisticated locks? Why did you show off your expensive car in the driveway?'. If you get beaten up in the street (or elsewhere) - same. People might speculate depending on circs, but it usually won't be: 'why were you drunk at that club at night?' 'Why did you look funny at that guy?' etc. If you get murdered - again.

So the girl/woman is raped, then re-traumatized at the police station, grilled multiple times and humiliated, and then the case might not even go to the court, as 'not enough evidence'. And even if it does go to court, victim's character gets disintegrated, her lifestyle choices questioned, etc. And the rapist might not even be convicted. And even if he is - he'll most probably get a slap on a wrist.

It's shameful and infuriating.

I'm all for the death penalty for paedophiles. And frankly I'm all for women being armed. I know it's not legal in the UK but if a nice number of women shot rapists in the groin, rape would plummet. Men respect violence.

I'm also all for women being armed
at the very minimum pepper sprays and tasers

Many women in the US are armed. It’s a fantasy to think it makes women safer. The more weapons you have circulating in a community, the more they are used against women.

And the vast majority of sexual assault is by men known to women, in circumstances when a woman is unlikely to be able to use a weapon, even if she has one.

And the vast majority of sexual assault is by men known to women, in circumstances when a woman is unlikely to be able to use a weapon, even if she has one.

I agree.

I've been assaulted.

I froze with sheer terror, I couldn't even scream - my throat closed up. The shock and violence are paralysing.

If I'd had a Kalashnikov I wouldn't have had the presence of mind to use it.

Weapons are not the answer. You’d need to have police/forces levels of training and practice to know you wouldn’t just freeze in a situation where you needed to use them. And if your attacker is bigger and stronger than you (e.g. almost any man) there’s a chance that he could use it against you.

I don’t know what is the answer though. Not anything less impossible than total root and branch change in our society and culture.

I agree. I had the same experience. You think you’d fight or run or scream, but when it happens you freeze.

Sympathy with you and everyone it happens to. Don’t feel ashamed (as I did) for not having a ‘better’ reaction. The shame is all on him.

Well said. Freezing is actually a very effective survival response, in many cases, especially with an attacker who is stronger than you.

The response that allows you to survive is never the wrong response.

Freezing is normal. You need to take a rape safety course so you know what to do. I did at a respected US university. The local police taught it and explained and helped us to develop a plan. Running away was no.1. The police ( one whose niece was there) also seconded my recommendation that women get a gun and train. I worked for a firearms foundation years ago and knew the stats. Women who are trained in firearms are way safer! No man is going to mess with you if he knows you're armed he will pick an easier victim.

I read this story and it reminded me of an odd new story last year (I think) if 2 people being pulled out the sea by lifeguards, it was odd wording at the time as they specifically said the two weren't known to each other.

I assume this is the background to that story

And now back in the real world...

The US shows us that there is no correlation between women being armed and avoiding rape. States with relaxed gun control laws have some of the highest rates of reported rape, and also some of the lowest (link). Most states with tight gun control are around the middle of the pack.

Most rape is by intimate partners/ex-partners, friends and acquaintances, in situations where women are unlikely to be able to defend themselves with a gun. So you can stop your pro-gun propaganda.

Rape is terrible but so is murder. Guns are used in over 80% of homicides in the US.

Homicide by gun in the US in 2021 = 21,000
Homicide by gun in the UK in 2021 = 28

At school, we used to believe you could escape by jabbing two fingers in the attacker’s eyes.
When it happened, there were so many reasons I couldn’t. Shock, freezing, not enough room, my arms went weak, he was taller than me, I couldn’t get my breath, the powerful taboo against injuring someone, frightened it would make him even more violent…

Sorry about this terrible experience, @Ofcourseshecan . I know it's a cliché, but you are a survivor - you did what you needed to do to survive. Fighting back is dangerous and is only a sensible response in very specific circumstances e.g. if there are other people very close by who can intervene (and even then, it's not always the best choice).

No choice that helps you survive is wrong.

… If I’d had a gun, I’d also have had to be willing to kill him, and certain that my first shot would at least disable him, and confident that he wouldn’t be able to grab the gun off me. Also, I’d have to shoot him while I had the chance before he’d knocked me down — and as he wouldn’t have done me much harm at that point, I would almost certainly have been found guilty of murder or at least manslaughter.

No point when convictions are so incredibly low.

I see someone has already blamed women for being raped if they haven’t attended a special course or armed themselves with a weapon.

I tried the fingers in the eyes thing when it happened to me, after similar discussions at school. I was too panicked to do it properly, and he made bloody sure I couldn't do it again by breaking my fingers. Bastard.

I've had weapons training. Decades ago before tighter gun restrictions came in.

If women were allowed to carry weapons like tasers or pepper spray they'd still need training. Using weapons effectively needs good training, too, not just a bit of practice wherever you buy them from.

It needs to be second nature or the weapon is too easily used against the owner.

Also, how would we restrict these types of weapons to women? Pepper spray or tasers would make it so much easier for a predatory man to take a woman.

Self-defence training is probably the best we can hope for at the moment. Again, it needs to be regular and good quality training so it becomes automatic.

My abusive ex had - and still has - both shotgun and firearms legally held. After attacking me and threatening to kill me (caught on a micro-recorder), he attended the police station with his legal guns (he had and probably still has many illegal weapons hidden). The police praised him for his responsible stance and returned them after the court case. He was let off at court for being a good citizen by surrendering his weapons immediately and without being asked. Laughable.

The coward is terrified of prison. I strongly suspect that is the only reason I am still here but I still live in fear as he's always said he'll take anyone who ever crossed him with him if he was diagnosed with a terminal illness.

I try not to think of the prick too much but I still pray he gets hit by a bus rather than get an illness.

Any and every woman attacked and raped by a man would want to kill him. Men don't understand this unless they're a very rare victim of rape themselves. Many women don't understand it unless they've been a victim, too.

It'll never happen for many reasons but I'd have only rape or other male violence victims run the justice system for these cases.

Oh my god that is horrific, I’m so sorry 😔💐 And angry that this happened to you. Anyone who thinks they can tell a victim of rape or assault what they should have done can absolutely fuck off and die. They have no idea.