I don't want to walk away but I really can't do any more - and it's frightening

[WhatonEarthCanIdo]

Hi
MN regular but name-changed.

I have 2 DSs and divorced their father when they were toddlers. I brought them up as a single parent working part-time. I scrimped and saved so they could have what other children had.

I have always had a very difficult relationship with DS1, who was always much closer to his father than to me. DS1 is now 23 years old. He went to local Uni but refused to live at home. He took out the full maintenance loans and tuition fee loans plus his father paid for his student accommodation and he also had a part-time job, plus £30 a week as my contribution. I think he would have needed after tax salary of about £24K to give him as much spending money as he had.

He scraped through the first year at Uni, doing very little work. During that time his mental health started to deteriorate and he started making some bizarre claims. He claimed that every student was richer than him ? they all had parents who drove Mercededs, had foreign properties and received bags of money from their parents while they were at Uni. He started blaming me for divorcing his father and that?s why he was poor and why he couldn?t concentrate on his Uni work and why he was failing at Uni. I think the real problem was that he started to get depressed because the course was too academic for him but he wouldn?t admit it.

He failed his 2nd year as he hardly attended, still living in the student felt paid for by his father. His mental health got much worse and he would ring me for hours on end, tearful and threatening suicide. Both his father and I tried to get him some help ? but he refused to see GP or even admit he was depressed ? still blaming us both for all the woes in his life.

Eventually he reached such a low stage that I got him to see the GP. I was there too. He told the GP there was nothing wrong with him and that his parents were exaggerating his depression. GP saw through that and referred him to Mental Health Services. They called round to see him once and again he said there was nothing wrong with him and we were making it up. MH services then left him alone. Still he continued to call me and his father tearful and depressed and threatening suicide. When we suggested seeing MH services again he said the fact that they had seen and discharged him meant he didn?t have any MH problems and we were making it up. We tried to get him help at Uni but his tutors and welfare service refused to speak to us because he was an adult.

He got more funding to repeat Uni Year 2 but gave up again after a few months as he didn?t go to the lectures. He was then staying in a flat, rarely going out and living off the quite considerable sum he?d accumulated from student loans etc. His behaviour became more and more erratic. He continued to blame us for not being rich enough as the pther students and for divorcing while he was young which he claims caused his current problems. Finally he threatened both his father and I with violence while he was visiting. We had to change the locks for protection. His father couldn?t deal with him any more as he himself was so worn down by trying to support him.

We didn?t hear from him again for about 16 months, until this week. He?s back at Uni ? to repeat the 2nd year for the 3rd time. He has got through every penny he has. He sent me a very vile and abusive email demanding money so he can stay at Uni and blaming everything that?s gone wrong in his life on me (as usual) so trying to make us feel that we should support him through this 3rd attempt at the 2nd year.

He stills blames us for everything that?s wrong. He hasn?t got a job as he claims he?s not well enough to get a job ? but when you tell him to see a GP he refuses to accept he?s ill. He says he has tried to get a job but has had no offers. He claims we are trying to distort the truth by telling him he?s unwell. He has no means of support at all to get through this academic year and doesn?t qualify for any maintenance loans. He claims he needs £700 a month (from us) to do so. I haven?t got that sort of money and neither has his father, whose own circumstances have changed dramatically over the past year. I?m living with the threat of redundancy myself. We?ve told him that. He claims that if he leaves Uni now he?ll have to pay £1000 in tuition fees ? which he hasn?t go. But if he stays for any longer he?ll have even more tuition fees to pay and will still have to drop out through lack of money. He?s still abusive and still won?t accept he?s not well ? but still breaks down on the phone at the helplessness of his situation. He picks up on every nuance in conversation and constantly twists things and we end up in constant circular arguments. It?s really difficult to talk to him without choosing your words really, really carefully. I find that exhausting.

I really don?t know what to do. I can?t get him help because he can?t admit he?s ill. I can?t afford £700 a month to keep him at Uni and what about the summer holidays because as a student he won?t qualify for any benefits so won?t have enough money to see him through unless he got a job ? which he?s too ill to get. He?s receiving counselling at Uni. He tells the counsellor his version of the story and uses what the counsellor says to reinforce his own version of the truth ? which is very different from the reality that his father and I know. In some ways it?s making matters worse but if he left Uni he wouldn?t get any psychological help at all as he still refuses to accept he?s ill.

I fear that he?ll now have to leave Uni through lack of money and unable to get a job will just still at home each day very depressed and unable to get a job or out of the rut he?s in. I fear for his safety.

What on earth can I do? I feel utterly helpless. I can?t do anything for him. I?m scared to even meet him face to face because of previous threats of violence. But I don?t feel can walk away because he?s my son.

Thank you for reading this far.

You poor, poor thing. You must have gone through hell. I have a 23 year old DS1 as well - I know that when posters come on to say "he's an adult, walk away" it'll be bloody hard to do that. But to an extent, I think that's the only way you'll hold on to your own sanity - he has to start taking some responsibility and while I have no doubt he has mental health issues, part of that seems to be quite manipulative. I think part of him probably knows the extent to which he's pushing his luck.

Firstly - if he quits now, he may well owe the SLC £1K, but they won't expect it until he's earning over £15K or whatever the current threshold is, i.e the same conditions they'd make had he graduated. I know this because my DD dropped out, and we had the same conversation with them. So that's not an immediete excuse/problem.

Could you call his counsellor and fill in some of the gaps?

Thanks for responding Hassledge.

I did think of emailing the Uni welfare service myself and telling them exactly what has been going on - as his version is so very different from that which I think he actually believes - he is so deluded. But I'm scared of his reaction.

You're right. This situation is starting to affect my own samity. I'm scared of what he'll do when the last prop (uni) is taken away from him and he still won't admit that he needs professional help from MH Services. I've tried telling him that if he could admit he is depressed he could get treatment but he just gets and angey derides that suggestion and uses the 'evidence' that MH servies and his counsellor all supposedly say there's nothing wrong with him or his problems are all caused by his parents. They don;t have him on teh phone for hours on end crying and threatening suicide.

How far does he have to fall before reality sets in?

A difficult situation, I went through something a bit similar myself when I was that age. My parents had split up, I went off to uni and slowly became depressed. My parents were too tied up in their own problems to take much notice of what was happening to me. I think contacting the uni may be a good idea, although it sounds like he may hold that against you. All I can say is that at that age, with the problems he is having he can not be regarded as an adult. He needs support, the world is a confusing place at that age, he may think he is mature but no one understands enough about their own mental health at that age to know what is healthy and what is not.
This is my personal view from being in a similar situation

OK - I showed your post to my DD (21, and suffers from depression). She immediately said Borderline personality disorder, and looking at that link it does sound likely. DD says you should look at depressionforums.org, which has a section specifically for families, as well as BPD and medications etc.

And DD and I both think you need to talk about this - could you get some counselling yourself?

Thank you Topsi and Hassledge.

I'll take a look at the links. I wouldn't be at all surpised if it was BPD.

I'd ideally like him and I to go together to counselling but he won't even consider.

WhatonEarthCanIdo, I just wanted to add my sympathy too. It is a terrible, draining, exhausting situation you are in and you must try to protect yourself from it first and foremost as you cannot support your son if he has worn you down to the extent that your life is ruined also.

It does sound to me as if your son has a personality disorder. He sounds very much like my ex-husband who also didn't profit from counselling as he was always able to twist things round to hear what he wanted to hear. He too could not accept responsibility for his problems and had to make everything someone else's fault. I am not sure such people are suitable candidates for counselling unless the counsellor is experienced in that kind of condition as they can be so clever and manipulative.

I would not give your son any money as he is not in a fit condition to profit from university and he is a bottomless pit at the moment. You will keep pouring and pouring and still get a mouthful of abuse when your resources aren't limitless. Think about what you can offer him; help with getting jobseeker's allowance? staying at home for a fixed time? can he come home at weekends? etc.

Then I would calmly reiterate to him that you love him and always will, that you believe that he needs psychiatric help, that you will help him in x, y, z ways but you do not accept his accusations and will not meet his demands. He will not believe you but that is his problem. Maintaining clear boundaries is helpful for a person who is all over the place even if it makes them rant and rave. Keep repeating this every time he goes off on one. Do not withdraw your love or such support as it is reasonable to give. But do not get involved in playing his games either as there is just no winning - he is not in a reasonable frame of mind and endlessly trying to persuade/reason with him will just wear you out. Imagine that you are dealing with a toddler in a very large body - because in some ways that is what he is, emotionally.

Do not accept violence either. If he becomes violent I believe you can have him sectioned and although that would be very hard perhaps he might get the more specialised help he needs then.

You are a good, loving mother and protecting yourself is not being callous. Try to keep on enjoying your life and get as much support as you can. You have not stopped loving your son at all and nor are you withdrawing from him completely, you are just refusing to get sucked into his distorted fantasy which is the only place he seems currently willing to meet you. Well in the end the choice is his and cannot be yours.

This is just what I would say based on my own experience, but of course I am not an expert on mental health so I hope you will get some good advice from the mental health forums. I will be thinking of you though, please keep us posted.

I really, really feel for you. My parents endured a similar, but sadly worse situation with one of my brothers. It was worse because when he started having mental health problems they kept giving into his demands for money etc as they were totally emotionally blackmailed and he was also violent to them both. As result he (now in his 40s)has never taken any responsibility for his own life or actions and has since been diagnosed schizophrenic (not suggesting this is what your boy is, personality disorder sounds nearer the mark as other posters have said).

My parents handled the situation really badly from the start due to their own problems and you sound much more together than them. I watched my father completely fall apart over the years as this situation took its toll on hos mentla and physical health. All I would suggest to you is don't keep enabling his behaviours by giving him money- my brother has blown tens of thousands of pounds of my fathers cash and it has NOT helped him one iota. Tough love is easy to talk about, very hard to do, but you cannot give into threats of violence either.

Horrible situation for you, couldn't just ignore your post and I wish you all the best.

Thank you all very much for your posts and your very kind thoughts.

I looked at the BPD and depressive links and think it's probbaly a bit of both.

I've written him a very long and considered email suggesting that he needs to look at either getting a job, signing on and obtaining employment training that way or facing up to the fact that he is not well and seeing a doctor to get signed off. I've made it quite clear that expecting me to find £700 a month for the next year (or possibly 2) is simply not possible or reasonable.

I've told him that I will assist him in whatever course of action he decides upon but that, as an adult, the responsbility for that choice is his.

I've asked him to continue the converstaion with me by email as phone calls become very heated. (That will probably be distorted by him as 'You told me not to ring you any more' ).

I cannot have him back home to live. It just wouldn't work. I have another son who is in his final year at Uni and I cannot imagine how he would cope with DS1 back upsetting everyone constantly. They have never got on. In fact DS2 will finish his own degree before DS1 (who is still repeating his 2nd year) - so that would be a constant source of friction.

I do agree with those of you who've said I need to stop funding him. I feel that if I don't stand back and let whatever happens next take its course, I'll be bailing him out for the rest of his life. I didn't spend 30+ years a a wage slave to hand over all my savings to someone who will just waste the whole lot. This is my weekend after a really hectic working week and I can't enjoy it.

Thank you again. You've all been really helpful and I'll try to keep you posted.

Whatonearth - your email to ds1 sounds a very considered and (in my opinion for what it is worth) sensible reply. Excluding fees £700 is much more than a friends daughter needs per month and having seen my brother permanently funded by my parents, they are still doing that now he has dc!

Perhaps if he has to find the money himself by working, he will make sure he is well enough to actually complete Uni. If he is not well enough to do a job, that that itself is evidence he needs to face to seek and work with the CMHT.

Those phonecalls sound very draining for you (a shame you didn't have recordings of them for the mental health team, but unless he is willing to engage with services unless he is not safe they will not work with him) - setting boundaries, such as email sounds very sensible.

People with mental health issues can have their carer (informal) receive a formal carers assessemnt - but some areas also have charities, could you look into any local charities that provide support for carers in your area? You can self refer, unlike the ones provided by CMHT.

All the best x