Friend's children have MH issues that affect our friendship

[Glossie]

I don't know if this is the right place to post this, but I think probably only those with experience of MH issues in the family and friendships will really be able to appreciate the situation.

Three years ago I got talking to Lou at an event I was attending for work. We hit it off. She had recently moved to my city and so we arranged to meet for coffee. We're interested in similar things, we share the same sense of humour and we started to become good friends.

Our lives are very different. I have a long-term partner: Lou was recently divorced after a long marriage. I have no children and she has three young-adult children, two of whom live at home with her. Her 17-yo daughter hasn't attended school for several years, self-harms and is receiving psychiatric support pending diagnosis. Lou tends to bring her with her wherever she goes and so her DD often comes to our meet-ups. Unfortunately DD is so fragile that her needs have dominated a lot of our plans. Things get cancelled or changed at the last minute or DD gets triggered by something and we have to leave the cinema or the cafe or the place we're in. On top of this her son was diagnosed as having Borderline Personality Disorder last year and has given up university and returned to live at home. Inevitably a lot of our conversation and contact has revolved around her children and the various crises they go through. I've been as understanding as I can. Her DS has made several suicide attempts and on each occasion Lou's called me and asked for help to get him to hospital in the early hours of the morning or to sit with her DD while she takes him in. Our friendship is now dominated by her children.

A few weeks ago she was very stressed about something and sent me a long, complex What's App message which I didn't spot for a couple of hours. When I read it I got the wrong end of the stick and so my response wasn't what she'd expected. She messaged back telling me how unhelpful I'd been, then told me that she needed space and blocked me on What's App.

I sent a text explaining my misreading of the message and saying that I could understand that she was stressed and needed some space, hoped things were okay with the children and left it at that. I heard nothing for around six weeks and frankly began to feel quite relieved to be free of all the distress.

Today I was away at a festival when I got a message from her asking me to come to her house urgently. Her son had smashed a window and hurt himself and she needed to get him to hospital for treatment. I called her, explained I wasn't in the area and we had a brief chat about who else she could ask for help.

I've now had another message asking me to meet her and her daughter for coffee and cake on Monday. It's friendly, as if she didn't go silent on me for weeks. She seems to assume that everything's okay and that things can go back to how they were. I don't want to do that.

Has anyone else experienced anything like this? How can you be supportive to a family in this very difficult position without ending up feeling that their needs dominate everything? Is it possible to have a real friendship in these circumstances?

@qwertyqwertyqwertyqwerty

Either be understanding about @Glossie friend allways needing her children with her and them being so entwined in her life etc or ditch the friendship, "

Are you for real?

That's the issue @Glossie is far too accommodating and understanding about her friends family needs etc,

I think 🤔 @Glossie your friend is manipulative User and taking advantage of your generosity of spirit to such an extant,
that your mental health well being will soon be in extreme Crisis in near future,

she knows you are a push over people pleaser type,

Looking after your emotional health is essential
It's not selfish to look after yourself properly

It's called self preservation

Your friend had a grown up temper tantrum cause you were not her 24 oxygen supply support person
Hence the radio 📻 silence overwhelming silence,

Why do you feel the need to be so needed then?

Why have you got such little healthy boundaries to protect yourself from unhealthy dynamics situations and dysfunctional people then?

Whats happened in your life so far and especially in childhood that you allow User manipulative friend to think her needs are much more speacial and precious than your emotional wellbeing health then?

Why didn't you tell her to turn to mental health support services more in school and elsewhere to lean into this more then?

You are not her member of her family at all?

You are responsible for her or her children in any way,
Never have been,
They are not your God children

The fact that mental health services supporting uk is not allways that good

Is not your responsibility

I would simply walk away

How dare she say 😤 you are not helpful you are not a good friend cause you were not there once for her,

Even her own family would struggle find challenging at times to give her and her children the extremely off the scale high needs level of support that you have given,

She should turn to her family or and her children's families more often...

She is like one poster on this mumsnet thread said an arrogant shit of so called friend
It's all me myself and I in that regards of your so called friend...

I had a situation like this with a lady I met at a toddler group when DD was small. I also have a nice stable life and did not really need another friend but I felt I should help her. I guess what is probably not the same is that I don't think we ever had a genuine mutual friendship outside of me being useful to her

There was constant drama and crises. She never had any money and always wanted to 'borrow', I was always giving her lifts, making her meals, letting her use my washing machine or whatever. She was round my house dawn til dusk every day that I wasn't at work which started to really piss my husband off. This was over a number of years.

It was never reciprocated. When I had a miscarriage she was angry that I couldn't give her a lift I had promised and messaged me about letting her down whilst I was lying in bed crying and bleeding.

Her DD had behavioural issues and was removed or sent home from various play groups, nurseries and two schools. Initially I thought she was hard done by and doing her best. Later on I came to see she was a large part of her DDs problems.

As soon as I put some boundaries in for my own sanity she turned on me and went crazy doing silent calls to my house in the night, posting things through my letterbox, made a spurious complaint to the police about me etc etc. It transpired that I was not the only person she had done this to

Once I had extricated myself from the situation I massively regretted how I had got sucked in and all the time, money and emotional energy I wasted. Her DD was ultimately taken into care.

I am not saying your situation is analogous exactly but I guess just wanting to say that when you are in the middle of something, constantly being relied on in a crisis etc it can be hard to have perspective and take a step back. I carried on helping even when it was hugely to my detriment because I thought I was obliged and no-one else would. This was not sensible.

I did not actually ever intend to end the friendship (or whatever it was) I just made it very clear to her in writing (after various more subtle attempts didn't work) exactly what time commitment I could give and what I would no longer do and this resulted in her ending it herself.

I think you do need to put boundaries in. Don't be surprised if that is then the end of the friendship.

I also have another friend who is splitting from her DH, who had had a lot of tragedy in her family life, a physical health issue herself and two of whose DC have ASD, MH issues, self harm, school refusal. I am there to listen to her and I give help where I can lifts to appointments, babysitting, a shoulder to cry on but she also listens to my much more minor dramas, we have things in common and can have fun together, she is more resilient, has other friends and supports and I never get the feeling of being trapped giving more than I am able or not being reciprocated.

Only you can know which kind of situation yours is with Lou

PS I do have loads of other friends who don't have any pain or drama in their lives and I am quite well aware that I do have a bit of a saviour complex which I usually exercise within boundaries at my job!

But I would have to make it very clear that shutting someone down like that is hurtful when you seem to have been a solid support system for a while now.

But I don't feel hurt. I'm an adult. I see someone under immense stress and if they're snappy or angry or difficult I don't take it personally.

I'm going to exit this thread. I wish everyone well.

Am not understanding now @Glossie if you are accepting and supporting of her behaviours and actions and happy to continue to be treated like this without addressing it, what's the point of the thread?
unless it's a reverse and you expected everyone to tell you that the behaviour is fine and you should put up with it,, and you should apologise?

She seems to assume that everything's okay and that things can go back to how they were. I don't want to do that

Not sure if you'll be back, but I will admit to being confused by your thread OP.

Anyway, I hope thing work out for you both.

It almost seems like you're the adult in this relationship and she's the child. She's 'allowed' to be snappy, angry, difficult and block you when she's stressed. She can phone you in the middle of the night to go and save her when she needs you. She can phone you no matter where you are and you run through the people who she could get to help her because you're too far away.

This is all the things I would expect from and would do for my 18 year old.

I don't 'need' more friends, so anyone trying this number on me will get short shrift. I have a nice, relatively uncomplicated, contented sort of life that includes good friends made over many years.

Yes, but where are her other friends and family in this situation, @Glossie ? You’ve only known her for three years so why is she leaning on you so much? I suspect that she may have alienated older friends and family through this type of behavior (the blocking, etc.).

I live in the UK. I thought everyone in here did? I don't know much about the system to be honest but I have three friends who were institutionalised during covid and some subsequently due to schizophrenia. I'm not sure if they voluntarily admitted or if they were hospitalised. A friend of a friend was also institutionalised to her severe anorexia. Again, I've never asked about how she got in

Institutionalised is an odd word to use to mean 'admitted to hospital for treatment' which I assume is what you actually do mean. I mean you don't suggest someone is 'institutionalised' for having diabetes FFS! It betrays a discriminatory attitude to mental illness

If these young people did have schizophrenia or a different mental illness that could benefit from a period of inpatient treatment then I'm sure it would be offered but usually only for a period of a few days to a few months not as an alternative living situation.

In fact the diagnoses mentioned are autism and personality disorder neither of which benefit from generally available inpatient treatment. Outpatient services are available and it appears they have accessed those but there is no quick fix for what are long term conditions that must be managed rather than cured. Many people with borderline or emotionally unstable PD have chronic suicidal thoughts and self harm behaviours for many years that medication or admission does not help and need long term psychotherapy.

Where I do agree with you is that it is unsustainable for Lou to be propping up these two young adults long term and roping OP into that task too. She will be maintaining some of the behaviours and preventing the development of coping strategies by stepping in to rescue them all the time.

You’re not a shit at all, your friend isn’t a friend, she's a self obsessed pain in the arse. Her children aren’t your friends and you’ll never be free of them. You’ve done your best - time to move on.

This is a tough thread to read.

I'd say op she doesn't have capacity to be a friend to you but needs you to be a friend to her. When you weren't helpful she backed away because she didn't need that. But she still needs your help and support.

It doesn't make her a bad person but equally if you don't want this role it doesn't make you a bad person either.

Whatever happened to Be Kind, I wonder.

Is this really the MH board? The psychiatric health system is as broken as the NHS generally. You can't just turn up at the local pyschiatric clinic/ facility and admit yourself or your loved ones voluntarily.

And yes, @Mumoftwinsandasingleton , people from all over the world post on this board.

I have a dear friend who is in a similar situation. And I have tried to keep the parent and the friend separate. So I would try and back away from coming round to help
in emergencies and that might push the children into the right care they need?

Talking therapies are grand- but this all sounds a bit more serious.

But you have been very kind. Your friend really hasn’t appreciated this, and there’s a limit. I don’t know what you expected from posting other than everyone telling you your friend is taking advantage - it doesn’t mean she isn’t as lovely as you say.
No point being snippy with everyone who points this out.