How to handle DH's family's response to his D

[livinginazoo]

Without too much background information, my DH has suffered D for over 4 years, probably more towards 10. He is getting the treatment he should be, ADs, therapy etc and working very hard to get better. But is still after a year of treatment getting downs and obviously associated moods and behaviour and suicidal thoughts. His sister decided to tell him that he was a disappointment to her, not a role model or a suitable big brother, and that he should listen to her and she could 'fix' him. I pulled her up on this and her response to me was to tell me I caused his D, then to lay into him again. All of this by text, all very childish and selfish. Now I am feeling quite outraged at her lack of empathy and caring and wondering how should I react: ignore it, or? Any ideas gratefully received. Apparently, telling her she should be ashamed of herself was not appreciated. But this girl is a 'character'.

Hi - I'm really sorry to hear that your DH has been suffering with this. In my experience, two things probaby apply here: 1. not everyone can cope with caring for someone with D, or even really understand it. 2. Any long term illness can desensitize or alienate carers, family and friends. I'm sure you are familiar with both of these attitudes, but I understand your frustration with what sounds like fairly shabby behaviour on her part.

I can't really pass judgement based on what you've said here, but I suspect that she's just vented a bit of spleen/trying to give him a mental shake and it should be overlooked on this occasion. You and DH should ignore it, and instead make immediate plans to go out and do something you both love - walking, eating, shopping, whatever - to reward yourselves for all your hard work and remind yourselves of all the progress you've made, regardless of whether other people can see it or not. Small steps to happiness! :)

I wish you all the best.

Thank you for your answer.

Livinginazoo - I too am struggling to recover from a severe depressive episode last Easter (3 months in psych ward) and still having "downs" which can last from 5 - 15 days. I have more good days - about two third good and one third bad, but I am sure like your DH I have no control over when the "downs" come and this just adds more anxiety to this horrid horrid illness. I cannot imagine how awful I would feel if someone like your SIL said that to me. This illness makes us feel that we are responsible for feeling bad and that we should be able to do something about it. When I'm in a down I feel ashamed of anyone (other than DP and very close friends) seeing me in a state or feeling flat and disinterested in everything.

I can imagine how outraged you are feeling. What has been the effect on your DH? What sort of relationship have you both had with her in the past? I think e mails are a mixed blessing because it's much easier to tap out angry messages than to sayit to someone's face. Given that she can be so unbelievably insensitive and as you say lacking in any kind of empathy or understanding of this horrid illness, I tend to think that anything that you say is going to just lead on to more e mail arguments, and fuel her fire.

Did anything happen to precipitate this attack. Do you live near/see much of each other and are there going to be any repurcussions in the wider family if you just ignore your awful SIL or a short e mail saying something like you are not going to lower yourself to her insensitive attack and do not intend to fuel her fire by any further comments (or something similar) Whatever you decide to do, take your time, maybe write an e mail saying what you feel is right and re- reading before sending.

Firsttimeforeverything - I found you post very interesting in relation to your 2 points about people coping (or not) with mental illness. Fortunately my DP has been very supportive to me and so have my very close women friends, but not my grown up kids (with families of their own) they are boys and I don't think they know how to react as they don't understand the illness and seem a bit embarrassed though not uncaring. I found your comment about people becoming de-sensitised by family and friends very interesting as I am beginning to feel that is happening. Understandable I know. It's a bit like the way people expect you to get over a bereavement in 3 months and start talking about "moving on2 etc.

Depression and anxiety is the most horrid illness. I know there are worse physical illnesses, but I don't think they make you want to commit suicide in the way that depression does and this is so scarey.

The suicidal thoughts that go through your mind when depressed are terrifying, because they are so strong and overriding and the threat is so constant. And living with someone always wondering - what if they actually do it - is awful. You want to wrap them in cotton wool and protect them, and you can't because how can you stop them hurting themselves?

I agree with the comments that both it is nearly impossible for someone not suffering themselves to understand what it is like, and that it is hard for people to remain empathetic through a long term illness. I have seen such mixed responses from family and friends and most not helpful. His family try to ignore it, pretend he is all better, keep away, and get angry at his depressive behaviour.

Behaviour precipitating this attack. He discussed with her that he might need to give up his job for something less stressful as he is finding it hard to cope. She felt this was letting her down as she then did not have a role model. She berated him for not putting his 'family' (i.e. her and ILs) at a much higher priority, she is furious that she was not given more attention from him when growing up (she is quite a bit younger and he left for uni in her early teens and obviously got on with an adult life), she disapproves of him using alcohol to escape his suicidal thoughts. She is angry at him for thinking that his upbringing (a lot of being ignored, screamed at, high expectations to succeed in very specific areas, being punished for not fulfilling tasks in a specific manner/time) might have contributed to his D. He got angry at her when she said she could easily fix him if they met up. All ridiculous things to throw at someone who is suffering with D, and all very focused on her wants.

We do not see a lot of her, e.g. she lives a 19 min train ride away and we have seen her twice since August, together with the ILs each time. In that time he has been in hospital for 2 months as an inpatient and after that ongoing, intensive outpatient care. She has been asked for (very very minor) help babysitting our children to give us a small break (that was to attend a mindfulness course so not exactly for jollies) (has not happened) and once to go to him and check he was well... alive, when I was away during a particularly dramatic episode (refused). She has no dependents and is obviously young and living it up working and partying, as she should.

For what it is worth, after she ignored me and continued her rampage, I decided I had to ensure she stopped this by (can you believe) asking my MIL to have a quiet word. The girl is in the latter half of her 20s. But it was better than a permanent falling out. I am quite embarrassed about this.

My DH is obviously not dealing with it well. It is hard to maintain relationships and friendships when D, and he is so lonely. And he did not need another estrangement from someone he felt close to.

I am so utterly fed up and clueless as to what more to do.

She sounds awful. Depression is an illness , a horrible one at that. Im not a very tolerant person im afraid so personally id tell her to fuck off. And reasure your DH that she is being unreasonable and uncaring. Or doesn't understand at the very least.

Sorry thats probably not very helpful !

Livinginazoo - I am amazed that your DH holds down a job at all as he has been an inpatient (only for severely depressed patients) and you did say he was trying really hard to get better - I'll say he is. I am a retired social worker and was in middle mgt for the last 15 years of my employment and retired at 60. I am now 67 so don't have to worry about work - when the bad days come I sometimes just want to crawl under the duvet and stay there - not a good thing to do so I mostly don't do that.

I'm beginning to think that this dreadful SIL is the least of your problems. Was the talk with MIL successful - in that, did she understand how hurtful her daughter had been. Do you get on with MIL. Sounds like the root of your DH's depression is in the way he was treated as a child, and his sister has serious issues too (from the same place - her childhood) to be able to be so unbelievably horrid and insulting.

I may be wrong but I am wondering if you yourself are getting enough support in coping with your DH and his Dep. If it is any consolation a lot of the terrible suicidal thoughts that we have in severe depression are known as "suicide ideation" in the sense that we constantly think about it but will not actually take any action. Having said that there is always a risk of suicide in severe depression. I would certainly have been more than willing on several occasions to drink or take something that I knew would kill me.

I am a bit worried about your DH's drinking to help with the suicidal thoughts. How much is he drinking, because some people do self-medicate with alcohol to take the edge of the depression but then that can make it worse as I'm sure you know alcohol is a depressant.

I have recently read a helpful book called "Climbing out of Depression" by Sue Atkinson - she is not a medic of any sort but has suffered from depression herself which is quite obvious when you read the first few pages. I have always said that severe depression defies description but when I read what Sue wrote I agreed - this is how she describes it "depression is like being on an alien planet, suddenly struck blind, deaf, dumb, paralysed and penniless and since you are none of these things no one can see it" - she also talks about the loneliness of depression as you feel you are not part of humanity.

If I were you I would forget all about the Sil and anyone else who is unhelpful and keep them at bay. I think a lot of people are embarrassed that a relative is depressed because there is still a huge stigma and the notion of "madness" is still alive and well in so manypeople's minds.

I would concentrate on looking after yourself and your DH and the children. Have you got any close relatives/friends in whom you can confide? My DP doesn't seem to need to talk to anyone else but copes very well with me, but then he's a man and they don't dwell so much on emotions do they.

Anyway sending you warm wishes - you sound like a very level headed and loving and supportive wie - your DH is lucky to have you, but don't forget you need to take care of yourself too.

I agree with NinaNina both that you sound like a very supportive and loving person, and that you should make sure that you are getting the right support yourself. Being a carer can be grinding, if I'm honest, even if you have all the love in the world to give, and making sure that you are on an even keel is the best and safest basis on which to be providing support to your DH.

On how people react to hearing that someone close to them is suffering with D (or any very serious illness for that matter) - I can only speak from my own experience, but as far as it goes people seem to fall into two categories of those who can cope with it, and people who can't (the news, I mean, not D itself).

I'm always surprised at how strongly people react. There doesn't seem to be any indicator for how any individual will react, it's something that seems to be quite deep seated. Some people can just accept it, and want to reassure by offering everything they have to give and then some. Others, even close family and friends, can be totally nonplussed, proactive but desperately unhelpful, or on occasion literally pack up and leave, which is truly distressing.

I think with the benefit of hindsight, my attitude is that everyone deserves/we all need consideration and allowances for their flaws - your SIL sounds like she has yet to develop an empathic maturity that comes with coping with the difficult hands that life can occasionally deal you. This is something for her to resolve, not you.

All very zen, I know. As I say - hindsight. And I think a little light handed management of those who aren't necessarily reacting helpfully but can't just be ignored is a very good thing, and nothing that you need to be embarrassed about. If your MIL is onside with this, that's great.

NinaNina, I'm sorry that you feel that your sons are struggling with your illness a little - perhaps this is just because you are still 'mum' in their eyes and therefore permanent and indestructible :). They may need some time to get used to the idea that you are not! But most people, even those who are very supportive, are not prepared for the long haul. It's not something you can prepare for I suppose - it's something that you need to experience and learn on the job. Remember to keep the lines of communication open and clear, and make sure that everyone has a forum to discuss their feelings in without politics or embarrassment.

My very warmest wishes to both of you and your families.

*nananina!! I'm so sorry we've had a few sleepless nights recently :)

Thank you all so much for your responses and warm wishes, it is so helpful to read other people's reactions to a situation that I am so heavily involved in. MIL was less helpful than I had hoped, and is now continuing SILs campaign a little - silly silly woman. I don't know why I seem to desperately try and cling on to some hope that I might get some support and help from my ILs. You are right, the support I am getting is quite negligible, they seem to be adding to the problems quite a bit and not really doing anything helpful. Also right that I need to try and ignore them as much as I can, and a little management if that doesn't work. I think my reaction to this has been a build up of anger and frustration over the past few years that not only do they do quite the opposite of help, but they actually manage to make things worse.

I feel like a bit of a rabbit in the headlights trying to deal with such a difficult illness and having done so since I was pregnant with my eldest of two young children. I am working on that proverbial oxygen mask to get my own self working better, and have started doing more things for myself. Although that is hard as I rely on my D-DH to look after the children :-( but he is an amazing man.

I will have a look at that book you suggested!

And yes, his drinking as a coping mechanism is both a worry and stress, but being addressed with his health professionals.