Value of playing with dolls

Thank you, not yet read it but it sounds reasonable. However males and females are different for evolutionary reasons, and nothing can turn one into the other. A group of infants were presented with toy cars and toy dolls, and females chose dolls. They had not been conditioned, because they had never seen toys before. They were monkeys.

Sorry but nobody told me, there are many studies strongly suggesting gender norms are instilled upon us rather than being innate. Teaching boys/men to care is not 'turning them into girls'. Op, imo all children should have access to a wide range of types of toys.

A group of infants were presented with toy cars and toy dolls, and females chose dolls. They had not been conditioned, because they had never seen toys before. They were monkeys.

Monkeys aren't humans. Also, why do you think monkeys can't be conditioned? They are very intelligent, and they see the behaviour of other monkeys and copy it. It's not hard to imagine that an infant monkey might see the mother monkey carrying babies around.

When my DS was a toddler he went to a childminder / mini-nursery set up that had 9 toddler boys (by coincidence! It wasn't intentionally single sex!)

As several of the DC had younger siblings or ones on the way, the CM got each of the DC a baby doll and a buggy, and encouraged them to be caring towards their "baby" to help them to practice this, to help adjust to their new siblings.

Most days, they'd go to the park, each pushing their baby in a buggy, we got photos of this,it was so sweet, and well thought out by the CM. (She said it also helped them not run off and go in the same direction, bonus!)

I haven't read the article but will after DC in bed, thanks :)

"Gender neutral" toys are often seen as just the "boys toys". But, traditional "girls toys" have loads of educational value too (for all DC, obvs).

The monkey experiment found the female monkeys spent fairly equal amount of time with the 'male' and 'female' toy and the male monkey showed a preference.
But children dont play exclusivley with one type of toy even if they have a strong preference or a favourite. My son loved trains. He still found plenty of time for dolls. Parents encourage a range of play to develop a range of skills from puzzles to balls to small world. So encouraging play with dolls to develop caring seems sensible.

That study makes sense to me (and involved both male and female children happily playing with dolls... Well balanced human children enjoy all kinds of toys, even if they have innate or cultural preferences)

Worth noting that it probably also works for "boys dolls" (think Action Man), not just Barbie dolls. My boys really enjoy having their teddies and super hero dolls join them for a tea party, or a game of snakes and ladders. We take turns "roleplaying" the dolls, doing the voices. Captain America and Iron Man are always squabbling like an old couple...

Do the dolls have to be people? My ds does a lot of relationships play with dinosaurs and schleich animals (with ongoing dialogue and commentary, although he doesn’t address them as ‘you’). His actual ‘doll’ is for nurturing (it is named after the younger brother of one of his friends).

www.naacpldf.org/ldf-celebrates-60th-anniversary-brown-v-board-education/significance-doll-test/

Slightly off track, but OP’s article reminded me of the ‘doll test’ and how effective it was in demonstrating children’s perceptions of themselves (used by the NAACP in arguing for integrated schools).

My sons have a doll, cot, pram, clothes / blankets etc. 6 and 4 year old have never chosen to play with it, to be honest. I’m still keeping it for my 10 month old but I find it strange how they won’t play with the doll!
But yes have convos with teddies & other figures.

@butnobodytoldme cars are pretty new on the scene so that’s some quick work evolution has done to make them boy toys….

I think we need to be clear, when looking at this study that Barbie sponsored it. No idea if they pre-registered it or if they've sponsored a bunch of them but only published the ones that ended up with the results they liked. It is small (just 33 kids). And its main point appears to be "Don't let your young kids just play on screens."

But, OP, I think your point about how much more we value the engineering skills assumed to be developed by toys like Lego than relationship and empathy skills is very important.

Interesting. As an only I only had girls' toys.

DS was first and had mostly "boy" toys. Cars, tractor, train set, lego but did have a toy kitchen and shop.

His sister (he was 3.5) had all if his toys to share and more girly toys. She liked the boy and girl toys equally and never much cared for Disney princesses/dressing up but loved her dolls. She was much more of a builder than DS.

Whilst they both studied a humanity/language, dd I far more innately mathematical than ds.

There are ‘dolls’ (including teddies, dinosaurs, and doll houses with tiny dolls etc) for role play.

Some soft toys (call them dolls) are to give comfort to the child mostly, rather than be looked after by the child.

Then there are dolls and little animals for looking after and dressing.
Not all girls like those, but some girls girls who do really devote a lot of their playtime to them. I wonder if little boys might prefer something like Sylvanian families to individual dolls?

I am not sure if as many boys do play with baby dolls and barbies, but suppose the people who would notice most would be families who have both girls and boys and a baby doll or Barbie freely available and never presume that their little boy shouldn’t play with them.

If boys don’t so often I think it would be both innate and environmental.

I've got one girl who's really into dolls, but it's the LOL and Barbie type rather than baby dolls. And one girl who doesn't like dolls at all. She likes Sylvanians and small fiddly toys like Hatchimals and animal figures. She has autism though and is not your " typical girl" though she's not into cars. She's very imaginative with the toys she does like.
I've got a young boy who loves cars and trains and a teenage boy who was the same. They've always had access to dolls and things but they're not interested. One went through a phase of liking Ariel off the Little Mermaid so I bought him that doll but he never picked it up. The things that both boys and girls all played with are jigsaws, stickle, bricks, building blocks, lego, painting sets.

I am not sure if as many boys do play with baby dolls and barbies, but suppose the people who would notice most would be families who have both girls and boys and a baby doll or Barbie freely available and never presume that their little boy shouldn’t play with them.

I have one of each. Ds (6) happily plays with the dolls house and the barbies. Dd (3) is equally partial to the cars and dinosaurs. We have an army of playmobil and they set up complex house play just as often as they have naval battles or fight dinosaurs. When ds's friends come over, most of them seem fine incorporating the dolls into play but most of dd's friends aren't interested in cars or dinosaurs.

I was born in the 1950s, possibly the most sexist stereotype decade of the past 50 years. I hated dolls! I remember getting told off for drawing beards and moustaches on their horrible rubber faces with indelible biro. I much preferred curling up with a book or playing chase in the woods. And I am autistic.
I didn’t buy dolls for my own DDs, apart from a rag doll each when they were toddlers, which had a zip, a button, a popper, a velcro fastener and shoelaces so they could practise clothes fastening.
Had I been born nowadays I shudder to think how I might have been pushed onto a trans pathway to puberty blockers and surgery, for not fitting female sexist stereotypes.

“Dinosauratemydaffodils

“ScrollingLeaves
I am not sure if as many boys do play with baby dolls and barbies, but suppose the people who would notice most would be families who have both girls and boys and a baby doll or Barbie freely available and never presume that their little boy shouldn’t play with them.”

Dinosauratemydaffodils
“I have one of each. Ds (6) happily plays with the dolls house and the barbies. Dd (3) is equally partial to the cars and dinosaurs. We have an army of playmobil and they set up complex house play just as often as they have naval battles or fight dinosaurs. When ds's friends come over, most of them seem fine incorporating the dolls into play but most of dd's friends aren't interested in cars or dinosaurs.”

It sounds pleasantly mixed at your house, Dinosaur.

Does your little boy play with the barbies the way little girls do: endlessly dressing them up, changing their clothes, brushing their hair? Or is it more having the barbies act out scenes and roles ( which girls do too I know)? Does he ‘look after’ any baby dolls by any chance, feeding them and changing their nappies, rocking them etc? ( I suppose any child doing this could depend on whether or not a younger sibling has been born.)

@Babdoc
Yes, I wonder if you would have felt that pressure now. It is awful to think that that could be the case.

Thinking back to dolls, did your children ever seem to miss having them? I am asking because I sometimes think some girls can yearn for the opposite of what their mothers liked. My mother hated dolls, I loved them and had to get them from other sources. She didn’t mind me having a dolls house though. My dd did not like dolls.

Action Man is a doll. DS had at least 3, plus the jeep, helicopter and a box of boots, guns and grenades.

ScrollingLeaves one DD is autistic, and loved trains - she had a full set of die cast Thomas the tank engine and his friends! She liked stuffed toy animals - her favourite was a walrus, but she never asked for a doll for Xmas.
Other DD is NT, but wasn’t into dolls either. My MIL bought her one, along with a toy cleaning set of brush, dustpan, etc, (much to my disgust!) but I think she found it boring and didn’t play with it. She preferred books, jigsaws, board games and playing outside.

Both sexes play with dolls and cars here. Nobody is confused as far as I know

@Babdoc
Thank you for answering. My theory of girls wanting the opposite of what their mothers had liked evidently doesn’t hold up!

Your DDs sound lovely, and very happily and thoroughly engaged by their various interests.

5zeds
Do your boys do ‘caring’ with their dolls or is it mainly having them play roles?

I think much the same as the girls. Less tea parties (possibly because they were less interested in stage setting). My observation would be the girls seemed to spend much longer negotiating the rules and who was who and curating the games, whereas boys tended to just wing it, swap parts and play more.