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Male masseur voyeurism- in news. Shows myths depressingly

35 replies

NiceGerbil · 21/08/2021 18:16

Hello. Saw this in the news today.

Well done to the woman who realised what was going on and pushed to get this result.

What I found depressing was the way it showed up how women are seen as lacking credibility / men are given the benefit of the doubt in thinks relating to sex offences esp non contact ones.

What jumped out:

  • Partner suggested it was pregnancy hormones and she'd got the wrong end of the stick. I'm not saying he's awful or anything. This is the entrenched first response that the vast majority of people will give, even to someone they love and know is reliable etc. When it comes to this stuff.

  • The police response oh my fucking God. I was aghast. I mean everyone knows this is usually how it works but to read this was still shocking.

'I rang 101 [the police non-emergency number] and was booked in for an appointment the following day with two male PCs, where I showed them a picture of the clock and they asked "Are you sure it was that clock? Are you sure it was recording you?"

I said I could not be certain that it was, but it looks exactly the same and felt it was worth investigating regardless.

Then they said that they had spoken to a sergeant and that the best way forward was to confirm with the masseur if he had a legitimate reason to be recording people because they said he might feel that he needs to protect himself against accusations.'

-The police FIRST thought was. Oh well women lie and so men need to protect themselves. That's probably what's going on here.
For fucks sake.

  • Their suggestion how to move forward if she insisted (which I assume she must have done after the attempted fob off, oh well he needs to protect himself against false accusations...)...

'They indicated that they wanted me to go back and ask him why he was recording me, at which I pointed out I was five-and-a-half months pregnant and vulnerable and I didn't think it was a good idea to send a pregnant woman alone to ask him why he had recorded her.'
What the actually fuck???!!!

I mean. What?!

So she goes back. He says oh no it's just a signal booster or some old flannel. She can't do anything really. She leaves. He deletes everything. Yay?!
And as she rightly said. Sending a woman who strongly suspects she has been a victim of a sex offence back to have a nice 1-1 chat with him?

  • Despite this she kept at it. I mean I'd guess most people would have thought sod it at that point. She is determined.

'I made a complaint that I didn't think that it was dealt with correctly, and they said they would look into it.

A couple of weeks later I got a phone call from police to say they had gone to Roddis and he just admitted it outright upon being asked and surrendered all of the equipment.

Police found he had made about 2,000 videos of his clients and that there were more than 900 victims.'

Nine hundred women. NINE HUNDRED. And only caught because she kept at it when the police were giving her a very very strong message to shut up and go away.

Also note it was her sister who said to report.

What a brilliant woman. Thank you to her.
OP posts:

NiceGerbil · 21/08/2021 18:25

Some further comments.

  • Only a handful of victims identified. The man was filming clients. He will have records obv. Many will presumably be local. What are the police doing to identify further victims?

  • Did he put these films online? Not confirmed either way. That's a massive question that needs answering.

  • Other victims... Other reason the police should be trying to get them to come forward/ trace them. Is what if he went further than filming with any? I mean it's an obvious question. Seems like he was filming them getting undressed. This woman said towel was v short. They need to confirm he didn't do anything worse surely.

  • Final and unpopular point. The victim was not sure about a male masseur. Thought oh don't be so old fashioned to herself. Little towel. Again she thought hmmm. She pushed these feelings to one side as I'm sure most women have done with their instincts over their lives. We are told that it's a people problem, women do it too. That it's sexist/ discriminatory to baulk at men performing stuff where we are vulnerable etc. But over and over stuff happens and the minority of men who do this sort of thing are often prolific. So women are stuck really aren't we. Those who want or prefer women for xyz are seen as out dated sexists. Not sure where I'm going here but the discomfort so many women feel is just dismissed, generally. This is the whole 'you wanted equality here's a taste of your own medicine' thing isn't it.
OP posts:

GrandmaMazur · 21/08/2021 18:39

I came on to see if anyone has posted about this.

I read this this morning and thought exactly the same. Just WTF?

And the police were congratulating themselves on how well they’d handled the case!


lazylinguist · 21/08/2021 18:39

Totally agree with all your points. So depressing, and yes, women are damned if they're cautious about men's intentions and damned if they don't act cautiously 'keep themselves safe'. Either way, it's their fault - for being sexist men-haters or 'asking for trouble'.


Mulletsaremisunderstood · 21/08/2021 18:43

Ugh, gross. Quite honestly, stuff like this is why I have no problem asking for women service providers. We shouldn't have to 'be kind' to men all the time, and override our instincts, they are there for a reason.

This is also why we don't want men in our spaces, they can't be trusted.


OnlyFlans · 21/08/2021 18:52

I also read this this morning and was horrified and really angry- especially at the response of the husband and the (presumably male) police officers the lady reported her concerns to.

Absolute disgrace.


NiceGerbil · 21/08/2021 19:58

I don't think badly of her OH tbh. No reason to think he is not loving etc.

His reaction is pretty standard sadly. IME and from reading on here, talking to friends etc the first response esp for non contact stuff or 'trivial' things like a brief stray hand on a bum in a bar is to minimise. Are you sure? Could you have been mistaken? It could have been something innocent etc etc.

The fact that the POLICE went down that route is utterly appalling. I can't believe their response.

Are you sure he was recording you?
How the hell is she supposed to know that?

Hmmm there's probably an innocent explanation. What could it be?
Oh yes he needs to film women taking their clothes off. Without their knowledge. To protect himself from any false accusations of sexual misconduct made by his female clients. Yep that makes sense. Perfectly rational and legal behaviour by a man in his line of business.

What you're not buying it?
Well just go and ask him then. (!!??!!!).

This is just appalling. Like properly worse than hopeless.
Making up reasons why a man they don't know anything about would be secretly filming women taking their clothes off. That would make it perfectly fine and somehow not illegal :/

OP posts:

NiceGerbil · 21/08/2021 19:59

And what about the other victims fgs?

And is this stuff online?

Have the police even bothered with following anything up?

OP posts:

WorkingItOutAsIGo · 21/08/2021 20:00

What a shero she is!


NiceGerbil · 21/08/2021 20:01

It shouldn't take this though should it FFS.

It should not take a woman being quite frankly really confident and determined even though 5 months Pg. To get the police to even recognise a fucking sex offence when it's under their noses.

OP posts:

Mumoftwoinprimary · 21/08/2021 20:13

It’s interesting that the police defined this as a “job well done”. The victim made a complaint about them! Anyone else would see this as a total hash up!


powershowerforanhour · 21/08/2021 20:40

Then they said that they had spoken to a sergeant and that the best way forward was to confirm with the masseur if he had a legitimate reason to be recording people because they said he might feel that he needs to protect himself against accusations.

Filming without the clients' knowledge or consent? WTF...WTF..WTF...WTF...WTF????


NiceGerbil · 21/08/2021 20:50

I know.

Voyeurism is illegal. Full stop.

For them to ignore that and explain it away with a massive pernicious myth (women lie about men assaulting them sexually all the time) is mind blowingly shit.

The other thing I remembered was 'i believe you/ we believe you'.

Of course it got a massive backlash because of a deliberate misrepresentation by stacks of people that it meant that when sex offences are reported the victim should be 100% always truthful and men should go prison immediately etc etc etc.

Of course it meant that when things are reported- like this- the police and others don't immediately start looking for reasons she's got it wrong etc etc. This case is a really stark example of that.

And we know that women and girls get fobbed off all the time when it comes to sex offences/ or their actions are scrutinised first. (Why were you there, did you know him before, why did you xyz etc).

The police saying this was a job well done is a proper trump style - say what you want whether it's true or not.

Like that fella who murdered a young woman. Police were hey look we caught him so fast. Aren't we fab. Turns out he was prolific sex offender and well known to them for years.

This seems to happen all the time.

OP posts:

RandomDent · 22/08/2021 10:01

I’ve just read this story on Facebook and came to see if it was being discussed here. Most of the comments on the story are along these lines. And as for the police patting themselves on the back - wtf? This story needs to be publicised as a total failure of men to protect women. Including her husband!


catzwhiskas · 23/08/2021 11:47

Which is why we women should trust our own instincts. There is no evidence to show which men will be safe and which not. Personally I always look for a woman as the chances are it will be a safer experience. I do go to a male osteopath however. Who is actually ok. But this constant gaslighting of women into accepting males in all circumstances is increasing the risk to us. Men choose certain occupations for a reason. See the social worker in Croydon who had CSA on his phone and inadvertently shared with colleagues . No we do not trust you.


mynameisnotkate · 23/08/2021 11:58

I can’t believe they initially suggested that it could be for a legitimate reason such as he wanted to protect himself from false accusations. Surely that doesn’t make filming people without their knowledge legal?! You’d have to make it clear to them you were filming them and why and get their consent to it, and then demonstrate you were deleting it afterwards. How can the police possibly have put this forward as a reasonable explanation?!


PerkingFaintly · 23/08/2021 12:04

NiceGerbil, thank you for saying in that OP pretty much everything I was thinking when reading that report.

(Actually you do that most days. I don't have much energy to post – but oh look, I don't have to: Gerbil spoke my branes!)


OchNoAgain · 23/08/2021 12:12

The police patting themselves on the back is absolutely appalling! WTF?! How utterly crass. They've only found 9 victims... Can't they tie up the booking records with the timings on the cameras? Surely?

And Louise feeling sorry for the perpetrator. I understand where she's coming from as she just views him as pretty pathetic but there is an aspect of being conditioned into feeling sorry for people rather than angry. I feel angry on behalf of every single one of those people on the recordings.


Kendodd · 23/08/2021 12:19

Can you imagine if he hadn't admitted what he'd been doing? The police would have just had a laugh with him about the silly women and wished him a good day.


Kendodd · 23/08/2021 12:22

I wonder if the police showed up with a search warrant or just went round to have a little chat so they could tell the victim that they'd conducted an investigation, and no crime had taken place.


PermanentTemporary · 23/08/2021 12:27

If the police were genuinely worried about men 'having their lives ruined' they should have come down on this like a ton of bricks. It's certainly made me more suspicious of my excellent male sports masseur and less likely to book him again.


NutellaEllaElla · 23/08/2021 12:34

That was so dumb, the police facilitated him to destroy evidence.


NiceGerbil · 23/08/2021 21:42

That's a nice thing to say Perking Smile

OP posts:

TalkingtoLangClegintheDark · 28/08/2021 22:40

Yes to everything on this thread. Just outrageous on so many levels.

And that chart shows a very worrying increase in voyeurism/indecent exposure over recent years - of course we can’t know if that’s down to increased reporting or increased incidence. But it’s sure that the increased opportunities for predators with the increase in mixed sex facilities will do nothing to lessen the incidence of these crimes.

Sister thread over on the other side of FWR, for those who are interested:


TalkingtoLangClegintheDark · 28/08/2021 22:40

Great thread, Gerbil.


MonsignorMirth · 28/08/2021 22:42

Ugh, I hadn't seen this story yet. Bloody well done to that woman!
I don't give any shits any more and wouldn't be afraid to decline a male masseur if I didn't want one. But i understand the pressure to 'be cool' with it all.

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