Depression...can it make someone change?

[SlappyQueen]

My lovely husband of 9 years has been diagnosed as depressed after a long period of extreme stress. He acted like a very different person. Was no longer loving, said some really cold things, didn't want to be with the kids, and even said he wasn't sure if he loved me and wanted to be alone for a while.

I'm finding it hard not to take it personally...has anyone been through this, and what insight can you offer me to how he is feeling? I'm torn between being really angry with him and wanting to help him but I can't understand if this is depression or if our marriage is over?

A lot of people with depression tend to "self medicate" with alcohol which is really not the way to go.....as you end up with 2 problems, a drink problem and a mental health problem. I'm not surprised he hates going to work and it's a wonder that he manages to get there at all. Mornings can often be the worst time for sufferers (certainly is the case with me) Do you know if anyone at work has noticed the changes in him, and is he carrying out his work ok or not.

Did he get medical help for the severe head injury as this could well be the cause of his changed mood and depression. Did he have CT scans to assess the extent of the injury. Does the GP who prescribed the meds know about the head injury - I would have thought so. Is he not under review after being prescribed the meds, as normally the GP sees patients within 2 weeks of the first prescription.

I think that most men find it hard to talk about their emotions and tend to "bottle them up" whereas I think as women we are more likely to confide in a relative or close friend about how we are feeling. I actually feel sorry for men in this position as they sort of "build the bars" of their own prison.

I think MLL has good advice.

Please try to keep at the front of your mind that your DH is ill not bad or no longer cares about you. It's so difficult with mental health issues because there is nothing to see - no plaster cast, or barking cough or other signs of physical illness which tend to elicit sympathy. Mental illness is hidden away deep in the neurotransmitters and synapses of the brain and so cannot be seen. The only outward sign is the changed behaviour of the sufferer.

Little is know amongst medics about brain disorder, as it is the most complex organ in the body and when it malfunctions the manifestations can be horrendous. You only have to think of people with psychotic illnesses (which mean they are out of touch with reality) and dementia patients to see how brain disorder of some kind can change the personality of the sufferer.

Hope the weekend goes well...........and keep posting if you need to.

I see you are in good hands OP with the lovely NanaNina she is a very wise lady :)

With regards to "happy pills" would your DH be reticent to take insulin if he were diabetic? or anti-biotics if he had an infection. He probably doesn't think he is "ill" because the depression is a result of prolonged stress - maybe tell him how it works? When we are stressed our seretonin system goes off kilter and we end up producing less seretonin, conversely to what we need. There are two sets of cells involved - ones that produce the seretonin, and then ones that use it. The cells that produce seretonin release it into the space between them and the cells that need it, the cells that use it take it up via receptors specific for seretonin. Also, and importantly, the cells producing it have something call Re-uptake receptors that mop up seretonin that is not taken up up by the other cells. Another important point is that if the body isn't utilising the seretonin properly the cells that need it don't produce as many receptors and therefore don't take up so much, this means more is mopped up, then a signal is sent to say that less is needed. So the body is thinking that A it is producing too much seretonin and ends up producing even less - its like a vicious circle. This is brought on by situational stress as well as mental illnesses. Some of the ADs (SSRIs) work by stopping the re-uptake receptors from mopping up the unused seretonin - which means the cells that need it, sense more seretonin, produce more receptors and the message is sent - "hey! we need more seretonin down here" and more is produced. In the long term, this should rebalance things and hopefully he should feel better. So they basically help the body to use the "happy hormones" that it produces to help with mood and feelings of anxiety. So they most certainly do not artificially make you happy - it just stops you from sinking further and furhter in - it helped me to think of it physically. I wouldn't sit at home with a bad back whining that i didn't want to be weak and rely on medication, i'd get my arse down the doctors from some full on pain meds - just like your DH would, so he could get on with life. This is the attitude he needs to take to the medication. They wont take his problems away, he still has to work through his feelings but they will put him in the mind-state that he is able to do this.

As to whether people with depression change, absolutely - I remember when i was very ill but undiagnosed and my DP said to me "you have changed, you are not the person I love any more" not that he didn't love me but that he felt that person had gone. It was very hard for him and he probably should have sought help too, but we got through it and he now understands better when i am not well. I did get better, the ADs worked, had a knock back this year but thanks to ADs and the support i get on here i am doing much better.

The head injury needs to be discussed with the gp if it hasn't been already in relation to the changes in your dh. Like Nina said, he should be going back for a review with the gp after a couple of weeks after being prescribed ads.

Is it possible for him to get signed off work for a while? Here's a link to the HSE site re: responsibilities of employer and employee in this situation. It will be one less thing to deal with if the gp will sign him off. Maybe you could phrase it something like having a break from work which is contributing to his stress rather than a break from his family who can offer him support?

The drinking is an issue. It will exacerbate the depression, not help. It is very important that he does not drink if he does start to take the antidepressants - there are different sorts but some can induce some very unpleasant side effects if taken while drinking. Bitter experience. My advice on this front would be don't argue or pressurise, but be calm and keep providing hard facts and information. Do you think you could get him to have a look at the MIND website with you? There is a section on everyday living you could look at as a start - might be less threatening than talking about counselling and ads. Here's a link to it.

NanaNina His drinking is the only thing we argued about really. He drank to excess every time we went out. To oblivion really. I should have seen this was a sign, but when I asked him if he was unhappy he said he wasn't. With the head injury he just got stitched back up again and had a very long time off work because his concussion was so severe. They never did a CT scan. Thank you so much for your wise words. They have been such a comfort. I still find it hard to believe myself that my beautiful, strong, calm husband has been taken over like this.

LEMoncehadacatcalledSANTA Thank you for this bit of science. When he is calm over the weekend I will get him to read this post. It will help him enormously to understand that it is not weakness but an illness. I feel exactly like your DP....like my husband is gone!

MostlyLovingLurchers Yes, I will get him to discuss the head injury with the GP . it never even occurred to me until last night, but this all did begin at exactly the same time. It never occurred to me to get him signed off for a while...he's got a very stressful job where even getting his actual holiday entitlement is difficult. Last year he had 10 days unused because he just could not get the time off. the situation he is in is madness. To be honest, I am a bit unsure about getting him on the meds if he has to stop drinking. I have never been able to egt him to stop drinking. He's very stubborn.

I read over the MIND website and it was very helpful. All I will do for this weekend is to get hi to have a really relaxing time in the spa, some romantic dinners and no pressure. He says it's the first time he's felt "happy" for weeks. the only trouble is that I feel like I love him very much but am also furiously angry and desperately hurt. It's not very easy on me either :( Will try and keep those feelings to myself and not give him any guilt over the hurt he's caused us.

I am learning what sickness and in health really means here!

I don't know if everyone else will agree with this but, while obviously not laying a guilt trip on him, i'm not sure you need to keep how this is making you feel from him. It is important to not blame him for his behaviour, but it is still his responsibility to seek treatment. He may not realise how serious things are if you shield him from the impact his illness is having on you and your family. I think you can be understanding but firm about the need for him to seek help and engage with it. You need to look after yourself too, and that means there needs to be boundaries as to what you can and can't cope with. Don't rule out getting some help for yourself if you need to - there is support out there if you want it. I hope a bit of time out and relaxation does you both good this weekend.

Absolutely agree MLL and I think the drink problem needs to be addressed and some steps made to overcome it - Aquarius are very good for problem drinking and they are in most geographical areas. The person does have to show motivation that they want to get this problem sorted or they won't take you on.

I think SQ you need to keep the balance (or walk the tightrope!) between supporting your DH and finding out as much as you can about depression and the effects it has on sufferers and on those who are supporting. I think the tipping points need to be a) that he accepts that his drinking is a problem and shows motivation to get help with this an b) starts taking the meds.

And YES you need to look after yourself too.

Thank you all so much for the advice. With it I was able to convince him to start the ADs and he has an appointment for therapy which he seems really positive about and believes he needs. He is also going to stop drinking.

I do have some more questions though in how to best get him back to me and if anyone who has been depressed can help answer I'd be so grateful.

When he saw me after two weeks apart he said he looked at me and knew in an instant that he did still love me as much as always and had never stopped. He also said he had missed me a lot but hadn't realised it until he saw me. He was sweet, loving, always touching me, romantic and over the weekend he really softened and relaxed and said it was the first time he'd felt really happy for weeks. He said he was completely sure he wanted to make things work and talked lots and lots to me and it was all really fab.

Unfortunately, since he left, he's distanced again a bit. He is still texting and calling (he has been sobbing on the phone and says he doesn't know why) but he's also said he wants a bit of space for a few days.

I'm really worried he's going to disconnect from me again. What is the best way to keep connected to him if he says he wants space?

I am finding this all so confusing as it's absolutely nothing like my DH. I want to let him know I love him, but also don;t want to drive him away with pressure.

So glad the weekend went so well SQ and you and your DH were able to emotionally connect as well as be physically together.

The thing about depression is that it fluctuates, sometimes we are fine and we can be the person we were before the depression took hold but then for no apparent reason the black clouds will descend and we will feel flat and sad and empty and want to cry, and this is very frustrating and difficult for people to understand because we don't understand these fluctuations ourselves.

I'm wondering how you are going to know if he is taking the ADs as I think that is the most important thing, and cutting back on drinking. Does he have plans in place for how he is going to cut back. I'm just a bit concerned that if he has been drinking too much for a long time he may well want to cut back (or stop altogether) but might find it too difficult. I think if the therapy can help with the drinking then it's a good idea, but usually people need meds to lift their mood before they are able to access therapy.

It sounds like he was so relieved to feel well at the weekend that he was ready to agree to anything to make you happy, but I think you need some plan between you to ensure he does take the meds and controls his drinking, as otherwise I think it just might not happen. Maybe I'm being too cynical I don't know.

It's not surprising that he has disconnected a bit now, as he is obviously feeling down again, hence the sobbing on the phone. Does crying help lift his mood do you know - I ask because this usually helps me when depression hits me. I have been sobbing for an hour or so today and my DP who is used to this just holds me and I then feel a sense of relief. It may not be the same for your DH - bouts of crying are very much a symptom of depression and he really needs to start those meds.

I think the thing about wanting space is not so much pushing you away but is more pulling himself away from you. Maybe he doesn't want you to see him when his mood is very low - maybe he is ashamed of you seeing him like this (I will only let very few people see me when I am in a very depressed mood) I'm not sure, but it is very natural for us to want to withdraw when we are depressed. Have you talked to him about this need to be on his own. If not, I think you should, as there will likely be a reason for this. You need to be "there" for him and not put too much pressure on him - listen and re-assure him that he will get better, but you must also ensure as far as you can that he is taking the meds, and keeping his drinking to a minimum. Maybe you have to be assertive and tell him that you need to monitor this and this would mean you visiting him in his flat on a frequent basis.

I don't think there is any possibility at all that you are going to drive your DH away - on the contrary it seems he is very emotionally dependent upon you, as he phones you and texts you and even doing this is difficult when our mood is very low and we can only reach out to those we love and who we know love us back.

SO it's like walking a tightrope for you I know between being supportive but at the same time being assertive about the meds and the drinking. Not an easy task but please don't shy away from this on the basis that you will drive him away because I'm sure you won't.

Mine is still denying depression, despite the doctors word. He had times over Christmas when he was lovely and times when he was not. He bought me flowers one day "because you did a nice thing for someone" (my favourite flowers) and the next day said again he didn't think the feelings were coming back. Next day we had a lovely family day, the like we have not had for ages. The next day he locks himself away in the bedroom lying on his back staring I to space listening to morose music!

I have suggested he goes to his mums but he won't. He wants to feel for me but can't. He has been stressed for two years or more, ending up in hospital twice and on high blood pressure tablets.

It all started when two people went off long term sick at his work and he is having to cover for them - up until then he blamed work, now suddenly it is all me, home and everything to do with home - he does not connect well with DS at the moment, which is a real change.

OP it is so hard isn't it. I am beginning to feel distant from him and that is a whole new set of problems!

NanaNina thank you so much! He started the ADs today and sent me a lovely text to say he loved me and to thank me for supporting him. He is definitely off the drink and has made an appointment for the therapy. One thing he'd never do is lie to me so I'll keep track of him. i think he really wants to get better.

I am so glad you said it fluctuates. I seem to get days or hours or him calling me and texting me seeming like his old self and then suddenly he is a mess or very withdrawn again. It's exactly like walking a tightrope.

Broken Oh, I know. One of my biggest fears was always that DH would get dementia or alzheimers when we grew older. My worst fear was always him not knowing me as we have always been as close as two people can ever be. This viscous disease seems to work in a similar way and although I am supporting him I feel lost without my DH. He's always been my rock, my best friend and he's never (not once!) ever let me down or not been there for me.

when I was with my DH he had moments of looking at me and telling me so sweetly that he loved me, and then a few hours later you could almost physically see the cloud come over him...his face went saggy, his eyes went distant. I asked him what it was like and he said it was like he knew his feelings were there underneath but it was like a mobile phone with no reception and he could not access them fully.

Strangely we experiences the exact same circumstances, in that my DH had colleagues laid off and was picking up the slack. He also blamed me. It was incredibly hurtful.

The worst part of all of it of course is having someone you love sick and you are unable to help them because they don't want you. Myself and DH have such a strong bond that I know I have been able to reach him but I shudder to think how we would have coped with this if we had any other issues in our marriage. it is the hardest thing we have ever been through (and we have been through a lot!)

I wonder though when it is all over and he is back (hopefully :() whether or not I will be able to move on from the horrible things he has said and done. It really scares me that it will be difficult to return to the wonderful relationship we both had because I no longer feel stable, secure or trusting and that is awful.

Please keep heart Broken. If you love your husband you have to keep faith in him. I know how hard and painful it is and my hart goes out to you. I hope both our DH's find their way back to us. I am so glad I found this forum!

You know what? I had my breakdown after one of my team left (on long term sick with (you guessed it) depression) and had to deal with his workload on top of my own. With hindsight though, that was what tipped me into a crisis, but the problems had really been building long before that, and the causes were more deep seated than work issues. It may be true for both of your dh's too. I think because work pressure can be so relentless it is often the straw that breaks the already overburdened camel's back.

I can't add much to Nina's brilliant advice but just wanted to say something about the fluctuations. For me, i would have days when i could get it all together and do normal stuff, go out, see people, but it always came at a cost. The next few days i would be so drained and exhausted that it felt like one step forward 3 steps back, and i would feel even more like a disconnected shell. I would have to retreat again. It must be hard to see a glimmer of the old person and then lose it again so quickly but it could be this pattern that is happening.

I'm glad you had a good weekend SQ and that your dh is taking steps. Re the horrible things he has said or done, remember to blame the illness rather than him if you can. I hope your dh will access the help that is there for him too BPH - you can't make him, but try to support and inform without pressuring if you can.

Thanks MLL. I helps to know that work pressure was the straw that broke the camel's back for you. I know my DH was accustomed to having quite a god work life and finishing bang on 6pm, and over the 4 months before he left us it had changed completely to him bringing home work every night and hammering away till midnight only to find he never finished anyway.

Your words on the fluctuations help me too. We were so connected over the weekend and now he has retreated. He says the ADs have made him feel edgy on the first day taking them. I know they don;t work for everyone and am just praying they do.

I'm very scared I'll never have him back. I hate this whole thing. It doesn't seem right or feel fair on anyone.

It does take a few weeks for ADs to affect. It is work that tends to be the biggest stress for dh. Dh was driving a 100 miles a day. His company let him work from home one day a week. A new manager didnt like that and tried to stop it. DH was also having to work off site all over the south and sometimes abroad.
They did get occupational health involved who gave advise. They did make him redundant about 6 months later which was the best the thing and he now has a very low stress job locally.
What actually set that bout off was a mid life crisis coinciding with DS growing up and getting girlfriends etc. Thankfully dcs were brilliant and their relationship actually seems to have got closer. It was awful, but could have been so much worse if they hadcreacted differently

Hi SQ just so you know I am feeling totally crap today (and have done since Monday) and yesterday was a day from hell, long crying bouts and no respite till late in the evening. I am only telling you this to try to describe the fluctuations in depression. I may be fine tomorrow and back to my cheerful self, or I might pick up earlier today than I did yesterday. There's just no way of knowing. As I said I'm fortunate that I am retired and don't have work or young children to think about, and a supportive DP. This is my first bad patch for over a month so I knew I was due for some bad days.

Depression is scary and your DH will be scared that he's not going to get better - it's one of the symptoms of the illness that we think we are never going to get better, and I have to try to remember that when I feel crap like I do today.

The ADs might well make him feel edgy because he is afraid of them, but he may well have side effects and these can come on before he feels any benefit from the meds and so people think the meds are making them feel worse when it is the side effects and these usually wear off after a few weeks. Also as others have said ADs do take 2/3 weeks to "kick in" and so he will need to be patient. He has probably been given a low dose to start and then it is increased after a couple of weeks. Normally a GP will want to see a patient 2 weeks after starting the meds, so he needs to make an appointment for 2 weeks time.

The important thing SQ is that while it is quite normal for you to feel scared, you are going to have to hide that from your DH because he will be scared (even if he doesn't admit it) and try to stay calm and re-assure him that this will pass and that 4 out of 5 people make a full recovery from depression within 4-6 months. Tell him that the fluctuations are the "nature of the beast" and they are to be expected.

I am wondering about anxiety too, as depression and anxiety usually go hand in hand and sometimes it's hard to know which is which and anxiety is the medical name for fear and this is another reason why he might feel scared.

Not sure if you know that 1 in 4 people will suffer from a mental illness at some point in their lives and 1 in 6 will be suffering at any one time. One third (sometimes more) GP consultations are MH related. You mention this not being fair - but who ever said life was fair. There are much worse mental illnesses than depression you know. You only have to stay on the MH threads on MN to find that out. People who have psychotic illnesses have horrendous symptoms and often end up in hospital and some are struggling with severe depression and having to cope with young children. That's to say nothing of all the awful physical illnesses that people have. I watched a dear friend's father suffer from motor neurone disease for 5 years before he died and that is truly terrible.

Take care and keep posting. Can't remember what the meds were?

I hope you feel better soon, NanaNina

Oh Hello Snowy - I do dip into the other thread now and again but there always lots of new names so I don't post. Daft really I know. I gather you are low too - so hope you pick up soon (and that you enjoy the Ben & Jerry's ice cream!!)

NanaNina I think it says a lot about you that you are feeling crap but you're still here online helping a stranger with their problems. Thank you

And it is Citalopram he is on :) I have been reading up on it!

I think citalopram is the drug that NICE guidelines recommend - I think it is meant to have fewer side effects though this varies with the individual. Sometimes posting on the MH threads helps to distract me from my own problems. These threads have got me through many a dark hour, so I am not acting purely selflessly.......!

Take the compliment...! It's pretty selfless! I feel so much more positive after reading the responses here and other threads on the same lines. I don't know anyone in RL with similar experiences. This has given me strength and a bit more hope.

I didn't know depression could make you tell your spouse you didn't love them so spent weeks thinking this was the truth even though it made no sense at all. He'd suggested 3 weeks earlier that we renew our vows and up until a few days before he left he was as loving always. I racked my brains trying to make sense of it.

This thread helped me explain to him that feeling like that is part of the illness and that was a big relief to him. He was wondering why he felt so numb towards us. I think it's been really confusing for him.

I hope the Citalopram works...have been reading online that it sometimes makes it worse at first.