5:2 / IF Exercise & Fitness Thread Number 3: Advice and information for those following Intermittent Fasting .... and anyone else too

[BigChocFrenzy]

Why Exercise ?

Maintaining a normal bodyweight and taking regular exercise are 2 major areas of life which we can address to improve our health.

Regular exercise helps reduce the risk of obesity, type 2 diabetes, heart disease, high blood pressure, some cancers, osteoporosis, dementia, depression.

Increasing your % muscle and / or reducing your % body fat lowers the risk of death from all causes LowerRiskMuscle

Regular exercisers gain the greatest benefits over their lifetime and they can minimise biological aging, i.e. "Bend the Aging Curve BendAge

Recent Research showed that lack of exercise is twice as likely to lead to premature death as being obese (BMI 30 -35)

Body Fat, Exercise & Diet
People who maintain their weight through diet alone without exercise are likely to have major deposits of visceral fat (the more dangerous kind around organs), even if BMI is ok.

They are TOFIs (Thin Outside, Fat Inside)

A MRI study found that:
45 % of women and nearly 60% of men with “healthy” BMI, had excessive levels of visceral fat i.e. clinically overweight

A Can J Card study showed visceral fat can be burned off via exercise, even if weight is unchanged (increased lean mass)

Hormesis

Hormesis, see Mattson , BlackSwan and Stronger is cutting edge science for nutrition & fitness.

Its principles are that alternating between “extremes” - e.g. feast & fast (5:2 / IF) , intense training & rest (HIIT) - makes the body more resilient.

The intermittent stress of lifting an extreme weight or performing at high speed for a short period pushes the body to overcompensate and prepare for an even greater future challenge HormesisTrain , Hormesis-Edge , and AntiFragile
The following recovery period avoids damage from over-stressing.

Fasted training

i.e. training on FDs (Fast Days), seems to increase the benefits of both training and IF.
Most experienced exercisers soon manage fasted training without loss of performance for sessions of up to 90 mins.

TYPES of Exercise

Main types: Aerobic, anaerobic, flexibility.

All exercise will burn fat, the more intense the faster the fat burn

Anaerobic
e.g. HIIT (see below), sprints, strength training
. Shorter training period
. Increases the RMR (Resting Metabolic Rate) for up to 48 hrs
. Soon increases fitness
. May help correct insulin metabolism issues & target abs fat.

Aerobic
e.g. walking, running, cycling, swimming
. Longer training period
. May burn more calories during exercise, if it is lasts much longer than HIIT, but burns fewer afterwards
. It is easier to do for the less fit

Flexibility, Stability, Relaxation
e.g. yoga, stretching

The best exercise routine is one you enjoy and is sustainable.

HIIT cardio and resistance training / weight lifting are especially recommended to boost the effect of 5:2/IF, to increase weight loss, reduce body fat, retain muscle and maintain TDEE / BMR.

HOW to Exercise

If you are a very overweight unfit beginner:
. Check with your GP before starting exercise
. Start by walking 5-10 mins twice per day, gradually increase
. Try walk intervals: alternating 1 min faster pace, 1 min normal
. Build up to a brisk 30 mins daily walk and you will significantly improve your health & fitness
. Swimming is also good, preferably crawl or back stroke for less strain on back & joints.

Everyone Else:
Whether you join a gym or train at home or in the park:

• Train as intensively as your time, health and fitness level allow.
• Do not remain in your comfort zone, or you will not improve. But stop immediately if you feel any sharp pain.
• You are supposed to drip sweat and pant heavily !

Efficiency / Intensity: This Study proved that at speeds of 5mph or faster, running will burn more calories per mile than walking

HIIT (High Intensity Interval Training)

HIIT is an exercise strategy which alternates brief intervals of high intensity exercise with less intense recovery periods

. Very time-efficient, producing the greatest fitness benefit in the least time (the advantage of hormesis)

. Increases both aerobic and anaerobic endurance

. May improve insulin metabolism, very important for health and abs fat.

. Reduces risk of heart problems more than doing lower intensity SteadyState , pp. 31-34.

HIIT can be applied to cardio or to bodyweight exercises, at home or gym.
Most gyms offer HIIT classes, e.g. spinning, circuit training, CrossFit, Tabata, Fartlek (=HIIT with irregular intervals)

FAST Exercise

"No time" to exercise ?
Or want to boost fitness & fat-burning metabolism

Dr Mosely developed a FastExerciseProgram to complement his 5:2 WOE
His Fast HIIT and strength routines can significantly improve metabolism & fat-burning capability

Other scientists like Tabata have developed routines now wisely incorporated in training.

HIIT Fitness Blasts

A few mins per day, 3-5 days per week

START with 2 mins warmup then EITHER

Sprint or Rope-skipping intervals
. 1 minute sprinting / skipping @ max effort +90 secs jogging to recover
. Do 5 intervals

OR

Fast Blasts
Choose from:
Running, stationary bike @ low resistance, rope-skipping, burpees, jumping jacks, spotty dog, punching air or bag, step-ups, swimming, squats, lunges, pressups, tricep dips, situps ... or any combination you like.

Choose type of Blast:

4-minute Blast
. 4 mins @ 90% effort

OR "Tabata" = 8 x intervals of 20 secs @ 100% effort + 10 secs recovery @ rest or slow speed
( FreeTimerApp )

OR 2 x20-sec intervals=
. 20-sec @ 100% effort
. 2 mins walk to recover
. 20-sec @ 100% effort

END any HIIT or Fat Blast with a few mins cooldown walk / jog

RESISTANCE Training / LIFTING

Helps retain muscle mass during weight loss and hence to maintain TDEE.
Lift at home / in the gym weights area / in a pump class.

It is best not to train the same muscle groups 2 days in succession, so have rest days, or cardio, or train different muscle groups on different days.
Try to build up to weight training for 30-60 mins twice per week.

Reps = the number of repetitions in a set of lifts
Sets are separated by brief rests
E.g. 3 sets of 12 reps = 36 lifts
Breathing: Inhale before lifting, exhale while lifting. Don't hold your breath.

WARNING
Do not lift massively heavy barbells, more than bodyweight, unless you are really fit with good technique.
Women who have given birth and / or are aged 40+ have a higher risk of pelvic floor / prolapse injuries when lifting heavy than young non-mums.

Press ups
Video

• The best upper body exercise
• Keep attempting one full pressup rather than doing several dozen girlie ones with your knees on the floor
• Once you can do one pressup, you will soon be able to build up to 5, then 10 etc.
• Tip: keep the abs rigid, so strong abs are as important as strong shoulders & arms
• Hand Release Pressups are good to build up strength for full ones
• Also build up via inclined pressups IncPress , see bottom of wiki page
• To increase the number of pushups IncNum

ATG Arse To Grass bodyweight squat

• The best exercise for the large muscle group in bum and thighs
• Basic principle: It is like having a pee on a public loo - get your bum down low and pointing to the rear, but not actually touching the seat

-Lean back on your heels, so that weight is on them, not on your toes

• Bring your arms forward
• Keep your back straight, but angled slightly forward, not vertical
• Squat down as far as you can without knee pain or hunching your back
• Push up from your heels, exhaling.

Pullups

• Very few women can do full ones, but assisted ones build excellent muscle
• Work the same muscles with the much easier Australian pullup / InvertedRow

If you have access to dumbbells / barbells, then for maximum effect, work the large muscle groups:
Squat BentOverRow (press button "female")
BehindNeckPress (press button "female")
DeadLift

To increase Strength
Lift as heavy as you can, low reps, with 1 minute rest between sets e.g. 5 sets x 5 reps each, i.e. totalling 25 lifts

To Build Muscle
Lift lower weight, 3 sets x 8-20 reps, i.e. totalling 24-60 lifts

To Build Endurance
Lift lower (NOT Girlie) weight for 3-5 mins, preferably without pauses

BUM / GLUTES
Squats & lunges are excellent
Also this 2-min bodyweight workout especially for women, targeting the bum:
WorkYourBum

ABS
Choose the exercises & number of reps for your fitness level

The plank
. Start at 2 x 15 secs. Build up to 2 x 45 secs
. Advanced:

1. Use TRX slings, picture 2

Side plank + hip raises
. If you can, keep the side of 1 foot plus 1 forearm on the floor, free arm straight up in the air, picture 3
. Easier - free hand on your hip. Easier still - keep calf & knee on the floor, instead of bent at the knees
. Start at 3 sets of 3. Build up to 3 x 30

Leg raises
. Lie flat on your back, with legs bent to 90 degrees
. Lower the legs one at a time to 1" above the floor (straight leg if you can) then raise again
. Start at 3 sets of 3 each leg. Build up to 3 x 15
. Advanced:

1. Lower both legs at the same time

Situps
. Hands forward to really work abs & avoid pulling the neck
. Alternatively, cross your arms over your chest
. Start at 3 sets of 3. Build up to 3 x 30
. Advanced:

1. Raise legs to 90 degrees & bring them towards you when you situp (double crunch)
2. Legs nearly flat on the floor
3. One leg bent at 90 degrees, the other held straight 1" above the floor
4. Hold a weight disc / dumbbells / barbell above your head

Angled Situps
. Lie on your back and rest one ankle on the opposite knee
. Angled situp so your opposite elbow touches the knee
. Keep the other hand be in the air by your knee, or alternatively supporting your head - do NOT pull on the neck
. Build up to 3 sets of 20 each side
. Advanced:

1. with dumbell
2. Situps with legs rotated 90 degrees to the left, resting on floor. Then repeat set with legs rotated to the right, on floor
3. Lie on the floor, rotate legs 90 degrees to the left. Raise and lower legs like that, keeping back on the floor. Repeat set with legs on other side
4. Keep legs raised & rotated to the left and do situps (double side crunch) Repeat with legs raised & rotated to the right

AVOID OSTEOPOROSIS

To retain bone strength and avoid a painfully disabled old age, start now:
Ideally weight-bearing exercises that load the bone along its length of these types:

Impact exercise E.g. walking, running, jumping, skipping rope, step class, hitting a heavy punch bag

Lifting: squats, press-ups, bench press, overhead press etc

Squats are much better for osteoporosis than lunges, also for knees:
The weight in a squat is transmitted down along the spine, through the hip, and down along the bones of the leg, whereas in a lunge, it is transmitted across the shinbone and puts pressure on the knee joint

Cycling normally does NOT increase bone density, as it does not load bones along their length. Osteo

KETTLEBELLS Kettle
Beginners:
. Two-handed swing
. Sumo Deadlift
. Turkish Getup
. Swing
. Clean and Jerk
. Press

Improve GRIP STRENGTH GripStrength , GripBuild

RUNNERS

. Sprinting improves fitness
. Regular 5 - 10 km runs burn significant fat, especially fasted

Running illustrates the "J or S-curve" effect, where increasing exercise improves health, up to a certain point, after which health worsens e.g. MayoClinic , RiceUni , JMed :

. Running 20 mins improves immune system

. A run of 90+ mins may weaken the immune system for up to 3 days.
With insufficient recovery periods, the damage is cumulative.
Elite runners have immune systems that handle that strain

. Long races 20k+ may cause micro-tears to the heart muscle in some runners, hence a 2-week recovery period is recommended.

CALCULATORS:
Calories Burned for specific exercises: ExerciseCals
Fitness Calculators: 52FastExercise
Estimate fitness age: FitAge
Estimate Vo2Max iTunes App: Vo2APP
Running Calories burned: RunningCals
Running Standards: Age-RelatedRunCalculator
TDEE 24hr activity times & body fat TDEE-Detail

More new joiners! Great stuff. If a fitter you is what you're looking for - you've come to the right place.

I'm a step nearer my 2nd press up challenge (the first being to try and out-do my son in how many press ups we can each do in 1 minute), which is to raise money for a couple of local charities* by doing lots of press ups in a limited time.

I've just done 500 press ups in under 25 minutes! [smug]

I did them in sets of 20 - every minute, on the minute.

So:
20 press ups by 00.20
40 by 01.20
Etc, etc, etc.

It was quite encouraging to find that each set consistently took me between 18 and 21 seconds.

But I have to admit that the last couple of sets were a struggle. My goal was to complete the task under 25 minutes - so instead of starting the last set at 24 minutes, I gave myself another 30 seconds recovery, and finished at 24.51.

I don't think it's unreasonable to set a goal of 1000 in under an hour within the next couple of months. Then I'll need to decide on what the best money-raising target would be.

Suggestions gratefully received - I'm thinking something like:

"78-year-old attempts 1000 press ups in less than one hour! Sponsor him at 1p per press up!"

*YMCA and St Margaret's Hospice.

well done B&W

i've not been posting for a bit as i'm dealing with side effects and stuff but i have continued trying to improve my strength etc and finally after not being able to do even one i can now do ten PROPER push ups! i spent a long time doing more and more counter push ups and feeling that 'line' and how engaged my abs were and gradually building up strength that way. tested the other day if i could do proper ones yet and managed a few, then a few more etc.

so 3 sets of ten push ups and i suppose now i actually believe that strength does improve with persistence and things are accomplishable.

So is the idea of the fat blasts, that you do them daily? Just interested really

Today the plan is Tabata fat blast - star jumps

2 x 15 seconds plank

attempt pressups - not straight after the plank!! Last time I tried, I could partially do a full one, just couldn't get fully down into it - so nearly there!

I haven't had time to read the thread - but could I chip in a question anyway? (Thank in advance!!)

I have 20 kg to lose.

I lost 8kg in a month doing 4:3.

Now I've plateaued for 2 weeks. A bit pissed off.

I'm not eating hugely healthy on off days - but not binging either - just grabbing bits where I can to fit into super busy time for me (plus been poorly). Finding the fast days pretty straightforward.

know I should start building in the exercise - but it's a demand too far atm with all the other stuff I'm juggling.

... Any tips...?

Wow Honey Badger there is hope for me yet!
Excellent idea B&W

My exercise plans have gone totally awry as I severely sprained my ankle on saturday, and it's now in a cast for 2 weeks at least. I'm not supposed to put any weight on it at all. It's really frustrating as I was just getting into a routine with my exercise and starting to see some results.

I had a go this morning seeing what I could do without putting any weight on that leg, and came up with a few leg lifts and upper body stuff with dumbells, but it's pretty frustrating. Also I'm a bit nervous of getting up off the floor if I do mat exercises, don't want to overbalance.

does the leg have to be elevated then? was trying to think if there's anyway you could do tricep dips but i guess the leg would be resting on the floor if you did.

try not to think badly of it and see it as a real opportunity to work on upper body strength with lots of dumbell stuff?

and yes definitely hope for you - i honestly thought i'd never be able to do it.

Bounced You are doing really well with cardio exercise, 3 runs per werk plus walking is excellent.

Yes, sign up for your total body conditioning class - it sounds like it should be strength training for all the muscle groups. Try it, but if it turns out to be more cardio, or nearly all lower body, then I recommend a lifting class, say pump or circuits.

You need to build the upper body, so if you can't find a class, just go and lift barbells / dumbbells on your own - pressups, tricep dips, rows, bench press, standing press.

MrD I recommend you do 20-30 min sessions of the same lifting as Bounced see sentence above. 1-2 x weekly would be ideal.
Women often forget upper body strength training, but it is important for a balanced bod.
The moonwalking will really be working your lower bod, so that doesn't need any more.

Tabata should be at most one per day, on 5 days per week. You can start with 3 days and build up. (If you feel you can do more sessions, then you need to work harder in the Tabata you do)

That's brilliant, HoneyBadger You are obviously one of those who can improve very quickly with exercise - people have different degrees of response. Your bod clearly thrives on it.

Super target, B&W Better to request sponsorship for effort rather than a pass/ fail for 1,000 (you could pull a muscle and have to stop). Also, it adds to the excitement when the grand total isn't fixed.

I suggest, "Sponsor this 78-yr-old for 1hr of pressups, 1p per pressup - warning: I'm aiming for 1,000 !"

Sputnik Don't put any weight on that foot - so don't exercise standing up.

Sitting on a stable bench / chair:
Shoulder press, biceps curl, side raise, front raise

Lying down on a bench / bed / mat:
Bench press - sets of wide and narrow, tricep press, pullover
Abs: situps - front & angled, leg raises

Hi RaniyaFi
Intake is 80-90% of weight loss for nearly all women, even those who work out.

Plateauing can just be your body is adjusting after weight loss and will resume when ready.
However, it is often because you are eating back the FD deficit on NFDs - easily done even on 4:3, especially if you have a lowish TDEE.

I recommend you mfp for a full week, to check you have a decent weekly deficit - calculate your TDEE for sedentary, to see what you should be eating on NFDs for a good rate of loss.

People usually get better results with weight loss if they eat meals instead of snacking / grazing

Snacking keeps insulin levels raised all the time and hinders fat burning. Calories can also mount up to much more than you think.

Exercise is great for health, but usually won't help weight if you eat back calories. So, make sure you don't increase intake.
if you are pushed for time, I recommend one of the 20-min workout DVDs or YouTube. Shred helps many folk.
Also, to help any metabolic issue: add in a 4-minute HIIT Fat Blast or Tabata, see list in the OP

Dogsmom Yes, you can do consecutive FDs, what we call b2b. If you do so, you can increase FD cals to 650
If you weigh daily, you'll probably see a zigzag as your stomach empties on FDs and refills on NFDs. However, the overall weekly trend should be downwards, e.g. monitor weight the morning after the 2nd FD of the week.

All you need to know is in the OP of the main 5:2 thread - best to go there for 5:2 support, because this is the exercise thread and may scare you with pressup records is less busy.

Calculate your TDEE - calculator in the OP on the main thread - and aim to stay within this on NFDs. Otherwise, you'll be eating back the FD deficit.
Some folk naturally eat within TDEE; others became overweight by eating more than their body burns, so need to train themselves via mfp.

Thanks! It turns out the class is only for over 50s (which I'm not!) but there's a high intensity exercise class on at the same time that I'm going to try tomorrow. If that doesn't seem right I can look for pump or circuits.

I'm a bit reluctant to try much upper body stuff as I have RSI in my wrists (can't get them in press up position without pain) but if I can find a class like the ones you recommend with an instructor who can adapt stuff so I don't set my wrists off again, then that would be doable.

Ok - I've just had a go and managed 5 hand release pressups! I can see how they will definitely help me get back to doing them To think I used to be the mad woman doing 100 crunch situps / 50 pushups morning and night - FOR FUN (and my karate training but still!)

Wow, what an inspirational thread! Thanks for the excellent OP BigChoc.

I stumbled across this while trying to work out how to re-start my weight loss and do something with the extra energy I've discovered. I've lost 4.5kg this year but have stalled for the past 3 weeks. I'm on a LCHF diet with 16:8 fasting but might switch to 5:2 as I tried a day's fast and it really wasn't so bad.

In 2012 I ran a half marathon in under 2hrs, walked 100km in 24 hrs and (in a normal week) ran 2 x 5k and 1 x 10k as well as a couple of sessions on the rowing machine. I was as fit as I needed to be. Now I have a toddler and am still 10.5kg above where I want to be, and can barely jog 100m.

I love my rowing machine and was wondering whether it would be a good idea to get some basic fitness back with HIIT sessions on that? My daughter doesn't sleep much during the day so I need something I can do quickly and that will build my core strength up so that I can face getting back out to run...

Is it possible to do HIIT on a rower and would it be literally 2 mins warmup, 4 mins at 90% then a 2 min cooldown? Do I need to monitor HR and make sure I don't exceed the theoretical limit?

Any indoor rowers out there who can advise, please?

Hello! I'm trying to work my way up to doing 5:2 properly but in the meantime I want to incorporate some HIIT in my routine, specifically before a yoga or Pilates class during the week - is it possible on conventional gym machines? My concern is that it will take so long to increase the resistance that the interval effect will be lost.
Thank you!

Welcome, Cecile You can set a medium resistance on either a rowing machine or a stationary bike, then just do flatout sprints alternating with much slower recovery speed.

Alternatives for an HIIT warmup:
Rope skipping, sets of burpees, jumping jacks, spotty dog, pressups, squats, lunges.

Gald you like the OP info, Muppet
You had a high standard of fitness before DC and you can regain this.

Yes, you can do a Fat Blast with your rowing machine:

Set the resistance to medium, then warmup and cooldown are slow, whereas your 4 mins need to be maximum effort.
You should be unable to talk, but not working so hard that you feel unwell. If you run out of puff after 2 minutes, you can always have a minute slow recovery and do a 2nd 2 minute set.

I've never bothered to monitor HR and I'll be 60 this summer. I don't row, but I box, lift, spin and include some HIIT in all these.

To mix it up, you can also do Tabata with the exercises I listed for Cecile above. Skipping is brilliant for building fitness.

Fat Blasts are great for correcting metabolic issues and building fitness quickly, but to burn calories I suggest you also do some 45 min sessions, which can be HIIT, but at a lower intensity.

HIIT & Fat Blasts - the Difference

These are only for people without major health issues. Consult your GP if in doubt.
Newbies should gradually build up intensity & frequency of exercise.

The standard HIIT you do in a gym class is usually 45-60 mins, e.g. circuits, pump, kettlebells, some martial arts or spin classes.
This is excellent both for building fitness and burning calories.
Such sessions should not normally be done more than 3-4 times weekly, or on consecutive days, because your CV system needs the recovery days to avoid over-stresing.

You can alternate HIIT days with days on which you lift weights or do strength exercises, but slower, NOT crossfit or pump style lifts.

Everyone: Have at least one day per week when you do NO training
(you can optionally go for a relaxing walk, easy pace & distance, nothing more demanding)

"Fat Blasts" e.g. Tabata are the most concentrated form of HIIT / HIT.

Fat Blasts don't last long enough to burn many calories, but can correct issues with insulin metabolism that might be blocking weight loss.
They also increase fitness levels very quickly.

However, they are very tough, so should only be done for a few minutes per day, on at most 5 days per week.

You can optionally do them on the same day as a lifting or running session, or just as your only exercise that day.

i may brave a look at this tabata business.

I suggest, "Sponsor this 78-yr-old for 1hr of pressups, 1p per pressup - warning: I'm aiming for 1,000 !"

That's a superb idea, BC!

It's very motivating when you can see progress practically every time you train!

I did my 200 weighted press ups on Thursday in 11.11 - in 11 sets, as it happens!

I did the first 100 in five sets of 20, one set every minute; then I went to sets of 17 every 1.10. I felt as if I could have gone on for quite a bit longer. I'll have another go tonight, and just keep going.

17 every minute is the goal - that would give me 1000 in an hour. If I could do that weighted, that would give me tons of leeway when I do it without the weight.

insane in the membrane - insane in the brain

i've had a couple of slack days but ds is back to school tomorrow (sundays are our mondays here in the ME) and i'll get on it with my push ups and tricep dips and squats etc.

Had my first muscle ache in quite a while this morning.

Yesterday I did 200 weighted press ups straight off in sets of 20 - for the first time. Took me 9 mins and 21 seconds - and the last few of each of the later sets were hard!

Tomorrow I'm going for 60 in one minute. I'll be seeing my son over Easter - I'll be ready to hit him with the challenge then. Can't wait!

How's everyone else doing? This thread's gone very quiet!

wowsa b&w - you are hardcore!

I'm good thanks, doing my tabata regularly, as well as some glute exercises given by my sports massage therapist (who's doing her best to keep me uninjured for the moonwalk!) and still working on the pushups / plank... I won't let them defeat me!

It helps that every week there is less of me to push up

That's very impressive, B&W
Feeling the burn indicates you are making progress: the loading produces microtears in the muscle fibres, which will be rebuilt stronger during your rest days.

Do have at least one day, maybe 2 between upper body sessions. You can do your cardio Tabata, or work your lower body.
I found after 500 pressups that my abs were sore, because they are a key oart of holding the body rigid. So, rest abs when you rest upper body.

You could feed your son Easter eggs before the challenge No, you want the satisfaction of beating him fairly.

Very good progress for you too, MrD
Those Tabata and pressups will really help you return to your former fitness, as you continue to shrink down the bmi scale.
Check out the 2 minute WorkYourBum video in the OP, in the BUM / GLUTES section.

Yes, well done, MrD!

I've still got an ache in my right shoulder, so I'll take another day off today - I'm much more relaxed about exercise-free days now, since I've noticed that many of my PBs have come after several days lay-off.

You could feed your son Easter eggs before the challenge. No, you want the satisfaction of beating him fairly.

That gave me a chuckle, BC!

I'm a believer in "active" recovery for the muscles, so on my training rest days I have a relaxed walk or cycle outside.
Psychologically relaxing too - walking is supposed to help the "command and control" area of your brain, especially in our later years