Is this social anxiety and can it ever get better?

[pipnchops]

I'm sorry if this is not the appropriate place to post this but I just wondered whether anyone has any coping strategies they can suggest for me to deal with what I think is a form of social anxiety.

So, outwardly I think I give across the impression of being quite intelligent and friendly but I have literally zero wit or common sense. I say the most stupid things to people and then beat myself up afterwards for ages and think of things I wish I'd said instead or just wish I hadn't spoken at all. I often don't realise when people are making a joke or being sarcastic and I take them seriously. I really beat myself up over things and overthink every interaction I have with anybody.

Equally on social media and what's app groups, whenever I make a comment I totally obsess over it thinking I've said something stupid. I get really upset and often end up deleting things I've said if I can. I'm sure to feel like it once I hit post on this!

Anyone else felt /feel like this and how do you cope? I feel like my choice is either to hide away from interactions with other people or grow a thicker skin. I don't want to do the former and I don't know how to even start doing the latter.

It sounds like rejection sensitive dysphoria. It sounds like you are beating yourself up but I think maybe just be kinder to yourself. What would you say to a friend if they felt like you do?

I feel this way a lot too. I feel like I go our of my way to make others not feel this way which doesn't help...no idea how to stop it but you aren't alone

I also get this and just read a thread here, something like ‘what is the worst thing about yourself?’, and there are loads of posters saying they overthink in this way. I found it reassuring as I often think of everyone else as perfectly-functioning adults, and myself as the anomaly. It highlights how the other person may also be considering their own interactions more than yours.

Try to remember that worry is a big time and energy waster, it will not change the outcome. So distract yourself from dissecting earlier conversations. A few stupid comments don’t make you a bad person and you have probably intensified how bad the comment was purely by overthinking. The others probably never gave it a second thought. ( though I know these things can be hard to remember in the moment)

Wow thank you for your reply, I'd never heard of that and reading up about it, it does sound like what I'm experiencing. Although I'm now confused, does that mean I have ADHD? And it seems like the only solution is medication which scares me. But the fact it says that if the medication works it can be life changing, maybe it's worth exploring.

I'm so sick of living this half life where I know I'm not doing everything I'm capable of and making deep friendships because of fear of criticism or rejection. I push people away because its just too exhausting trying to not say stupid things all the time and when I inevitably do say or do something wrong I just beat myself up so badly about it.

What would I say to a friend if they felt like I do? I'd tell them that people are far more worried about what they're saying to care what you said. That they won't remember what you said anyway, it'll be forgotten the next minute. I tell myself this to calm myself down. And the feeling does come and go fairly quickly, which I think one of the articles said. I'll feel wretched immediately after the encounter and then over time it fades into insignificance, until I next talk to someone and start the cycle again. I'd like to think it's not something I have to live with forever though.

I felt EXACTLY this way for about 5 years and it was debilitating. I had CBT which made a huge difference. Then some time later when I was ready I had psychotherapy including EFT (emotionally focused therapy) and was much better.
Time was also a big factor.
Yes it can get better. But you do need to do the things to work it through and get beyond it. The initial CBT rapidly made life much more liveable. After that it was a slow burn to get truly better. I still have to manage it occasionally.
I didn't know which therapist I needed. I mentioned it to GP when I wasn't coping and it went from there.
Please please get off social media if it makes you feel this way. It isn't serving you well (stay on MB tho obvs )

Immediate coping strategies? Try practicing mindfulness (personally I like Headspace, great for learning from scratch and absolutely brilliant targeted courses, defo worth a few quid), and you can use mindfulness breathing when in a real world situation to cope with the unwanted thoughts and feelings.
And be kind to yourself. Without locking yourself away, try to Avoid things that set you off, and do more of the things that nourish or restore you. Do you know what those things are?
Good luck

Oh wow @cantbelievelife I do exactly the same and thanks also for your reassurance @bobbilyknob I really appreciate it.

@neverRTFT thank you for your great advice, I will check out headspace and I'm considering therapy so it's good to know what sort would be helpful. The problem I find is that having a really good social encounter restores me, I'm literally buzzing after a meet up with close friends and family. These are people who know me well and know that I'm a bit ditsy and say stupid things without thinking and they are used to painfully explaining punchlines to me and seem to love that about me. They all live just a bit too far away to meet up regularly though and covid isn't helping.

I feel like that a lot of the time, overthinking interactions, worrying about saying the wrong the thing and people not liking me etc, even down to the deleting things off social media worrying about how I come across.
It's rejection sensitive dysphoria in my case, been recently diagnosed with Adhd and started treatment. Although I'm sure there are lots of different reasons for feeling that way.

Thanks @Whatayear2020, I've been doing some reading about ADHD and I do have some of the characteristics and have had them since childhood (daydreaming, forgetfulness and I'm very fidgety). I am a massive people pleaser and think if I do have ADHD I have been able to control it in such a way that its not been a problem for me. I don't know whether to try and find out if I've got it, what would this achieve and where do I go from here? Do I go to a doctor and ask? And what would be the benefits of me doing this? It's really the rejection sensitive dysphoria that is causing me a problem.

I feel like if I could just not care what other people think of me then my life would be a thousand times more bearable.

You have really described my life. In my first CBT session, the therapist gave me the scenario that I see a friend in the street, wave and she doesn’t wave back. How do I respond? I told her that I would be trying to remember our last interactions and work out what I had done upset her and how I could make it up to her. I would worry about it obsessively until I saw her again and got to make things right. I talked about this scenario with a friend. In the same situation, she said simply “I would think she hadn’t seen me.” This is how I found out at the age of 40 I have anxiety, because I have done this my whole life. I found CBT quite helpful. But not a cure. I found that Chimp Paradox book to be useful also.

Thanks @Spudina I would definitely be like you in that situation, I'd really try and think they hadn't seen me but I'd be going over and over it for ages after the event and get myself really upset. I will look into CBT and the chimp paradox, off to Google that now! Thanks, it's really helped me to post on here and everyone has been so kind, phew!

I'm 40 recently diagnosed ADHD and Autism, I poo pooed the Autism diagnosis because I thought that meant I had to be a genius at something.
ADHD do you get bored easily? Struggle to finish things?
Autism is recognised by (among other things) I often don't realise when people are making a joke or being sarcastic and I take them seriously this is an Autism rather than ADHD trait. Do you obsess about things? (I said no but actually I do get 'interests' usually people/public figures that I focus on for days, weeks) Do you ever get the feeling you are responsible for an awkward silence, but not really care or notice?

It's the 'buzz' you describe when socialising goes well and the things you 'get wrong' (but don't stress too much about) or innapropriate comments that you don't realise until someone points it out, that may be a trait of ADHD.

Are you tidy? organised? Punctual? or not?

After reading up on it, both fit me perfectly (but felt crap to acknowledge). Apparently most people DO NOT have this level of thought about it and social anxiety involves NOT saying too much and physical symptoms when you are thinking about or taking part in social interactions.

Not 'getting' sarcasm/jokes and not feeling stupid screams Autism though.

That's really interesting @lilmishap. I am very rarely bored, I can always find something to do. I definitely do not struggle to finish things, quite the oppisite, I get very agitated if I can't finish something I have started or if I'm interrupted mid task (probably the thing I have struggled with most as a parent of young children to be honest!). I am tidy, punctual and organised. I do obsess over things, I get obsessed with tv programmes, books, films, I watch and read the same thing over and over. I am definitely responsible for a fair few awkward silences but I do really care about it, I get paralysed by it and can't think of anything to say, I am totally rubbish at small talk. When I read about ADHD I did feel there were a lot of things that didn't fit with me, I may be on the autistic spectrum, isn't everyone though? It's really interesting and strangely comforting to think there might be a reason for the way I feel and more importantly a way to address it and start living a fuller life, so this is definitely something I plan to explore with some kind of professional.

I've got an example of something I'm obsessing over right now, I wonder if anyone can tell me what I could have done better or if I'm worrying about nothing...

There's a mum on the school run who is lovely, our DC are in the same class, I've known her a while as we took our DC to the same playgroup. Despite knowing her a long time I have never been able to move beyond being casual acquaintances. This is probably why...

Standing next to each other waiting for our children to come out of school, we say hi to each other and she asks if I'm alright, as in a greeting kind of way not necessarily wanting to know if I'm alright IYSWIM. I say yes and ask her back, she says yes she's alright. Awkward silence as I try to think of something else to say, eventually I ask if she's ready for Christmas (I would definitely get that buzzing thing sounding all the time if I was on QI as I always say the most generic and obvious things!) she tells me she is nearly there and asks me back.

I then ask if she's going to be at home for Christmas. She says yes but that her exDH (recently split up) is picking the DC up and taking them to his in the afternoon.

I feel really sad about this as can't imagine how hard this must be for her so I try to make her feel better by saying "well you can really let your hair down on Christmas night" to which she replies that she can't as she has to work the next day.

Cue me feeling really awkward and awful! She then adds that she can let her hair down on boxing day night instead and I laugh and say that's good but by this point I just want the ground to swallow me up and I'm wishing I just hadn't said anything! She then turns away and starts talking to someone else.

This is a classic example, it happens every time I try and talk to people on the school run. Sometimes I just try not make eye contact with anyone for fear of saying something stupid but then I just want to cry because I feel so unfriendly so it's like I can't win.

So many things you mention are signs of autism - obsessing, not liking to be interrupted, taking things literally, not understanding sarcasm, anxiety. Might be worth looking into.

I was diagnosed at 40. Still struggling with anxiety so no huge tips from me!

Thanks @bitheby I will look into it more for sure. I do get sarcasm but just too late, I realise after I've responded that the person was joking or being sarcastic. Don't know if that makes a difference. I'm sorry you're struggling too. Do you mind me asking how you got a diagnosis?

@pipnchops

I've got an example of something I'm obsessing over right now, I wonder if anyone can tell me what I could have done better or if I'm worrying about nothing...

There's a mum on the school run who is lovely, our DC are in the same class, I've known her a while as we took our DC to the same playgroup. Despite knowing her a long time I have never been able to move beyond being casual acquaintances. This is probably why...

Standing next to each other waiting for our children to come out of school, we say hi to each other and she asks if I'm alright, as in a greeting kind of way not necessarily wanting to know if I'm alright IYSWIM. I say yes and ask her back, she says yes she's alright. Awkward silence as I try to think of something else to say, eventually I ask if she's ready for Christmas (I would definitely get that buzzing thing sounding all the time if I was on QI as I always say the most generic and obvious things!) she tells me she is nearly there and asks me back.

I then ask if she's going to be at home for Christmas. She says yes but that her exDH (recently split up) is picking the DC up and taking them to his in the afternoon.

I feel really sad about this as can't imagine how hard this must be for her so I try to make her feel better by saying "well you can really let your hair down on Christmas night" to which she replies that she can't as she has to work the next day.

Cue me feeling really awkward and awful! She then adds that she can let her hair down on boxing day night instead and I laugh and say that's good but by this point I just want the ground to swallow me up and I'm wishing I just hadn't said anything! She then turns away and starts talking to someone else.

This is a classic example, it happens every time I try and talk to people on the school run. Sometimes I just try not make eye contact with anyone for fear of saying something stupid but then I just want to cry because I feel so unfriendly so it's like I can't win.

I would be exactly the same in this situation! What is funny though, is as an observer reading that, it is perfectly fine and you were friendly and didn't say anything "wrong". So it shows you how it can be so built up in your head at times.

I agree CBT and mindfulness especially really helped me. Recommend. Good luck!

I have had severe social phobia since my teens. I have never been in a relationship. Don't have many friends and can barely leave the house. Don't end up like me, try and introduce positive influences such as therapy and anything else that has a chance to help improve how you feel. Embrace every therapy that is recommend with an open mind. I know it is blooming hard though! You can do this!

I tried CBT but it didn't work for me. But counselling and talking helped a little; it at least made me mellow out a bit. And it was actually my penfriend (who has ASD) that introduced to mindfulness. Mindfullness helps me a lot day to day to not go completely off the rails at times.

There is always hope to improve things. All the best :)

I mostly struggled once I got to work. I went to Oxbridge, did very well academically and then got into work and struggled. Spent years crashing with anxiety, stress and burnout punctuated by periods of doing well. Got to my 30s and worried I had bipolar disorder because of the apparent ups and downs.

Got into mental health services and had a tentative diagnosis but after a few more years I worked out for myself that autism was a much better fit. Few more years on a waiting list and got the diagnosis.

Am mostly gutted because I wasted my fertile years thinking I was mentally ill and shouldn't have children and am now desperately trying to conceive in my 40s. If I could change anything, I would want an earlier diagnosis to avoid all of that.

In that conversation you describe with the school mum, have you tried thinking about her side of the conversation?
It seems to me that you’re the one tackling the awkward silences, and I don’t honestly think there’s anything wrong with what you said.
If you said the exact same words with someone a bit chattier that would have been fine. You can only take responsibility for half of the conversation!

People say unfortunate things all the time and it’s ok. Generally it gets swallowed up in other social signals. If you get the impression that someone means well, and isn’t deliberately goady, these things get glossed over. A lot of social interaction is about hearing what people mean rather than what they actually say. You did it when you interpreted her asking if you’re alright to be a greeting rather than a request for health information or a concern for your immediate wellbeing.

Not being able to get past the point of casual acquaintance on the school run is also very normal.

What I’m trying to say is that your issue is most likely the repetitive thought patterns about what you’ve said rather than what you’ve actually said. If you can get to a point of accepting that, tackling the obsessive thoughts will be simpler.

I always thought my family were joking when they said I could bring an awkward silence to any conversation, they weren't. I have no idea how I manage it either, I say the 'normal' things but then the silence happens and I'm aware that my "what am I supposed to say now" moment has caused the other person to have their own "What should I say now" moment, cue the silence.

I also find myself asking really generic questions and then I overthink the answer when the same question is repeated back so I come across as unnatural, no matter how hard I try I just can't make a response sound 'natural'. Even if I get the words right.

I maybe used the wrong words to describe not caring about awkward silences in my last post, I tend to front them out and just stand fidgeting in silence until the other party make their excuses because I know I'll make it worse if I try to undo any damage....but I have ADHD as well and everything about your posts and updates seems more autism than ADHD.

A lot of my assessment was about being interrupted while involved in A task/can I return to the task and multitasking and being distracted etc.

No everybody is not on the spectrum, everybody has moments of overthinking, 'missing' a joke and obsessive thoughts but that's not the same as the myriad of things Autism affects, a lot of it I'm still struggling to accept as Autism because it's just 'me' and it's bits of me that I thought were unique or secret (like my ability to get lost in my thoughts and my dislike of brightness). It's a shock to be honest, but also starting to feel like a relief after a period of feeling like I'd been roundhoused.

I tend to do this too. I can beat myself up over embarrassing incidents or interactions I've had 20 years ago! I found mindfulness helps and have started labelling the thoughts so if I'm obsessing over something I literally say to myself (in my head if others are around) in quite a light, humourous tone, "there you go obsessing about stuff from the past again." It really helps.