Son heading for another section - devastated

[JimmyGrimble]

My son was sectioned at Christmas 2020 due to extreme psychosis which ended with him punching his dad and us phoning the police. He was away for three months, heavily medicated against his will and is now very anti meds. His MH has been deteriorating to the point where a second section is imminent. He will not comply with home treatment and is becoming more and more violent (not towards people), smashing things up, putting holes in the walls, shouting obscenities at himself, screaming at us. He’s become nocturnal so he’s ranging around our home at night, taking food and leaving it out, breaking glasses and crockery. A couple of times our dogs have alerted us to him standing in our bedroom doorway staring. I know he will hate us for agreeing to a section and I feel so sad for him but we can’t live like this can we? Home treatment team and his MH worker have both told us to ring the police but I’m loath to put him through that again. On the other hand he is unlikely to go compliantly to hospital. It’s so difficult. Anyone with experience of this? What would you do?

I’m so sorry OP. Glad in a way that things escalated and he is now being looked after. You did the right thing.

Have you and your husband got support to help you process it all?

Early intervention are being really good at keeping us informed and checking on us. He’s being transferred to a secure PICU at the other end of the country this afternoon so I’ve just been to take him some things. He’s furious and raging and very angry with everyone, but mainly us.

I’m so sorry. So distressing. He will stabilize from the episode.

Hi @JimmyGrimble similar situation with my son, he's 19 and is settled on meds through a depo. Absolute nitemare over the last three years though and feel there's still a long road ahead. it's a lonely place as a mum and I feel I have no one who understands to talk to it about. Pm me if you want to or feel like you want someone to chat to x

Nothing to add but I am so so sorry for all you’re going through. Heartbreaking and traumatic. Please try and look after yourself.

Ah bless you, that’s so hard.
Are you being kind to yourselves tonight? Comfort telly and a takeaway or similar?

Hello! I know this thread is three years old but wondered how things went for you and your son? We are in an almost identical situation currently with my brother in law. We suspect it’s drug induced psychosis and like your son, he believes he is becoming famous within the music industry, lots of delusions but thinks he’s absolutely fine. We were informed earlier that a bed has been found and that he’ll be placed on a section 2 tomorrow morning, although I’m certain he’ll refuse and they’ll need police intervention. My MIL is so worried and feels like we are all betraying him, but it’s got to the point now where his aggression is getting worse and he will do some serious damage.

Hello!,
wow … three years have passed quickly.
You are absolutely doing the right thing in acting to prevent him from hurting himself or anyone else. He needs help and can’t help himself. And you need respite as you have all probably been on high alert for so long. Once he’s been sectioned you can breathe again.
My son was first sent to Maidstone for a year (we are in the NW and I work full time) and then Colchester. About 18 months ago he was transferred up here and we now see him once or twice a week. He is still under section - three years! And is nearly 28.
He has a diagnosis of paranoid schizophrenia. The treatment he has received has been woeful, not unkind or uncaring, just that you learn that there really IS no treatment. They have cycled him through various antipsychotics, given him leave, withdrawn leave ( he made it from Maidstone to Manchester in just over 5 hours with no money or coat), dangled supported accommodation, withdrawn that when he bought drugs. Finally, three years on, he is beginning to accept his diagnosis and come out the other side. They’ve restarted some leave - going out for coffee, to the shop etc, with a view to moving him into open rehab. It’s been a shocking thing to witness and I wouldn’t wish it on anyone.
I really hope that in your BIL’s case it’s just a one off but please remember that he and you will be safe now.

Hi hope you don't mind me commenting, my DB has paranoid schizophrenia and is now 47. Was first sectioned at 24 I think. That's really good you can see him once or twice a week, family play such an important role in outcomes and recovery.

DB really struggled in those first five years or so - getting the medication right can take time. His sleep was all over the place, he gained a lot of weight and was regularly self medicating with drugs. In the end the best combination was olanzapine which he says helps him sleep, plus an anti depressant.

I think the main things during that time were trying to stop him becoming a heroin addict or end up homeless, its all a bit of a blur, but eventually he went through supported accommodation, into his own flat and manages to live a good life.

The outcome for your DB is really encouraging BlueSkies. My adult DD was also diagnosed last year and it is a constant worry as she doesn't accept her illness.
Good to hear things can and do improve.
I know it was a long time ago for you but im sure posters on here, including me,would welcome any words of wisdom that you can give. Many thanks.

Thank you so much for replying! My BIL is in Colchester at the moment I wonder if it’s the same place? He is directing so much anger towards us all and is refusing to start medication. It’s a constant worry to be honest but there is relief around not having to worry for his or my MIL’s safety at home! I’m sorry it’s been a long hard three years for you and your son, hopefully things are on the up?

My son was at Cygnet but it didn’t really work out because we really couldn’t visit. Yes the anger is difficult to cope with. I’ve been screamed at and called every name but you just need to remember that it’s not them. They’re confused and frightened and unable to get their thoughts straight. If you think about it it must be terrifying not knowing what is real. It’s not easy to deal with though is it?
My son is now quite stable on olazapine so things are looking a bit better. They’re looking at an open ward first and then supported accommodation.
Aquamarine yes the drugs situation is very concerning. At one point my son was getting ketamine delivered (by persons unknown) to the secure ward … we know he’s clean now but the temptation to get ‘out of your head’ must be so great. It’s really lovely to hear positive stories like yours though. It is such a nasty disease.

Sorry Aquamarine I think I meant blue skies
Hello and welcome though. The not accepting the illness is art of the diagnosis I’m afraid. At some point though, the penny will drop and she’ll realise. My son will happily admit he’s a ‘para schiz’ now. The next steps for him is to accept his responsibility for keeping himself well. It’s a long road!

I love you have they looked at getting him on a depot injection. I think legally, if held under section, they cannot refuse meds.

Oh I long for the day when my DD realises that she has been ill and sees that we have been supporting her. Unfortunately, she still believes that we were drugging her in some sort of government experiment. So distressing for everyone involved. She said I was a horrible person and terrible parent for allowing it to happen and denying it happened to Dr's to make her appear psychotic. I don't mind saying that I have cried so much, I have no tears left. Jimmy,
I am pleased that your DS is more stable and now has insight. Must be a great relief for you.

OP, if you are happy to answer, please can you tell me if your DS now knows that what he used to believe is not true and was his illness?
DD's team has said that she might always believe that she WAS spied on and drugged. although it has now stopped.

Oh I hear you. I’ve been told I’m a terrible mother, that he has never been happy, that I never cared about him, never supported him etc. I think at the early stages they’re just casting about for a reason, external to them, why it’s happening and unfortunately they blame the closest people to them. My son refuses to allow me to attend his case meetings and reviews so still blames me on some level. I’ve been having therapy and I’ve (almost) stopped beating myself up. Mothers always feel responsible.

Jimmy, our posts crossed there. I think you are right that they're just looking for a reason for what they believe is going on.
We'll just need to hang on in there. I also should look into therapy but not sure where to start looking.

I think he does but the brain is a wonderful thing. I think he’s genuinely forgotten a lot of it. He will also refer to his ‘other me’ or ‘that guy’. If I mention things such as when he got up on Christmas morning and broke every piece of crockery and glassware in my kitchen he looks a bit shamed. I don’t tend to bring it up with him though because it causes him discomfort. I believe he now knows he’s a) not about to embark on a world tour or b) an actor working undercover in the hospital.
He was talking to people who weren’t there and getting messages via the tv and Alexa and he has said he knows that wasn’t true. I think they do genuinely forget though. It seems to be too much to accept the things they did and said.

I got mine through work as I’m a teacher. If you are with a Mental Health Team there’s also Family Therapy that they can refer you for. It’s really, really hard coping when someone you love is accusing you, attacking you and calling you a liar. It’s really helped me talking it through with someone with no skin in the game. It’s helped me see that I tried really hard to get him help but in the end the only thing we could do was phone the police. Sometimes you really do need to look after yourself as well as them.

Thanks for sharing Jimmy & other posters. It is really helpful to hear other families experiences especially when the outcome is positive.
If our situation improves, I will post an update. It may help someone in the future.

You’re welcome. I hope things improve for you and DD but remember to take care of yourself too.

@Aquamarine25 im so sorry you’re having to experience this also. How old is your daughter? @JimmyGrimble We are now at the stage where we are all unable to find out via the ward (cygnet) what’s going on for my BIL. He is beyond angry with us and feels betrayed. My husband (his brother) thought he’d feel relief once this was sorted but he seems really anxious and on edge? BIL spoke briefly to their mum a couple of days ago, lots of hate towards her and also said that ‘as soon as he’s out he’ll be taking drugs again no one will stop me’. Praying that the meds will work for him…

Hi Iloveyou,
I am so sorry that your family is going through this too. My daughter is 26 and developed psychosis out of the blue 18 months ago. She was sectioned for a month for refusing meds and came out of hospital angry and with no insight that she was ill. She has had no symptoms for about a year but still firmly believes that drugging her did happen. She has a good degree but feels that she cannot move on until she gets 'answers' as to why she was drugged & monitored.
All very stressful & upsetting.
I hope your BIL finds meds that help him, I believe that the majority of people eventually do but it can take time to find the right ones.

Yes Iloveyou anger is really common in the first phase after section. Have they established him on meds? If it’s a first section or a section after long remission they usually go in a bit heavy handed on the anti psychotics (in my experience) then monitor to see how he reacts. Our son was furious during his first section. I remember visiting on Christmas Day with all his favourite Christmas dinner food and a bag of presents. He had one question: ‘Are you taking me home?’ And when we explained we couldn’t he grabbed the food and his gifts, shouted ‘fuck off then’ and went back to the ward. His second one was much more dramatic- home treatment team attended with police and he had a kitchen knife (he said he thought his Dad was in danger). The police tasered him three times and he got up and ran away. I went to see him before he went to Cygnet at Maidstone and he was like the kid in The Exorcist, trying to get at me through a glass screen.
His improvement in the past three months has been dramatic though. Staff said they were really shocked when he started talking, asking how they were, being polite and kind. Because under it all he is lovely, lovely boy.
We found Cygnet to be very hot and miss with communication although they were straight on the phone every time he escaped! We complained after a member of staff said they would have to ‘break him and put him back together again’ … they were a bit better after that. Be aware though that your BIL may have told them not to share details with you (they often do this because they feel powerless). Drugs and alcohol therapy is available but they have to be open to it (and it doesn’t sound like your BIL is). We’ve found both with Cygnet and NHS they were keen to medicate but not so forthcoming with other therapies.
Aquamarine it sounds like your DD could do with talking therapy and a team meeting for debrief around her section. Bless her, she probably can’t even remember properly and her mind is filling in the blanks. Paranoia means that they go for the worst possible explanation.