WHO says countries should seek to "prevent initiation of drinking in women of childbearing age"

[Kinsters]

Draft global alcohol action plan 2022-2030 urges countries to pay ‘appropriate attention to prevention’ of consumption in certain groups. The WHO plan says: 'Appropriate attention should be given to prevention of the initiation of drinking among children and adolescents, prevention of drinking among pregnant women and women of childbearing age' - The Telegraph

www.who.int/publications/m/item/global-action-plan-on-alcohol-1st-draft

It is shocking to me that in this report they mention the indirect negative effect of drinking in women of childbearing age multiple times (ie foetal alcohol syndrome) yet not once do they mention the link between alcohol and male violence. The report does reference violence and interpersonal violence as an indirect harm arising from alcohol consumption. It also acknowledges that the majority of problem drinkers are male. However it's unable to connect these two together and acknowledge that male violence related to alcohol consumption is undoubtedly a huge problem.

The report goes on to give the disturbing recommendation that member states should seek to prevent the initiation of drinking amongst women of childbearing age. As far as I can see there is no recommendation that member states should seek to even reduce the alcohol consumption of men, let alone prevent it all together, this despite the report acknowledging that overwhelmingly those directly negatively impacted by alcohol and those classed as problem drinkers are men!

I guess this is yet another example of men being the default.

They've been doing it to smokers for decades and they've been saying alcohol was next, but no everybody said smokers were disgusting and deserved it.

@vimtosogood

They've been doing it to smokers for decades and they've been saying alcohol was next, but no everybody said smokers were disgusting and deserved it.

I think banning smoking is a very different issue to the suggestion that drinking be prevented in all women of childbearing age...

I have read the document - which is very obviously a first draft and should be open to commentary as part of its consultation process.

I see this 'perfect' advice as being on a par with the theoretically correct position that women who may go on to bear children should not handle raw meat, (infected) cat poo, or a (contaminated) medium such as soil in which there may be cat poo because of the risk of toxoplasmosis.

I absolutely understand the public health reasoning about toxoplasmosis but nobody would argue for a moment that it is a workable proposition that women/girls who might possibly conceive at any point after their menarche through to confirmed menopause should avoid these items - especially given gendered social roles (meant in its correct sense).

www.nhs.uk/conditions/toxoplasmosis/

@Kinsters they've been shutting on smokers for decades, especially pregnant women. Where were the non smokers all this time? Joining in, that's where.

Hmmm. My view is that smoking in certain places is banned. Not the act of smoking. Smokers can smoke - just not in certain places.
I read this alcohol based document to read that a section of society (people not places.)
will be banned from drinking alcohol entirely- not given a choice as to drinking elsewhere.

[quote vimtosogood]@Kinsters they've been shutting on smokers for decades, especially pregnant women. Where were the non smokers all this time? Joining in, that's where.[/quote]
I don't think anyone has a problem with education campaigns to educate pregnant women about the harms of consuming alcohol. I wasn't aware that the smoking bans were focussed on women of childbearing age rather than men? Thats what this issue is here, not the actual proposal to try and reduce alcohol consumption more generally.

@Bargebill19

Hmmm. My view is that smoking in certain places is banned. Not the act of smoking. Smokers can smoke - just not in certain places. I read this alcohol based document to read that a section of society (people not places.) will be banned from drinking alcohol entirely- not given a choice as to drinking elsewhere.

Interesting distinction. I think youre spot on there.

I've never smoked or lived with a smoker - but in third pg despite saying that it was insisted I have the carbon monoxide testing done.

They did say it would pick up any issue with gas applicances - but the boiler and gas hob were all we had and had been checked and DH though it unlikely they'd be an issue without us having indications - not least because we had CO alarms.

It was a high smoking area but did feel like I wasn't being believed but I had many issue with MW team. I also got very fed up with all the dietary advice thown at me by pretty much everyone in every pg.

I understand smoking if frowned upon on but it's not just for women in childbearing years it is across the board.

What concerns me is they’ve equated “women of childbearing age” with “women who might bear children”. These are not the same!

For example:
-Lesbians who never come in contact with sperm
-Asexual women or those who don’t have sex
-Women who use birth control and will 100% have an abortion if they accidentally get pregnant

What they’re talking about is ignoring the fact that women have choices and basically saying every woman 12-50 is a potential brood mare.

@tobermorie….agree, and it’s also very patronising sounding to women who do intend to have children as it’s basically saying that, just in case you get pregnant, you can’t ever have alcohol. As if we can’t be trusted to stop once we find out we are pregnant. I always intended to have kids and stopped alcohol once I found out I was preggers. Also good points about the male factor infertility - no mention of any lifestyle changes for men!

[quote vimtosogood]@Kinsters they've been shutting on smokers for decades, especially pregnant women. Where were the non smokers all this time? Joining in, that's where.[/quote]
I don’t think they’ve ever specifically said “women of child bearing age shouldn’t smoke” which is what this is saying about drinking.
There will obviously be public health campaigns of various types about the harms or smoking and drinking for everyone, and pregnant women are told as well, but this is an idea for basically all women to consider themselves potentially pregnant and act accordingly when it comes to alcohol.

What concerns me is they’ve equated “women of childbearing age” with “women who might bear children”. These are not the same!

I agree - very succinctly put into words what was bother me.

Does anybody actually think they are going to stop with "women of a child bearing age"? And it isn't a ban , it is dissuasion. The ban will come decades later, like it is for tobacco.

I mentioned this nonsense with a circle of online pals. They were all very angry at it. But then one piped up that it was transphobic - presumably because it alluded to secret woman business like possibly getting pregnant.[ Sigh]

@bellinisurge

I mentioned this nonsense with a circle of online pals. They were all very angry at it. But then one piped up that it was transphobic - presumably because it alluded to secret woman business like possibly getting pregnant.[ Sigh]

tbh I was wondering when someone would mention transmen, NB etc. - I'm surprised that WHO hasn't been challenged on this as yet.

Heartened to see this reaction from BPAS
www.bpas.org/about-our-charity/press-office/press-releases/bpas-comment-on-the-world-health-organization-s-draft-global-alcohol-action-plan-2022-2030/?fbclid=IwAR0Wnn3MHyDlMhJS59a0HWT5qMW4YwwClZi-sgdsR0KEm5BCjc2C20siqhE

Good response from them!

Excellent response from BPAS there

I don’t know much about the Chief Executive, but it feels so refreshing to hear a woman in her position talk so passionately about women... and BPAS clearly know the definition of a woman! I know it shouldn’t be surprising, it’s 2021 and all, but too many are not.

Yesssss go BPAS!! The rage in her letter is palpable!

Reading back my last comment, I feel that it reads as I blame women for not reacting to a misogynistic world view. This is a little naive, there are obviously livelihoods and safety at risk the way things are at the minute. I applaud this chief exec for speaking out, it must be quite difficult and it must be a very conscious decision to, especially when you are head of such a public facing organisation. I hope we can support others that do.

That was a good response for BPAS. And yes, all over news reports and social media comments it's 'women', 'women' and oh yes, 'women'.

We're not 'breeders' or 'people who menstruate' when it comes to others who want to control our bodily autonomy are we?

The way I would read this is - if you’re a couple who wants to have children in the next year or two, be mindful of your alcohol consumption, and try your best to not drink too much/go over nhs advised units. The govt should create resources to help people do this - should some people need it.

This could have been a useful piece of information for couples preparing to have children. As it stands they’ve been unnecessarily inflammatory and now a potentially important message is being lost in the process.

As it stands they’ve been unnecessarily inflammatory and now a potentially important message is being lost in the process.

I think it's worse than merely inflammatory. The World Health Organisation - an important international agency fully aware of the dire status of women's reproductive rights in many countries - has with this document declared an opinion that prioritises not only all fetuses over their mothers, but also all potential fetuses over all women and girls of childbearing age.

As an organisation the WHO absolutely should propose policy only based on solid evidence. If that is not available, at the very least it must acknowledge that despite a lack of solid evidence they are recommending a precautionary approach in line with other health issues targeted at a tightly defined, specific group only (i.e. only women who are pregnant).

But they've done neither. They have assumed the right to control women's and girls' bodies on the basis of zero evidence, and it seems, without thinking through the repercussions.

There are countries in this world where women who have miscarried are prosecuted and some even imprisoned for allegedly murdering their unborns.

The WHO has just strengthened those countries' approach to women's reproductive rights.

And all of this despite the fact that the effects of too much alcohol on men has a far greater impact on society as a whole than low level drinking in pregnant women.

@CharlieParley agree.