5:2 / IF Exercise & Fitness Thread Number 3: Advice and information for those following Intermittent Fasting .... and anyone else too

[BigChocFrenzy]

Why Exercise ?

Maintaining a normal bodyweight and taking regular exercise are 2 major areas of life which we can address to improve our health.

Regular exercise helps reduce the risk of obesity, type 2 diabetes, heart disease, high blood pressure, some cancers, osteoporosis, dementia, depression.

Increasing your % muscle and / or reducing your % body fat lowers the risk of death from all causes LowerRiskMuscle

Regular exercisers gain the greatest benefits over their lifetime and they can minimise biological aging, i.e. "Bend the Aging Curve BendAge

Recent Research showed that lack of exercise is twice as likely to lead to premature death as being obese (BMI 30 -35)

Body Fat, Exercise & Diet
People who maintain their weight through diet alone without exercise are likely to have major deposits of visceral fat (the more dangerous kind around organs), even if BMI is ok.

They are TOFIs (Thin Outside, Fat Inside)

A MRI study found that:
45 % of women and nearly 60% of men with “healthy” BMI, had excessive levels of visceral fat i.e. clinically overweight

A Can J Card study showed visceral fat can be burned off via exercise, even if weight is unchanged (increased lean mass)

Hormesis

Hormesis, see Mattson , BlackSwan and Stronger is cutting edge science for nutrition & fitness.

Its principles are that alternating between “extremes” - e.g. feast & fast (5:2 / IF) , intense training & rest (HIIT) - makes the body more resilient.

The intermittent stress of lifting an extreme weight or performing at high speed for a short period pushes the body to overcompensate and prepare for an even greater future challenge HormesisTrain , Hormesis-Edge , and AntiFragile
The following recovery period avoids damage from over-stressing.

Fasted training

i.e. training on FDs (Fast Days), seems to increase the benefits of both training and IF.
Most experienced exercisers soon manage fasted training without loss of performance for sessions of up to 90 mins.

TYPES of Exercise

Main types: Aerobic, anaerobic, flexibility.

All exercise will burn fat, the more intense the faster the fat burn

Anaerobic
e.g. HIIT (see below), sprints, strength training
. Shorter training period
. Increases the RMR (Resting Metabolic Rate) for up to 48 hrs
. Soon increases fitness
. May help correct insulin metabolism issues & target abs fat.

Aerobic
e.g. walking, running, cycling, swimming
. Longer training period
. May burn more calories during exercise, if it is lasts much longer than HIIT, but burns fewer afterwards
. It is easier to do for the less fit

Flexibility, Stability, Relaxation
e.g. yoga, stretching

The best exercise routine is one you enjoy and is sustainable.

HIIT cardio and resistance training / weight lifting are especially recommended to boost the effect of 5:2/IF, to increase weight loss, reduce body fat, retain muscle and maintain TDEE / BMR.

HOW to Exercise

If you are a very overweight unfit beginner:
. Check with your GP before starting exercise
. Start by walking 5-10 mins twice per day, gradually increase
. Try walk intervals: alternating 1 min faster pace, 1 min normal
. Build up to a brisk 30 mins daily walk and you will significantly improve your health & fitness
. Swimming is also good, preferably crawl or back stroke for less strain on back & joints.

Everyone Else:
Whether you join a gym or train at home or in the park:

• Train as intensively as your time, health and fitness level allow.
• Do not remain in your comfort zone, or you will not improve. But stop immediately if you feel any sharp pain.
• You are supposed to drip sweat and pant heavily !

Efficiency / Intensity: This Study proved that at speeds of 5mph or faster, running will burn more calories per mile than walking

HIIT (High Intensity Interval Training)

HIIT is an exercise strategy which alternates brief intervals of high intensity exercise with less intense recovery periods

. Very time-efficient, producing the greatest fitness benefit in the least time (the advantage of hormesis)

. Increases both aerobic and anaerobic endurance

. May improve insulin metabolism, very important for health and abs fat.

. Reduces risk of heart problems more than doing lower intensity SteadyState , pp. 31-34.

HIIT can be applied to cardio or to bodyweight exercises, at home or gym.
Most gyms offer HIIT classes, e.g. spinning, circuit training, CrossFit, Tabata, Fartlek (=HIIT with irregular intervals)

FAST Exercise

"No time" to exercise ?
Or want to boost fitness & fat-burning metabolism

Dr Mosely developed a FastExerciseProgram to complement his 5:2 WOE
His Fast HIIT and strength routines can significantly improve metabolism & fat-burning capability

Other scientists like Tabata have developed routines now wisely incorporated in training.

HIIT Fitness Blasts

A few mins per day, 3-5 days per week

START with 2 mins warmup then EITHER

Sprint or Rope-skipping intervals
. 1 minute sprinting / skipping @ max effort +90 secs jogging to recover
. Do 5 intervals

OR

Fast Blasts
Choose from:
Running, stationary bike @ low resistance, rope-skipping, burpees, jumping jacks, spotty dog, punching air or bag, step-ups, swimming, squats, lunges, pressups, tricep dips, situps ... or any combination you like.

Choose type of Blast:

4-minute Blast
. 4 mins @ 90% effort

OR "Tabata" = 8 x intervals of 20 secs @ 100% effort + 10 secs recovery @ rest or slow speed
( FreeTimerApp )

OR 2 x20-sec intervals=
. 20-sec @ 100% effort
. 2 mins walk to recover
. 20-sec @ 100% effort

END any HIIT or Fat Blast with a few mins cooldown walk / jog

RESISTANCE Training / LIFTING

Helps retain muscle mass during weight loss and hence to maintain TDEE.
Lift at home / in the gym weights area / in a pump class.

It is best not to train the same muscle groups 2 days in succession, so have rest days, or cardio, or train different muscle groups on different days.
Try to build up to weight training for 30-60 mins twice per week.

Reps = the number of repetitions in a set of lifts
Sets are separated by brief rests
E.g. 3 sets of 12 reps = 36 lifts
Breathing: Inhale before lifting, exhale while lifting. Don't hold your breath.

WARNING
Do not lift massively heavy barbells, more than bodyweight, unless you are really fit with good technique.
Women who have given birth and / or are aged 40+ have a higher risk of pelvic floor / prolapse injuries when lifting heavy than young non-mums.

Press ups
Video

• The best upper body exercise
• Keep attempting one full pressup rather than doing several dozen girlie ones with your knees on the floor
• Once you can do one pressup, you will soon be able to build up to 5, then 10 etc.
• Tip: keep the abs rigid, so strong abs are as important as strong shoulders & arms
• Hand Release Pressups are good to build up strength for full ones
• Also build up via inclined pressups IncPress , see bottom of wiki page
• To increase the number of pushups IncNum

ATG Arse To Grass bodyweight squat

• The best exercise for the large muscle group in bum and thighs
• Basic principle: It is like having a pee on a public loo - get your bum down low and pointing to the rear, but not actually touching the seat

-Lean back on your heels, so that weight is on them, not on your toes

• Bring your arms forward
• Keep your back straight, but angled slightly forward, not vertical
• Squat down as far as you can without knee pain or hunching your back
• Push up from your heels, exhaling.

Pullups

• Very few women can do full ones, but assisted ones build excellent muscle
• Work the same muscles with the much easier Australian pullup / InvertedRow

If you have access to dumbbells / barbells, then for maximum effect, work the large muscle groups:
Squat BentOverRow (press button "female")
BehindNeckPress (press button "female")
DeadLift

To increase Strength
Lift as heavy as you can, low reps, with 1 minute rest between sets e.g. 5 sets x 5 reps each, i.e. totalling 25 lifts

To Build Muscle
Lift lower weight, 3 sets x 8-20 reps, i.e. totalling 24-60 lifts

To Build Endurance
Lift lower (NOT Girlie) weight for 3-5 mins, preferably without pauses

BUM / GLUTES
Squats & lunges are excellent
Also this 2-min bodyweight workout especially for women, targeting the bum:
WorkYourBum

ABS
Choose the exercises & number of reps for your fitness level

The plank
. Start at 2 x 15 secs. Build up to 2 x 45 secs
. Advanced:

1. Use TRX slings, picture 2

Side plank + hip raises
. If you can, keep the side of 1 foot plus 1 forearm on the floor, free arm straight up in the air, picture 3
. Easier - free hand on your hip. Easier still - keep calf & knee on the floor, instead of bent at the knees
. Start at 3 sets of 3. Build up to 3 x 30

Leg raises
. Lie flat on your back, with legs bent to 90 degrees
. Lower the legs one at a time to 1" above the floor (straight leg if you can) then raise again
. Start at 3 sets of 3 each leg. Build up to 3 x 15
. Advanced:

1. Lower both legs at the same time

Situps
. Hands forward to really work abs & avoid pulling the neck
. Alternatively, cross your arms over your chest
. Start at 3 sets of 3. Build up to 3 x 30
. Advanced:

1. Raise legs to 90 degrees & bring them towards you when you situp (double crunch)
2. Legs nearly flat on the floor
3. One leg bent at 90 degrees, the other held straight 1" above the floor
4. Hold a weight disc / dumbbells / barbell above your head

Angled Situps
. Lie on your back and rest one ankle on the opposite knee
. Angled situp so your opposite elbow touches the knee
. Keep the other hand be in the air by your knee, or alternatively supporting your head - do NOT pull on the neck
. Build up to 3 sets of 20 each side
. Advanced:

1. with dumbell
2. Situps with legs rotated 90 degrees to the left, resting on floor. Then repeat set with legs rotated to the right, on floor
3. Lie on the floor, rotate legs 90 degrees to the left. Raise and lower legs like that, keeping back on the floor. Repeat set with legs on other side
4. Keep legs raised & rotated to the left and do situps (double side crunch) Repeat with legs raised & rotated to the right

AVOID OSTEOPOROSIS

To retain bone strength and avoid a painfully disabled old age, start now:
Ideally weight-bearing exercises that load the bone along its length of these types:

Impact exercise E.g. walking, running, jumping, skipping rope, step class, hitting a heavy punch bag

Lifting: squats, press-ups, bench press, overhead press etc

Squats are much better for osteoporosis than lunges, also for knees:
The weight in a squat is transmitted down along the spine, through the hip, and down along the bones of the leg, whereas in a lunge, it is transmitted across the shinbone and puts pressure on the knee joint

Cycling normally does NOT increase bone density, as it does not load bones along their length. Osteo

KETTLEBELLS Kettle
Beginners:
. Two-handed swing
. Sumo Deadlift
. Turkish Getup
. Swing
. Clean and Jerk
. Press

Improve GRIP STRENGTH GripStrength , GripBuild

RUNNERS

. Sprinting improves fitness
. Regular 5 - 10 km runs burn significant fat, especially fasted

Running illustrates the "J or S-curve" effect, where increasing exercise improves health, up to a certain point, after which health worsens e.g. MayoClinic , RiceUni , JMed :

. Running 20 mins improves immune system

. A run of 90+ mins may weaken the immune system for up to 3 days.
With insufficient recovery periods, the damage is cumulative.
Elite runners have immune systems that handle that strain

. Long races 20k+ may cause micro-tears to the heart muscle in some runners, hence a 2-week recovery period is recommended.

CALCULATORS:
Calories Burned for specific exercises: ExerciseCals
Fitness Calculators: 52FastExercise
Estimate fitness age: FitAge
Estimate Vo2Max iTunes App: Vo2APP
Running Calories burned: RunningCals
Running Standards: Age-RelatedRunCalculator
TDEE 24hr activity times & body fat TDEE-Detail

Thanks Big Choc, that's really helpful. I'll continue as you suggest with the resistance training, just did 40 minutes in fact!
Swimming I have to do as I take my kids plus I really enjoy it, but I'll go much more gently on 800 days.
I'm going to see how things go and maybe later on go higher than 800 so I can include more protein, I'm not actually diabetic or pre diabetic as far as I know, but I do have a lot of belly fat so at high risk. I want to get rid of it quickly, and need the motivation of rapid results, at least at first!

Thanks by the way for all the advice you give on these threads Big Choc!

I lost the last of my pregnancy weight with 5:2 a couple of years ago and have since maintained with 6:1. But now I'm trying to build in some exercise and I'm on week 5 of couch to 5k.

My question is how to fit the fasting around the runs. I'm back on 5:2 because I'm a couple of kg over my ideal weight, plus I usually can't run on my three work days (no time, I work long hours).

So far I have done the runs on consecutive days in order to fit them in around work (the app says not to do this, but if I didn't I wouldn't fit in three runs a week), and fasted on work days. But would it be more effective (in terms of health, fat burning, losing weight) to run on a fast day? Or the morning after a fast day before breakfast?

Welcome Lok
Those 10,000 steps are a good boost for health as well as improving your fitness.
If you want to ramp things up, you can try "walking intervals", i.e. alternating 2 mins normal pace with 2 mins brisk.

Hi Bounced
You'd boost fat-burning if you run fasted on your FD. You can try 30 mins and build up to an hour, see how you feel.
You'd probably be too hungry to run before breaking your fast the day after, or at least your performance might not improve as it should.

Thanks, BigChoc

I usually run first thing (due to childcare logistics), so am I right in thinking it would be best to fast the day of the run rather than the day before? Or try and move the run later (would have be before about 3.00)? I'm only walking and running for 30 minutes - working up to running for 30 minutes in another 4 weeks time, according to the app.

Running on the FD would be best, if you can. Especially early morning, so it revs you up for the whole fast.

On NFDs too - but not the day after an FD - running before breakfast is fasted running, because you've had no calories since supper.
tip: a double espresso, no sugar or milk 10 minutes before you run (or do other exercise) can help mobilise fat for burning

Thanks! Will try it on Monday and see how I go. I have a stubborn 2kg I'd like to get rid off, but all my clothes fit so it's a bit hard to get motivated to fast. The running is easier as being able to keep up with kids on scooters (and overtake them, now) is handy and it makes me feel good.

Welcome to all the new posters - nice to see you!

If you find something you can stick with - exercise works!

With the help of BC, I've gone from not being able to do one single press up, just over 2 years ago, to...

Ta Da...

[Drum roll, here]

62 press ups in 60 seconds!

[Takes a bow]

Thank you, thank you!

That's impressive B&W.
I can't do a proper press up, even on the knees I struggle.

That's great B&W Just think how far you have come in 2 years training
Did you do them in 1 v long set, or as 2 or 3 sets ?
< ponders pressup experiments this weekend >

I can rattle off 100 v quickly if I can have 3 secs break between each set of 10.
However, I can probably only do 50 in a single set, unless I stick my bum in the air to rest (which is rude !)

Sputnik We (B&W and I) can both do 500+ in a single training session and we aim to improve < rivalry, no not us ! >

Thanks, folks. Have to say it feels good!

Unweighted press ups: I managed 59 press ups, in one go, in 55 secs - had a rest for 2 seconds and squeezed out another 3 before the minute was up.

When I'm doing 200 with 8kg on my back, I'm now doing them in sets of 20 with 30 seconds rest. Do the first 100, have 5 minutes rest, do the second 100.

Yesterday the first 100 took 4 mins 20 - the second 100 took 4 minutes exactly.

It's very encouraging since I'm seeing a PB almost every time I train. Only 10 days ago those figures were 6.21 and 5.15. (The second set is always faster! )

For any new joiners - I intend to challenge my very fit son to see how many press ups we can each do in a minute - only he doesn't know this yet! [fiendish]

I need to see how many I can do in one minute with the weight on my back - once I can do 60 in 60 seconds, I'll pounce!

Listening to you two I realise what a very low baseline I am starting from. So, lots of potential for improvement!
By the way the link above for push ups is broken.

Sputnik Both B&W and I started (at different times) unable to do one full pressup. You will be amazed how quickly you can build up, once you crack the first one.
I (think) I tested all the pressup links in the OP - which link didn't work ?

That's reassuring!
It's the first one under press ups, that just says video

I tried that link before and just now - works for me

B&W When and how do you plan to trap surprise your son with the pressup challenge ? < nosey >
He must have noticed your bigger muscles and sinewy physique. Does he know you are building up pressups and to what extent ?
Whoever wins, he'll be so impressed !

Hi BC

That link just gives me a blank page with a small box at the top.

B&W When and how do you plan to trap surprise your son with the pressup challenge ? < nosey >
He must have noticed your bigger muscles and sinewy physique. Does he know you are building up pressups and to what extent ?
Whoever wins, he'll be so impressed !

Well, he did take note of my physique last year, back along, but he hasn't said anything recently. He has no idea of the extent of the press ups I'm doing.

I've said when I get to 60 weighted ones in one minute, I'll throw out the challenge. And I've just managed 49 - 40 straight off, then a 10 second rest, then 9 more. I'm more than surprised with that. At this rate I'll be well ahead of that by Easter - when I expect to see him again!

My plan is that I'll let him go first - then I'll do 20 or so as a bit of a warm up, rest for a minute or two, then go for it.

I'm thinking I might add my 3kg kb to my backpack - giving me 11kgs altogether!

Just go for it, Sputnik! Start off with the hand release press up - that link works OK - it was the way in for me.

Another important thing I've learned over the last couple of years is the importance of rest days - I reckon I've found exercising 3 days apart (exercising on alternate days, then throwing in a rest day once a week) is when I've had most of my PBs!

Thanks for the encouragement B&W! Will give it a go
Very strange about that link, when I hover over it is correct, but when I click it goes straight here

I just open the link in a new tab and its fine. I'm on iPad Air 2 with Safari.
Maybe it's an App issue.

B&W I'd expect training for the 1 min pressup rep max to build your strength & fitness well; it's another kind of loading tomadd to your routine:
it's basically an extreme HIT session, 100% effort for a single 1 min session, then recover and do something else.
I'd call it a Fit Blast (because you don't need the Fat Blast)

Yes, restdays are vital:
When you work your muscles hard, this creates tiny micro-tears in the muscle fibres. The next day, if you rest those particular muscles - you can train a different muscle group - the muscle repairs and rebuilds, a little stronger each time.
So, muscle building really happens on the restdays.

So does it follow from that that your muscles require protein to repair themselves more on a rest day than the day you actually did the exercise? I have always wondered this!

That link is so strange, I have worked with web stuff for years and can't figure it out. On the PC if I click it directly or open in a new tab I get the urbandictionary thing. On my phone if I just click the link same story. If I click to open a new tab on my phone I get the push up gif, finally!

I wouldn't worry about whether it is a lifting day or the day after:
You need adequate protein every day of the week; for lifters on IF, this usually averages out over the week to 1-1.2g per 1kg bodyweight.
If you do FDs, it's OK to drop to as low as 0.8g, so long as you compensate on NFDs.
So, the protein variation is FDs/NFDs rather than lifting / recovery days.

I've noticed before when posting videos on MN that they sometimes only work in a new tab. Or sometimes the video can be clicked directly after a logoff from MN and then rebooting.
MN works in mysterious ways

Hello all

I recognise a few names here from the main 52 page

I've just had a read through the into (thanks once again bigchoc) and just done the following:

1 tabata - star jumps... was good, harder than I thought though!
2 x 15 seconds plank - better than I thought it would be, last time I tried to get into planking, my first one was about 5 seconds!

Anyhoo - bit of background on me fitness wise... from age 15-about 29 I did martial arts - 1st dan in two different karate styles. Loved it. Once second child came along I had to stop as it was impossible to make training (hard enough with 1 - only managed once every week or two then!). Since ending my marriage I've finally got some time where I can exercise and get myself back to me - so I occasionally do my les mills combat DVDs - which is an amazing workout, feels really good to be martial arts based but I don't get time to do it as much as I'd like.

And I'm walking - I rather rashly signed up for the moonwalk in may in London on a whim! So every other weekend, when I don't have the DC I'm out for a long walk. Original aim was to increase by 2 miles every fortnight - which should mean I get a 20 miler in before the big day... but to be honest I'm kind of winging it and listening to my body now! Have so far done 6, 8 and 12 miles. Next one will be 12 again I think and then I'll go from there!

Anyway, thats me - looking forward to the exercise chat!

Nice to see you, MrD
Great that you have taken up Les Mills, a really good workout
The high martial arts standard you had in earlier years means you used to be very fit and strong - you can regain this, with practice.

All that moonwalk training is building lower body strength and cardio fitness.

I recommend you build up upper body strength too, by adding pressups to your workout - they are probably the best allround exercise to work all the upper body muscle groups, as well as the abs.
Start with hand release pressups and inclined pressups on a bed, bench or stairs, then build up to later to full ones.
Also do tricep dips on a step, to firm up that flabby back of the arms area.

Hi, and thanks to BigChoc for the advice.

I was looking at our local leisure centre and they have a class called Total Body Conditioning. Would this be a good thing to add in to the mix as well as my three runs a week (on week 6 of Couch to 5k)? It would mean doing that class on a FD and so moving one run to the early afternoon after a FD.

I would like to get a bit more toned as well as fitter cardiovascularly (if that's a word) but I know I won't fit anything more than one class in, given time / kids / work constraints.

I'm walking 7km a day on average (with massive variation between days), but apart from the walking and the three runs a week, I do no other exercise.

Hi,

I'm a newbie to all this and have just completed 8 weeks on Cambridge to shed the main bulk of my excess weight (lost 2st 3lbs) I've reintroduced normal food over the last 4 days so am ready to last the last 9lbs on the 5:2 starting with my first FD tomorrow.

I wanted to ask a couple of questions if that's ok, firstly can the FD's be consecutive and secondly do you gain any weight on the nfd's?